Comments on: Wall Street Journal report on college admissions names two Oakland high schools

By: Head-Royce Alumni

Head-Royce Alumni — Mon, 31 Dec 2007 09:17:04 +0000

As a current college student and alumni of Head-Royce I would just like to make a few comments. 1. CPS student is right, both school have considerably large endowments and make very large efforts to bring in lower income families(my three best friends were all former students who had financial aid). 2. Another point I would like to make is that although skyline and other schools are getting students into elite colleges they are not getting anywhere close to even 60% of their students into college at all. Of course at a certain size school there are going to be people smart enough to go to great schools. 3. What also matters and is not discussed at all is the amount of collegiate preparation students of the private schools get. Though i make no sweeping generalizations, it is often the case that while I do homework for significantly less hours than my public high school classmates, I get better grades and am more competent in collegiate level classes. There are many things that seem very simple to me which other people have no idea about, like how to form an essay or a thesis.

By: CPS student

CPS student — Fri, 28 Dec 2007 11:52:00 +0000

Hi everyone,
(please post this message instead of the previous one I sent)

As someone who graduated from College Prep just a few years ago, I’d like to set the record straight about tuition and financial iad. Despite what appears to be the case, it is certainly possible to attend a school like CPS and Head Royce without having to spend a fortune. Yes, full tuition is quite high, but many students do receive need-based financial aid and some even get a full ride. CPS strongly encourages low-income students to apply and makes every effort to help them financially. This does not refute the broader point made by Sharon that family background is an intrinsic confound to college matriculation; I am simply saying that the financial situation is not as extreme as it has been portrayed.

I’d be happy to hear any further thoughts.

By: Caroline

Caroline — Fri, 14 Dec 2007 00:48:32 +0000

Great post, Pamela!

I’m sharing, with permission, a commentary by a San Francisco parent of a kindergartner that started out on one blog and that I reposted on my blog (my commentary included here):

***
The fantastic new blog TheSFKFiles chronicles a parent’s intensive search for schools and has attracted amazingly lively and thoughtful readers — most of them terrific writers, too. There has been a lot of discussion of the morality and values involved in choosing private school over public (these mostly being parents in the demographic that’s likely to consider private). One anonymous poster who has been looking at both public and private made this comment, which just awed me. I’m reposting it with permission:

“Instead of looking at what is right in front of us right now, I hit the fast-forward button and tried to think about what I wanted my children to learn from their childhood — when the tumultuous teen years and the invincible college years are over, what will they say about the lessons and the values that they learned as children? And then it was crystal clear: What I care about most is instilling a sense of justice, fairness and a commitment to bettering society. Yes, my children may be the most important people in the world to me, but let us not confuse that with thinking that they are the most important people in the world. And with that, we wiped the private schools off the table as inherently inconsistent with our core values.”

http://www.sfschools.org/2007/12/parents-comment-on-private-school.html

http://www.thesfkfiles.blogspot.com/

By: Pamela

Pamela — Thu, 13 Dec 2007 23:54:48 +0000

As a parent of a current Skyline student, I must say that I find this discussion refreshing.
My son has attended both private(k-5), Charter(6-8) and now public school in Oakland.
I must say, that I did not want him to attend skyline. My intent was to send him back to
private school. My thought was that he was too smart to go to a sub standard school like
skyline. It was actually my brother who made a very important comment to me. He stated
that my son needed to “Learn” some thing. That it wasn’t just about his academics, but
also about his ability to work with all types of people. He also stated that the major reason
why a child succeds in school is because he has his parents support. He needs to learn how
to ride the bus home with people who don’t look or act like him. He needs to learn how to
make choices about weather or not to smoke weed or cut class. He needs to have some
of his perceptions about people challenged, and even changed. And I must say that he
was, for the most part, correct. It has been a really tough semester. Lots of changes. My
comfort zone has be dismantled. He has had some tough moments. However, if you ask
him if he likes his school, he would tell you in a minute that he loves it. He has been to
football games, and dances, plays and club meetings. He has come in contact with children
who think like him and children who would not do there homework if you paid them to.
I have learned that high school, even with all of it’s changes, is still just high school. It
is what you make of it.

By: Caroline

Caroline — Thu, 13 Dec 2007 17:21:52 +0000

An Oakland parent posted on the sfschools.org blog that there’s now discussion of whether
to start a Parents for Public Schools chapter in Oakland. Cool!

It’s worth noting that PPSSF has grant funding and paid staff, which has been key in making
it so effective. I assume that the national PPS organization provided both support and credibility
in securing grants, as well as the structure needed to operate the local chapter on that scale.

For anyone interested, the website is http://www.ppssf.org

By: Caroline

Caroline — Thu, 13 Dec 2007 16:11:50 +0000

I’m not endorsing OUSD’s changing its assignment system, just to be clear. I’m an
outsider and would be out of line to make any such suggestion!

I’m just pointing out that with an all-choice assignment system, SFUSD is pretty clearly
functioning better (I might even say far better) than OUSD, so the facts don’t show
that a mandatory neighborhood assignment system benefits the district overall. It does
obviously benefit the lucky folks who want their neighborhood school. If I were in that
situation I’m sure I’d fight for it too, but with guilt pangs, since it’s so very shortsighted.

In our family’s case, my oldest was initially assigned to our neighborhood school, which we did
not want — it had a principal who practically had DEADWOOD tatooed across his forehead,
and was generally not functioning well. We fought through the appeals process (in a former
incarnation of the SFUSD assignment system) to get a school we did want. This was 1996. Then
our younger got in via sibling preference. However, we did request our neighborhood middle
school, Aptos, and both my kids have gone through that school — my younger is now in 8th
grade. So, I have experience with both situations.

Good news for kids, families and the school district is that our neighborhood school, the one we had to fight to get out of, is now very successful and popular (Miraloma Elementary, for the record).

By: Hills Neighborhood Mom

Hills Neighborhood Mom — Wed, 12 Dec 2007 23:41:23 +0000

There is hardly any chance of transferring into one of the good hills schools in Oakland. For OUSD to tout their “options program” really does seem unfair to a lot of non-neighborhood families. The option to transfer to Hillcrest, Thornhill, Montclair, Joaquin Miller, Redwood Heights, Crocker Highlands, etc is probably very very limited and getting harder each year. There are a handful of other good or up-and-coming schools that may offer more spaces. I don’t know but perhaps schools like Glenview or Kaiser or Peralta? But they will probably start to fill up with neighborhood kids too, in time, as they garner more neighborhood support.

So where does that leave most of the other Oakland residents? With pretty crummy options. There are so many schools that are performing at a very low level.

But I can tell you that if OUSD tried to implement a lottery-style enrollment program in Oakland than it would fail. Most of the hills residents with their high-performing students would simply flee – move or go private. There is just too great a disparity between the good schools and the poor schools and I would not accept something in the middle. My education aspirations for my child are mucher higher than that.

I think that some of the unique offerings, like language immersion, at some of the SF schools are a big draw. Something like that might be worth a longer drive. But, for the most part, if you live within the boundaries of a good school or if you could walk up the street to a school that you wanted your child to attend – and you couldn’t get in – then you might be pretty angry or frustrated.

By: left oakland

left oakland — Wed, 12 Dec 2007 22:13:12 +0000

Hills Neighborhood Mom: I would like to share my experience and perception of the SF school assignment system as a prospective elementary school parent.

I know the assignment system seems rife with uncertainty and chance; however, the statistics are very much in favor of getting one of your choices (for elementary school, it’s 87% get one of their choices and 67% get their first choice). I have to say school choice has been a boon for us in providing a sense of opportunity. There are very many good schools to choose from, each with their unique aspects including many bilingual language immersion programs. We have visited 15 schools so far and I would have no problem sending our child to at least 12 of them with no feeling of “settling”. And none of these schools are “across town.” I believe school choice provides opportunity and equity in providing fair access to good schools regardless of which neighborhood a family might be able to afford. As I understand it, there are a healthy number of students coming from neighborhoods at least at the elementary school level. It’s also been interesting to see the effect the process has had on individual schools. I may be completely off base, but it seems to me the process has bolstered the PTA’s and principals at emerging schools to build and strengthen their programs so that they will attract like-minded dedicated parents and families.

I am very curious to see what effect, if any, limited school choice will have within OUSD. When we left Oakland, we felt our options were too limited. Even though we had PI priority transfer status (neighborhood school was in PI), transfer options felt too limited with what seemed at the time, not enough good schools from which to choose, especially with the hills schools being overenrolled. The process also seemed very chaotic since it was newly implemented. Since having moved, we have been encouraged to hear about up and coming schools in various neighborhoods that are not the 8-10 hills schools you always hear about. It seems to me absolute school choice within OUSD would not be feasible; however, I am hopeful limited school choice will have positive effects at some schools.

By: Hills Neighborhood Mom

Hills Neighborhood Mom — Wed, 12 Dec 2007 19:48:59 +0000

Caroline, with all due respect, if you have never lived in a neighborhood and been part of a neighborhood school, then perhaps you can’t understand the benefits of such a community. You could offer me a spot at a higher-ranking school that is further away and I wouldn’t take it. My hills school is a good school, but what makes it a great experience is that we live very close by and can attend school with our friends and neighbors.

In addition to the tight community, I love not having to commute to school. I know people who do drive their children here and there and it can take about a hour or two out of their day! I don’t have to do that and instead can spend that extra time with my children or doing things that are important to me. Neighborhood schools work on many levels!

Aside from that, not everyone likes the uncertainty of a lottery or the excitement of dozens of prospects. I am perfectly comfortable skipping the choice and just going with our neighborhood school.

By: Caroline

Caroline — Wed, 12 Dec 2007 17:17:12 +0000

I know, Hills Mom, it sounds like that in theory. But only a minority of SFUSD families list their neighborhood school as their first choice. With a wider range of attractive options than perhaps Oakland families have, many San Francisco families find schools outside their neighborhoods appealing. It’s a compact city, so we’re not talking great distances anyway.

There are certainly loud voices in San Francisco clamoring for guaranteed assignment to
neighborhood schools, which also equates with mandatory assignment to neighborhood
schools. But as I say, the numbers speak for themselves.

When schools vary widely in quality, naturally enough, people who live near desirable
schools want mandatory neighborhood assignment and people who live near unpopular
schools don’t. The people who live near desirable schools tend to be wealthier, needless
to say. To me it seems pretty difficult for a person of conscience to demand mandatory
neighborhood schools in that case. But I’m not telling any other district what I think it
should do. It seems pretty clear that San Francisco’s schools are functioning better than
Oakland’s overall, though. If you actually moved from SF to Oakland for the schools,
I hope it all worked out for the best, but moving for that reason was unnecessary, I
can assure you. (My kids are in 8th and 11th grades in SFUSD schools, so I have plenty
of kid-years as an involved SFUSD parent to base that on.)