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	<title>Comments on: Oakland&#8217;s API: Big gains, bigger achievement gaps</title>
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	<link>http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/2009/09/15/oaklands-api-big-gains-bigger-achievement-gaps/</link>
	<description>Katy Murphy&#039;s blog on Oakland schools</description>
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		<title>By: Chauncey</title>
		<link>http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/2009/09/15/oaklands-api-big-gains-bigger-achievement-gaps/comment-page-1/#comment-22231</link>
		<dc:creator>Chauncey</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Sep 2009 05:35:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/?p=6570#comment-22231</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Caroline- OCA is over 90% Latino in the Fruitvale yet score higher than schools in Orinda? Why not acknowledge that?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Caroline- OCA is over 90% Latino in the Fruitvale yet score higher than schools in Orinda? Why not acknowledge that?</p>
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		<title>By: Nextset</title>
		<link>http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/2009/09/15/oaklands-api-big-gains-bigger-achievement-gaps/comment-page-1/#comment-22230</link>
		<dc:creator>Nextset</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Sep 2009 19:18:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/?p=6570#comment-22230</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Caroline:  You have a point - but understand that when a good school creates an environment where the families believe their children are safe from both crime and immorality -  this is where brights, especially poorer brights will be enrolled.

The environment of AIPCS is deliberately set to run off undesirable people - those who don&#039;t want to study learn or do any homework. People who don&#039;t want to behave and obey authority can&#039;t hack it there either. It&#039;s a similar thing that the Catholic Schools had in the flats of Oakland in the 1960s.  Trash of any color wouldn&#039;t think of trying to go there, there&#039;d be hell to pay.

So it is because of the school that the scores are high, because of the school that the collection of bright students are there at all. Chavis&#039; created a place where all this action could take place.  OUSD creates places where disfunctional people can move in and make themselves at home. And woe be to the teachers that try to change them or stop them.

So we do give &quot;credit&quot; to good schools, even though their students would do well wherever they went and whoever taught them.

I do believe you can add value to students especially the middling ones and even the poor dull ones.  I think it takes increasing more energy to add value to the poor dull ones. I have seen energetic teachers in my life though.

Brave New World.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Caroline:  You have a point &#8211; but understand that when a good school creates an environment where the families believe their children are safe from both crime and immorality &#8211;  this is where brights, especially poorer brights will be enrolled.</p>
<p>The environment of AIPCS is deliberately set to run off undesirable people &#8211; those who don&#8217;t want to study learn or do any homework. People who don&#8217;t want to behave and obey authority can&#8217;t hack it there either. It&#8217;s a similar thing that the Catholic Schools had in the flats of Oakland in the 1960s.  Trash of any color wouldn&#8217;t think of trying to go there, there&#8217;d be hell to pay.</p>
<p>So it is because of the school that the scores are high, because of the school that the collection of bright students are there at all. Chavis&#8217; created a place where all this action could take place.  OUSD creates places where disfunctional people can move in and make themselves at home. And woe be to the teachers that try to change them or stop them.</p>
<p>So we do give &#8220;credit&#8221; to good schools, even though their students would do well wherever they went and whoever taught them.</p>
<p>I do believe you can add value to students especially the middling ones and even the poor dull ones.  I think it takes increasing more energy to add value to the poor dull ones. I have seen energetic teachers in my life though.</p>
<p>Brave New World.</p>
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		<title>By: Caroline</title>
		<link>http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/2009/09/15/oaklands-api-big-gains-bigger-achievement-gaps/comment-page-1/#comment-22229</link>
		<dc:creator>Caroline</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Sep 2009 19:03:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/?p=6570#comment-22229</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Then how can you praise American Indian Public Charter School for achieving &quot;miracles&quot; based not on doing &quot;something magical&quot; but on &quot;demographic statistical change&quot;?

When it comes to charter schools, people are fooled all the time by test score improvements connected with demographic statistical change. And not only are those people fooled, they (along with cynical manipulators who are dishonest rather than fooled) also angrily denounce the non-fooled who point out the real reasons for the &quot;improvements.&quot;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Then how can you praise American Indian Public Charter School for achieving &#8220;miracles&#8221; based not on doing &#8220;something magical&#8221; but on &#8220;demographic statistical change&#8221;?</p>
<p>When it comes to charter schools, people are fooled all the time by test score improvements connected with demographic statistical change. And not only are those people fooled, they (along with cynical manipulators who are dishonest rather than fooled) also angrily denounce the non-fooled who point out the real reasons for the &#8220;improvements.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Nextset</title>
		<link>http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/2009/09/15/oaklands-api-big-gains-bigger-achievement-gaps/comment-page-1/#comment-22228</link>
		<dc:creator>Nextset</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Sep 2009 16:53:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/?p=6570#comment-22228</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Do the readers remember the controversy in Pasedena (I think it was Pasedena) where a Teacher named Phelps wrote a memo to his co-workers discussing an upcoming plan to set teacher pay by student performance? He pointed out that the school in question was facing a demographic shift and would be receiving a large number (percentage shift) of new black students. By accepting the proposed pay scheme the bargaining unit was certain to take a pay cut because any shift in demographics towards black students statistically guarantees falling scores. For this heresy he was suspended until legal action or political action forced the school district to back down. It was an uncomfortable truth.

By the same token, some OUSD schools are facing a demographic shift away from black students.  I&#039;m not going to fall down and congratulate anyone because their scores are going up. At least until it is shown that the change in scores is not merely explained by the change in demographics.

I may be the skunk at the garden party - but...  Nobody with any experience and research is going to be fooled by patently expected demographic statistical  change at OUSD. Maybe the teachers did something magical and probably they didn&#039;t. We have to see.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Do the readers remember the controversy in Pasedena (I think it was Pasedena) where a Teacher named Phelps wrote a memo to his co-workers discussing an upcoming plan to set teacher pay by student performance? He pointed out that the school in question was facing a demographic shift and would be receiving a large number (percentage shift) of new black students. By accepting the proposed pay scheme the bargaining unit was certain to take a pay cut because any shift in demographics towards black students statistically guarantees falling scores. For this heresy he was suspended until legal action or political action forced the school district to back down. It was an uncomfortable truth.</p>
<p>By the same token, some OUSD schools are facing a demographic shift away from black students.  I&#8217;m not going to fall down and congratulate anyone because their scores are going up. At least until it is shown that the change in scores is not merely explained by the change in demographics.</p>
<p>I may be the skunk at the garden party &#8211; but&#8230;  Nobody with any experience and research is going to be fooled by patently expected demographic statistical  change at OUSD. Maybe the teachers did something magical and probably they didn&#8217;t. We have to see.</p>
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		<title>By: Chauncey</title>
		<link>http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/2009/09/15/oaklands-api-big-gains-bigger-achievement-gaps/comment-page-1/#comment-22227</link>
		<dc:creator>Chauncey</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Sep 2009 15:27:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/?p=6570#comment-22227</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I want to congratulate TCN as it made great strides. Finally, an OUSD school in the flatlands makes it happen. To be honest, it does not matter to me how it is done so as long as it produces results.

As for Sharon, your blogger source for the infor on OCA is lame!

&quot;Teachers stand in front &quot; where the heck should the stand, in the back?

Sharon- why dont you just visit the school? I did, and it is great. I do not know of the tracking and all that, i look at the results. and I know what Oaklanders say , do the means justify the ends- well just ask yourself, where will these kids end up without an education?

Way to go Mr. Silver!! Keep it up, and hope they dont reassign you!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I want to congratulate TCN as it made great strides. Finally, an OUSD school in the flatlands makes it happen. To be honest, it does not matter to me how it is done so as long as it produces results.</p>
<p>As for Sharon, your blogger source for the infor on OCA is lame!</p>
<p>&#8220;Teachers stand in front &#8221; where the heck should the stand, in the back?</p>
<p>Sharon- why dont you just visit the school? I did, and it is great. I do not know of the tracking and all that, i look at the results. and I know what Oaklanders say , do the means justify the ends- well just ask yourself, where will these kids end up without an education?</p>
<p>Way to go Mr. Silver!! Keep it up, and hope they dont reassign you!</p>
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		<title>By: Chava</title>
		<link>http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/2009/09/15/oaklands-api-big-gains-bigger-achievement-gaps/comment-page-1/#comment-22226</link>
		<dc:creator>Chava</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Sep 2009 06:00:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/?p=6570#comment-22226</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[People need to sneak and visit at Fremont school not here. That school is to dangerus

Mr. Lopez came in 2004 when my son was in a 7th grade. He did not enroll the kids that year, Mr. G and Aguilar did, but that was the year OCA jumped 100 points.

Another thing is that Lopez is not even at the schools anymore. There are other leaders.

You guys should visit. They will host you- they are so open that even spies get in. Best thing to do is go and see. I will ask my son and daughter to give you a tour.

you can respons here.

Good job oca and oakland.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>People need to sneak and visit at Fremont school not here. That school is to dangerus</p>
<p>Mr. Lopez came in 2004 when my son was in a 7th grade. He did not enroll the kids that year, Mr. G and Aguilar did, but that was the year OCA jumped 100 points.</p>
<p>Another thing is that Lopez is not even at the schools anymore. There are other leaders.</p>
<p>You guys should visit. They will host you- they are so open that even spies get in. Best thing to do is go and see. I will ask my son and daughter to give you a tour.</p>
<p>you can respons here.</p>
<p>Good job oca and oakland.</p>
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		<title>By: Sharon</title>
		<link>http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/2009/09/15/oaklands-api-big-gains-bigger-achievement-gaps/comment-page-1/#comment-22225</link>
		<dc:creator>Sharon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Sep 2009 16:27:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/?p=6570#comment-22225</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[John P. Glover: A teacher who works at another school in the neighborhood and visited the Oakland Charter Academy School posted this comment on a listserv to which I belong:

&quot;The Oakland Charter School middle school in the Fruitvale district has been creaming for successful students since Chavis&#039; protégé, &quot;King&quot; Jorge Lopez took it over about 5 years ago. Problem is that no witnesses have come forward yet. The mostly Latino immigrant parents in the neighborhood struggle to get their kids in, because the local district middle schools are so unsafe, so they&#039;re not inclined to snitch on Oakland Charter. I&#039;ve heard stories of Jorge demanding to see potential enrollees&#039; 5th grade test scores, and telling parents that this or that child is &quot;not qualified&quot; to get in.

[X] and I toured the school 2 1/2 years ago (they didn&#039;t know who we were), and saw lots of fear in kids&#039; faces. It was similar to the West Oakland KIPP school: quiet and joyless like a minimum security prison. In both schools, the teachers we got to observe did &quot;front of the room&quot; lecture as kids sat and listened (or pretended to listen). In the Fruitvale school, I noticed that some kids had still not reached full English proficiency and looked confused as teachers babbled in English.&quot;

I&#039;m personally less interested in the classroom description than I am in the details of how this school engages in tracking, something which traditional schools are legally barred from doing. I vote for undercover work to root out the practices at these American Indian Model schools.

OCA has been operating for years. Is there any source of verifiable information about what its graduates have ended up doing?

Also, this story confirms what I see as the biggest issue for parents when choosing a school: safety and school climate.

OUSD owes it to Oakland&#039;s families to come up with an innovative breakthrough in this regard. I just know things can be made better, but it will require the Superintendent and the School Board to be brave and start to think out-of-the-box.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>John P. Glover: A teacher who works at another school in the neighborhood and visited the Oakland Charter Academy School posted this comment on a listserv to which I belong:</p>
<p>&#8220;The Oakland Charter School middle school in the Fruitvale district has been creaming for successful students since Chavis&#8217; protégé, &#8220;King&#8221; Jorge Lopez took it over about 5 years ago. Problem is that no witnesses have come forward yet. The mostly Latino immigrant parents in the neighborhood struggle to get their kids in, because the local district middle schools are so unsafe, so they&#8217;re not inclined to snitch on Oakland Charter. I&#8217;ve heard stories of Jorge demanding to see potential enrollees&#8217; 5th grade test scores, and telling parents that this or that child is &#8220;not qualified&#8221; to get in.</p>
<p>[X] and I toured the school 2 1/2 years ago (they didn&#8217;t know who we were), and saw lots of fear in kids&#8217; faces. It was similar to the West Oakland KIPP school: quiet and joyless like a minimum security prison. In both schools, the teachers we got to observe did &#8220;front of the room&#8221; lecture as kids sat and listened (or pretended to listen). In the Fruitvale school, I noticed that some kids had still not reached full English proficiency and looked confused as teachers babbled in English.&#8221;</p>
<p>I&#8217;m personally less interested in the classroom description than I am in the details of how this school engages in tracking, something which traditional schools are legally barred from doing. I vote for undercover work to root out the practices at these American Indian Model schools.</p>
<p>OCA has been operating for years. Is there any source of verifiable information about what its graduates have ended up doing?</p>
<p>Also, this story confirms what I see as the biggest issue for parents when choosing a school: safety and school climate.</p>
<p>OUSD owes it to Oakland&#8217;s families to come up with an innovative breakthrough in this regard. I just know things can be made better, but it will require the Superintendent and the School Board to be brave and start to think out-of-the-box.</p>
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		<title>By: Oak261</title>
		<link>http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/2009/09/15/oaklands-api-big-gains-bigger-achievement-gaps/comment-page-1/#comment-22224</link>
		<dc:creator>Oak261</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Sep 2009 05:45:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/?p=6570#comment-22224</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Newbie:  Excuse me, I meant to (rhetorically ) write &quot;We can’t reasonably expect everyone to score 1000 (perfect) even if we keep working at it.&quot;.  My question is, what is the reasonable expectation among experts for OUSD?  Where should we expect things to plateau?  NCLB and other mandates says scores keep having to go up as far as you can look ahead.  Amazing.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Newbie:  Excuse me, I meant to (rhetorically ) write &#8220;We can’t reasonably expect everyone to score 1000 (perfect) even if we keep working at it.&#8221;.  My question is, what is the reasonable expectation among experts for OUSD?  Where should we expect things to plateau?  NCLB and other mandates says scores keep having to go up as far as you can look ahead.  Amazing.</p>
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		<title>By: Katy Murphy</title>
		<link>http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/2009/09/15/oaklands-api-big-gains-bigger-achievement-gaps/comment-page-1/#comment-22223</link>
		<dc:creator>Katy Murphy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Sep 2009 20:40:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/?p=6570#comment-22223</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Yes, I do. I&#039;ll post it right now.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, I do. I&#8217;ll post it right now.</p>
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		<title>By: wondering</title>
		<link>http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/2009/09/15/oaklands-api-big-gains-bigger-achievement-gaps/comment-page-1/#comment-22219</link>
		<dc:creator>wondering</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Sep 2009 20:26:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/?p=6570#comment-22219</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Hi Katy, the list of National Merit Semifinalists came out today.  I am wondering which kids from Oakland made the list and from what schools?  do you have that info? thanks]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Katy, the list of National Merit Semifinalists came out today.  I am wondering which kids from Oakland made the list and from what schools?  do you have that info? thanks</p>
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