An Oakland mom’s take on the dropout rate and Tech’s Paideia program
By Katy Murphy
Tuesday, December 14th, 2010 at 12:20 pm in dropouts, high schools.
Kim Shipp, an OUSD parent, responds to a blog discussion on Oakland’s dropout rate and access to Oakland Tech’s Paideia program.
In response to Oakland’s dropout rate and the increasing popularity of the Paideia program at Oakland Tech, topics recently posted on this blog, I decided to give my thoughts about both issues from a parent’s perspective. In my fifteen years of experience in Oakland schools with three children, I’ve spent two of those years in a private school setting and two of those years in Paideia with my oldest son.
It is no secret that Oakland has one of the highest dropout rates in California. The constant change of leadership over the past 13 years has had a negative impact on the school system. In Oakland’s case this includes nine leaders in the form of superintendents or state administrators; no organization can sustain itself in meeting its goals without stability in leadership. This permeates down to the school level.
Take Skyline High School for example. The graduating class of 2011 will have experienced a new principal in each of their four years of high school. My son spent his first year of high school at Skyline, the next two years at a private school and is now back at Skyline for his final year. This year, when he returned to Skyline, I immediately noticed some stark differences between private and public schools. In a nutshell, private schools care about what they are doing and public schools appear not to. These differences have little to do with money, but rather willingness on the part of adults and how one entity values education over the other.
For example, at Back to School Night, I questioned some teachers in Advanced Placement classes regarding their pass rates on AP exams. To my amazement, most of the teachers did not seem to care whether students passed or failed these tests. One teacher’s response was, “we have about a twenty-five percent pass rate.” When I asked about preparing the students for the tests, another teacher responded, “ we do not do a lot of preparation because most of the students have other things to do in their lives, like work.”
Private schools pride themselves in their pass rates and there is a lot of preparation that goes on in those private schools. In private school, every effort is made to ensure student success. This is done by providing advisory meetings with students to address their issues, the dean working with the teachers, detailed e-mail progress reports of notification to parents, putting parents on weekly progress notification if necessary and even informing the parent when this is no longer necessary.
In public school, progress checks are left up to the parent. There seems to be no conversation taking place between school leadership and teachers regarding individual student progress. In private school, there is a tremendous focus on building relationships between students and staff on the premise that each student is an individual with individual needs. In public school, it’s based more upon performance and everyone is viewed in the same light. In public school teachers are protected. In private school they are not.
Now don’t get me wrong, there were other types of challenges we faced in private school, and as with anything else, it is not a perfect entity, but at least it knows its purpose. The dropout rate will continue until people regain their sense of purpose, build relationships, and take responsibility for student failure. One has to get to the point to believe if the majority of students are failing under their care, than they are failing students.
Paideia is a humanities program created by a group of teachers at Oakland Technical High School. Much like several other programs and teachers in some schools, these programs are more about the individual teachers and their philosophy than the school itself. These teachers are also the protectors of these programs, and the principal and school district officials can do little to intervene, change, expand or open them up to others. Paideia can be viewed as a “free” private school within a public school.
In 2001, my son was the only African-American senior in the program at the time. It came to my attention that a young African-American girl, whose family attended the same church as me, was denied access to the program even though she had the grades coming out of middle school; she had attended Westlake. Many of her friends who had attended Montera were allowed to enroll in Paideia. We brought this issue before the school board and this resulted in several people, including district staff, the principal at the time, the school board representative, myself and other parents, to get more sessions for Paideia on the master schedule so more students could participate. The other parents were at the table because they were debating private school or Tech. This attempt was not without objection from the original creators of the program. I even had one of the teachers call me at home to express her concerns about making it available to more students. The program was expanded to include a few more sessions, but I am not sure if it has expanded more since then. Over the years, other students of color have attempted participation but there are rigorous requirements of course work and here the advanced placement pass rate is cared about. In fact, one could argue that the program is selective because they want to maintain their successful pass rate, which at the time was about 85 percent.
In terms of some of the equity issues addressed in the blog, my definition of equity is “equity is only afforded to those who demand it and know that they need to.” In other words we live in an unjust, unequal society, and as many of the bloggers suggest, “it is in fact what it is.” As a parent, I cannot wait for a system that probably never will correct itself to provide equal opportunity and access. I have to do the best I can for my family and community with what I know.
Education, employment, opportunities, etc., has always been difficult for most groups to obtain and it remains true today. In fact, people forget that this was the basis on which the country was built, keeping the masses enslaved while allowing only the select few prosper. Remember the old adage, “ a people that forgets its history, is destined to repeat it.” We are almost there.
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December 14th, 2010 at 5:30 pm
Ms. Shipp: I’m still digesting your comments and experiences with OUSD. It really helps to have more information posted on parent and students’ experiences at OUSD.
In general are you satisfied with OUSD? What are the pros and cons with putting the children in school elsewhere? What were the factors that compelled you to select the schools you did? Do you believe black children have special issues in school selection? Do you believe OUSD reasonably served your child’s education needs?
A comment: I have little concerns about a school being warm/fuzzy “just & equal” because that’s not what a black child is ever going to live with in the higher ed & job markets and they need to learn how to swim while they are young. The important consideration for me is that the place is merely reasonable and preferably a gladiator school in the sense that it will prepare my black child for a rigourous college and professional/technical school. There are other concerns depending on having a black girl or a black boy also.
But maybe I’m just too worried about getting black kids ready for the Brave New World. It’s a constant struggle to make sure the kid doesn’t get too complacent about what they are going to have to overcome – the schools are too likely to tell the kids to relax and don’t worry.
December 14th, 2010 at 5:46 pm
Thank you.
We will have to see what we choose to do for children who don’t have active parents such as yourself. I hope your children appreciate what you’ve done to create conditions for their success.
December 14th, 2010 at 6:34 pm
Anytime “equity” issues and the whole oppression boo hoo hoo is expressed, I always put out there: Why does the same education system work for the immigrant Asian group and not for your group? (And I won’t mention your group since you didn’t mention the asian group in your blog entry)
We never talk about the elephant in the room. We always talk around it. Let’s just call a spade a spade.
December 14th, 2010 at 6:36 pm
Katy,
Mrs. Kim Shipp brings up some excellet points. What is the percentage of hispanic and blacks students passing
AP English or math exams in OUSD or the charter schools?
Havr you ever looked into this as a story? We always get information about the low students. What about those taking AP?
December 14th, 2010 at 7:42 pm
I assume that just about everyone reading this blog is now aware of OUSD’s outrageously high dropout rate. A number of you have asked what we are doing to end the dropout epidemic. Clearly, we have yet to find a comprehensive solution, but we are treating this trend as one of the most pressing – if not the most critical problem – facing the District. Accordingly, we have implemented several programs designed to reduce the dropout rate and we will continue to analyze the issue in search of additional strategies.
Some, not all, of these strategies will likely evolve from the task force developing recommendations for OUSD’s five-year plan. I won’t go into detail here as you can learn more at http://www.ousd.k12.ca.us/taskforces, but the Core Curriculum, Secondary Experience and Achievement Network and Quality Community Schools Development (QCSD) task forces will be addressing this crisis from different angles while sharing the products of their inquiry.
This work is conducted in the context of advancing the Community Schools, Thriving Students vision and OUSD’s transformation into a full-service community school district.
In this model, a high-quality education is accompanied by health, physical education, nutrition, medical, dental, recreation, housing, employment, and language acquisition services, with the school acting as the hub of activity and an anchor for the neighborhood.
Social and human services are not seen as extra or add-ons in these schools. They are a way to create conditions that allow for high-levels of learning and make schools a more central and compelling part of the lives of students and families – thereby reducing the incentive to dropout or pursue other ill-advised life options,
Within this framework, which will take time to fully develop, we are pursuing various school and classroom-based strategies such as
:
• Engaging all students in rigorous academic courses and work based learning and career technical education, we help them view high school as the launch pad to their futures, rather than a destination.
• Helping students become part of the greater community, and bring the community into the schools through classroom speakers, job shadows and internships.
• Looking at how to change structures in the high schools to keep students engaged and successful longer–which means more credit recovery and more academic interventions.
• This year we established labs at Tech, OHS, Skyline, Castlemont, Mac (Mac and Castlemont’s I believe will start second semester), and Fremont where both high school students and adult students can come on campus and make up courses using Odyssey software. There is a late morning, and early afternoon and a late afternoon session.
• We have increased access for students to CAHSEE Prep through two programs: Revolution Prep (which is an online prep program for students who have not passed CAHSEE) and CAHSEE 380 which is a program for 9th and 10th graders to use as they rev up to take the CAHSEE for the first time.
• We were one of 14 districts in the country awarded a federal Small Learning Communities grant for our three large high schools in October. That is significant–because it provides us with resources (especially at this difficult budget time) to create more personalized conditions at the 3 big high schools. It is imperative that we do a better job of holding students in school–and the 9th and 10th grade are critical.
• We are working closely with the office of College and Career Readiness to increase and strengthen our academy programs, which provide students with work based experiences and relevancy in terms of preparing them for the future. Part of the work of our SEAN Task force is to increase those opportunities for more students.
• Finally, we are also developing meaningful work-based programs at the three continuation schools which will be supported in part by the Irvine grant which is held in the College and Career Office.
Again, there is much more to be done and we welcome any and all input as we grapple with this problem. If you have suggestions, I highly recommend you attend one of the meetings for the task forces described above or send them to me at troy.flint@ousd.k12.ca.us so I can forward them to the staffers working directly on reducing the dropout rate.
December 14th, 2010 at 8:27 pm
Mrs. Shipp
I don’t work for OUSD. I teach in a nearby district. But I wonder if you would find my excuses worth hearing (and I acknowledge some of this is excuses–that I could do more):
Back to School Night: in private school where you are spending $ you go; in my public school only about 10% of parents show up (and always the ones with A students)
Parent contact: six times this semester I’ve been asked to stay after school to meet a parent. Five times the parent did not show up, one parent came a half hour late.
Parent contact2: I’ve offered dozens of times over the past few years–parent, let me come to your home to talk with you about your child’s progress. Not once has anyone said yes.
Progress reports: I should do more here. It’s easy to sign one and expect the child to deliver it home. But even if I’m more proactive (if I send the report to the parent) how do I get it into their hands. Students routinely intercept mail that I send home even when I disguise the return address.
Tracking: nothing segregates a school more yet when I speak out against tracking I’m overwhelmed by parent protests. The active parents don’t want their kids mixing with the lower class kids.
December 14th, 2010 at 9:42 pm
Rick: I actually have, though it was difficult to get this info broken down by school, race and exam. Thanks for reminding me to get back on it!
December 14th, 2010 at 10:11 pm
Just across the bridge from Oakland is a public school district with open enrollment honors and advanced placement classes available to all students and support classes for those who need an extra boost. the pass rates in their AP courses matter to the teachers, and often exceed the national average without closing off the classes. this guarantees nothing except that the students will be challenged whatever their background. in these schools parents do come to Back to School Night, not just to sporting events, and are involved in the life of the school. I am sorry your experience has been so poor, but I assure you it is not the same in other public schools.
December 14th, 2010 at 10:23 pm
I don’t think Troy Flint gets it. much of what he speaks of doing will increase the dropout rate, not lower it.
The drop outs, which here are dominated by the black students, are making rational decisions to leave a school system that is of little or no perceived value to them.
Any further academic and college prep programs are going to intensify the dropouts, not reduce them. If OUSD really wanted to fight the dropout trends – which I doubt they do – they’d establish “ditch digger U’s” – Continuation schools for underclass youth that actually do have some value to the student and the mess of a family these students come from. And stop mentioning the words “college” to them. The dropouts are generally not on this earth for college. It insults and annoys them when you speak to them of it. They want and they need paths to a better existance with no college – ever.
We may understand that the Jr Colleges have some of the low cost trade programs that are the highest aspirations of some of this group. We do need to break that to them gently – when they’re ready, maybe when they’re 22.
Maybe we should start with a day program on how to manage your criminal cases (or welfare claims, birthing and VD, karate class) – something really useful.
When OUSD starts a program that gives the dropouts something with obvious value – something they can use within days – then you’ll be onto something.
The underclass never values information for it’s own sake. They only value something they can use at once. (Read Banfield’s “The Unheavenly City” and related scholarly books). Give it to them and they won’t drop out.
In the meantime, Budget Cuts are coming. Watch what happens to the State Education budget. Enough chasing after the underclass and throwing money at them they want no part of. If the public schools can’t get better utilization than this, they need to have school closures and termination of mandatory education by 9th grade. See if those days aren’t coming.
December 14th, 2010 at 11:07 pm
#6 Jerry – my experiences in OUSD exactly. I don’t want to just blame the parents but I’d also like to not be blamed entirely when kids are failing – when they haven’t eaten, don’t own a book, don’t have a stable home, and are afraid because their dad is beating up their mom.
Or, as some of my colleagues in more affluent areas have told me – when the nanny is the only contact with the family and the parents answer every issue with “My child wouldn’t do that.”
Yes, teachers need to be responsible, but parents need to take some responsibility for the children they brought into this world.
I am not a parent but I tell all my friends who are parents to tell the teachers what they expect. Teachers want help and feedback but we can’t do it all alone – especially those of us who have 150 students.
December 15th, 2010 at 12:04 am
Ms. Shipp: I teach an AP class, and I don’t care about whether kids pass the test, because my job is not to get them to pass the test, but instead is to impart the skills set forth in the California Social Science standards. Similarly, I teach seniors, but I don’t care whether kids graduate, because getting them to graduate is NOT my job; rather, it is THEIR job. My job is, again, to teach what is in the State standards (or, as much as is practicable).
What parents SHOULD be concerned with, re: AP and otherwise, is whether the curriculum being taught is sufficiently rigorous. In my experience, that is a MAJOR problem in Oakland, and is itself a form of inequity.
PS to Rick: The number of African American and Latino students who pass AP tests in the District (other than Latinos who take AP Spanish) is very low.
PPS: Finally, as a World History teacher, I can’t led slide the claim that “this was the basis on which the country was built, keeping the masses enslaved while allowing only the select few prosper.” That is just silly.
December 15th, 2010 at 12:26 am
If it wasn’t so sad, I’d say this represents the loudest case for laughter yet: An OUSD Task Force charged with investigating its spectacular failure in executing its very own education mission.
Even funnier: The “hub” approach is hardly new or innovative. Indeed, the vaunted Task Force need only peer across the bridge to SFUSD, where such a model was tested nearly seven years ago. Sheesh.
Oh, and Madame Shipp, did you not at one time have a contract with the very district you now appear to slam? Oh, for shame.
December 15th, 2010 at 12:53 am
Katy and Gordon,
Thanks! What about this for a start. HOw many of our black male or females student’s passed the AP cal exam at Skyline or Oakland Tech?
December 15th, 2010 at 5:30 am
How about a big old dose of common sense????
Why do Oakland kids drop out and not see the value of getting an education?
Well…. for 9 years (grade K-8) Oakland students are pushed along to the next grade via “social promotion” whether they master the material or do nothing at all in class. For example…. just like last year and the year before, there are 8th graders at my school today who have a 0.00 grade point average. Last year, they were threatened that they wouldn’t walk the stage, but they all did…. and not one student was retained. They ALL went on to high school. The straight A students and the straight F students alike.
They also played on the basketball and football teams, they went on field trips, they got awards in front of the entire school if they showed even the slightest hint of positive behavior. While the high performing kids and their parents are ignored and even RESENTED by the administration (I know of a straight A student who was given an F because the kid he was assigned to tutor in math did no work and made no progress), the low performing “at-risk” students are catered to and cajoled by the administration as their teachers are VILIFIED for not doing enough to reach them. They walk the stage at the end of their 8th grade year thumbing their noses at teachers who had no ability to hold them accountable for learning or behaving over those 9 years.
Then… we send those unprepared students off to high school….. where ALL of the rules for school have now been changed. If they don’t master the coursework with at least a passing grade, they receive no credit and must repeat that course before moving on. What a concept!!!! So…. after a few months or maybe a whole year, when that same student who once walked the stage triumphantly at 5th and 8th grade “Promotion” ceremonies (even though they didn’t have the grades to deserve it)…..realizes what it would actually take for them to pass to the next grade or graduate from high school… they just give up and drop out.
Well….. DUH!!!!
“Social promotion” is a grave injustice and extremely patronizing to our kids. We should love and respect them enough to be honest with them and to hold each student accountable for their own efforts and progress. We also need to be willing and prepared to meet them where they are educationally and to challenge them to take responsibility for themselves. And we need to do it SOONER rather than LATER.
It ain’t rocket science.
December 15th, 2010 at 7:30 am
Thanks so much for sharing your insights, Kim.
How do you think class size load fits into all of this? How many student contacts do the private school teachers have per day vs those working in the public schools? To me that might be the most obvious functional difference that would contribute to (or interfere with) teachers making deeper one-on-one connections.
And as far as the history of this country goes, I ditto what you say. I also want to recommend a wonderful new book to everyone here about the Great Migration: “The Warmth of Other Suns” by Pulitzer Prize-winning Isabel Wilkerson. This is such an important era to understand, but hasn’t been much studied.
Wilkerson’s in-depth piece of journalism reads like a good novel. Also, she connected with a lot of people in Oakland while doing her research. She’ll be speaking in SF on March 9, 2011.
http://isabelwilkerson.com/
http://www.cityarts.net/n.wilkerson.html
December 15th, 2010 at 7:57 am
Rick:
Why just Skyline and Tech?
Also, a more interesting study would be this: What percentage of African American students who enroll in an AP class end up dropping it? Unfortunately, in my experience, the percentage is very high, especially for males (but then, males of all races are underrepresented in most AP classes, with the possible exception of math and physics. I’m not sure about Chem and Biology.)
December 15th, 2010 at 8:00 am
I DO care whether my kids pass AP/CST/CAHSEE/graduate. Why? Because it is MY JOB to make sure my students leave me with the knowledge and skills outlined by the California State Standards. And if I teach a rigorous course, they will.
Look, I didn’t have to twist words!
December 15th, 2010 at 8:22 am
Seenitbefore’s post is a great example of OUSD “schools” in full pacification mode.
People, these are not schools. We pretend to teach and the bad students pretend to learn. Then we send them off to high school to wreck those “schools”.
Remember, the differences are most pronounced sfter puberty. You are not going to have a school where you have mixed bad students and good students.
Until we screen out bad students in the public high schools we really aren’t educating.
December 15th, 2010 at 8:55 am
I asked the district this fall how many black students in OUSD passed AP Calculus, and was told it didn’t have that information, which surprised me. I brought that up in my interview with Chris Chatmon, director of African American male achievement. I believe he has requested it.
Here’s a breakdown of total AP scores, by school (but not by race or subject), in OUSD: http://bit.ly/f9Lg4G
December 15th, 2010 at 9:09 am
Paideia has expanded over the past several years. My mixed race (AA/White) son went through the AP track of Paideia and the Engineering Academy, graduating in 2007 having passed all seven of the AP courses he took at Tech.
In contrast, my daughter up until this year has not been as diligent in her studies, and as a result is instead taking the Honors track of Paideia and her first AP course (Statistics) as an 11th grader. There are upwards of 300 kids currently taking part in Paideia in grades 10-12.
As noted in the prior article about the program, one of the barriers to expansion is finding qualified teachers who have both the history and english credential, are willing to commit to all the hard work required, and are willing to work starting at $42,000/year. One of the most talented young Paideia teachers left before last year after about 5 years at Tech. He got married and moved back to the midwest where he could afford to live on a teacher’s salary.
December 15th, 2010 at 9:41 am
Gordon,
Good question. Katy said it was difficult to get the AP data from ousd that is broken down by percentages for different ethnic groups.
Therefore, If she focused on one race, one school(such as skyline or tech) and one subject it would be simpler for her to get the information. Any OUSD high school would be fine with me. I have been told by an AP teacher that they are not aware of one black student in Oakland who has passed AP cal in 2010. I find this hard to believe!
Mrs. Alice Spearman,
You comments have been very stright forward on this blog. Can you help Katy get this information?
December 15th, 2010 at 10:50 am
I’m sure that the College Board issues a report to the district that breaks this down. It should be easy to get; I found it (or, a report that I assume has that info) online but it asks for an access code.
In fact, the district got a grant from the College Board a few years ago to improve African-American performance on AP tests. I assume there is data.
Nancy Midlin is the district AP coordinator – she should be able to get the reports
December 15th, 2010 at 11:00 am
Thanks, Gordon. As I mentioned before, I need to follow up on my initial, unsuccessful attempt to get this data. I’m sure it’s out there — and if it’s not, that’s a story too.
December 15th, 2010 at 11:26 am
Does anyone else find this racial data as useless as i do? This is a waste of time.
“the district got a grant from the College Board a few years ago to improve African-American performance on AP tests.”
You can’t teach to a race. You just teach.
I would love it if everyone who wants to continue to collect data, divided by race, – to please explain what you want if for … and if you teach in Oakland, and want the data, what are you going to do with the data to teach more effectively?
December 15th, 2010 at 11:46 am
Rick: Why would you find it hard to believe there is apparently not one male black student passing AP Calc? (as opposed to Asian and Jewish candidates)
More interesting, is when you do find “Black” males passing AP Calc – what is the actual ethnicity of such males?
Look at the IQ stats for USA blacks (they’ve been charted now for nearly 100 years). Now what scores are typically required for AP Math and Lab Sciences. Now how many such individuals age 18 per year would you expect to find in the US? It’s a Bell Curve thing.
We go through the same math every year with the CA & NY Bar Exams, the National Medical Boards and every other thing that is IQ dependent. In some cases the candidates from particular ethnic groups are rare – there are numerically not many people in the country each year scoring in the band required for these things. And it’s not going to change, it’s going to get worse thanks to government run dis-eugenics.
It does no good to lie about what is happening or piously claim we don’t know what is happening. We know EXACTLY what is happening.
On the other hand, do I bemoan the fact that is disliked calculus intensely (statistics was fun, though) and found other things to do with my academic career? No. I like myself and my interests. Most everyone does. Maybe that’s a survival instinct.
Blacks are typically not good at calculus and no amount of teaching calculus is going to change that. The issue is genetic. There are individual variances and anomalies. Meaning you might be able to find an exceptional black candidate. So what. You sure don’t need Calculus for citizenship. And you have no excuse for humiliating students by telling them they are supposed to be able to do Calculus and are stupid if they don’t.
People are different and have different abilities and talents. Some have better hand-eye co-ordination, some don’t. Some are adept at calculus, some are not. Embrace it. Work the differences. Stop trying to force people to be what they are not. Schools are supposed to be fairly assessing their students and making the most of what the students has to work with. Not trying to force them into a hopeless program.
December 15th, 2010 at 11:53 am
Thanks for all of your insightful post. I’ll try to respond to some who have asked for additional information.
#1 Nextset, in general I can say that I am satisfied in that I was able to understand and used the avaiable resources that OUSD provided for my children. AP classes, music programs, etc.
In terms of the choices I made for them regarding which schools, that also came down to opportunities. I found these opportunities and had my children to partcipate, inside the district as well as outside.
As far as the private school being warm and fuzzy, definitely not the case, just more relational.
#3 On the issue of equity, I’ll let my daughter (aged 20) respond to you.
The issue of equity differs by race. A lot of what I have observed is that Asian immigrant parents usually (not always) demand more from their students and impart the value of education to their students. Generataions of African Americans have not been actively involved in and have not imparted the value of education in their children because they have not been taught to. It is a vicious cycle. I can only thank my mother and others in my family for instilling in me the value of education and how hard my ancestors had to fight for my right to be educated.
#6 Back to school night in their present form are outdated and needs to be changed. You did not say what grade level you are teaching at, but Parent Contracts usually do not work at the middle and high school levels. At this point it is too late, you have to have a contract with parents early in a child’s education and the contract should be between the school and parent and a be positive one.
#10 Most of the issues you described are a results of a lack of education from generation to generation. No it is not all of the teacher’s fault and I’m the first to say that parents bare the responsibility. But the focus was not on parents right now but addressing specific issues. Besides, If you are a good teacher you should not take issue with my comments, no more than I would if someone writes about parents not being involved in their children’s education.
#12 Don’t quite understand you last comment. I’m not bashing OUSD, I’m expressing my opinion and where and who I work for have nothing to do with it.
December 15th, 2010 at 11:56 am
Harold: Interesting line there,
“You can’t teach to a race. You just teach.”
No, you don’t just “teach”. You learn enough about your students to put them into programs that they have a reasonable expectation of succeeding in.
To do otherwise with at risk or vulnerable student populations inflicts harm. Yes, you can make matters worse by taking a group of students into a forced-failure program. It’s called miss-matching. As in using AA to put students who would have graduated (met requirements) at a lesser program into a far more competitive educational program where they are statistically certain to fail. And maybe load them up with $200k in Student Loans at the same time just for fun.
You can destroy people with a miss-matched educational program. But you know that, don’t you?
Brave New World.
December 15th, 2010 at 12:30 pm
OUSD needs an effective way to teach and support their schools and teachers by teaching to:
a) Large class sizes; Partial Solution: Get T/A’s in ALL classes;
b) A big variety of students; Partial Solution: School or Program interventions that either concentrate on disruptive children outside class time, or, if necessary, take the disruptive child out for intervention;
c) REALLY boost lower ranking student academics as early as K-8; Partial Solution: Supplemental programs like Sylvan or other (funded by OFCY or Strategic Plan funders like Kaiser);
d) Bring parents of problem children in to schools to work on their children’s issues. Partial Solution: Family Outreach specialists;
e) Retain Proficient and Advanced students and keep them engaged; Partial Solutions: GATE, other supplemental programs, magnet schools and tracking;
f) Retain 9-12 graders who are dropping out or not college bound. Partial Solution: Bring back Technical education because they keep relevance, hands-on learning, and train for good paying blue collar jobs, and even some college bound (engineering, etc.).
To Troy Flint’s point above, it sounds like OUSD has some ideas about technical education.
OUSD’s Strategic Plan goals for Neighborhood & Community Schools should not devolve into just addressing social problems that occur outside the schools, or for only the poorest citizens. It must also address academics and community in Middle Class schools and neighborhoods, which don’t have the resources of EITHER the public spending in the Flats, or from the private wealth in the Hills. There should be in-between levels of funding and not ALL OR NOTHING.
OUSD, OFCY & the Strategic Plan must work to represent a variety of communities, schools, families and children. Not just one.
December 15th, 2010 at 12:50 pm
Harold:
It is true that you cannot teach to a race. But it is also true that, if 90% of the students in an AP class are Asian-American (as in my classes), a marginal Asian American student might have more peer support than a marginal African American student. Indeed, many of my Asian-American students are in my AP class for one reason: their friends are taking the class. So, even if they struggle, at least they stick with the class and, hopefully, build the skills needed to succeed in AP classes in the future. In contrast, the marginal African American student is less likely to have friends in the class and hence is more likely to drop it when the going gets rough.
Surely, it is possible for schools to address that problem.
December 15th, 2010 at 1:01 pm
Edna Brewer has a great program called Brothers on the Rise that builds positive peer pressure, both with young african american males but also across barriers, since they also have white, asian and latino boys in the program.
Ironically when Gordon correctly mentions “surely, it is possible for schools to address that problem.” indeed some schools already have successful programs, or at least partially successful that could be more so with more resources.
So why isn’t OUSD investing in programs that already work?
Part of the challenge is that even with proven programs Principals nix them because they either don’t want a program from another school, or look for possible reasons the program won’t work at their school. So even with successful programs, broadening their scope either doesn’t happen or takes fighting tooth-and-nail.
One subject we’ve addressed in comments but not as a stand-along-subject: OUSD is very bureaucratic and VERY political.
December 15th, 2010 at 1:28 pm
Kim Shipp pointed out a disturbing occurrence that I have also observed in Paideia and similar programs: Even with similar grades and performance, white and Asian kids are PRESUMED to qualify (*halo* effect)and African American and Latino kids are not. Perhaps I am naive in thinking that this racism is inadvertent, but I am just as certain that it is real. Moreover, the white kids on the borderline will get in because their middle class parents know how to and will advocate for them until they get their way. Other kids may not have the Kim Shipps of the world to do so for them.
And no, I am not advocating a lowering of standards, just an awareness of subconscious biases when making sorting decisions.
I agree with Nextset that not all kids, including OUSD kids are college material, and that it folly to foist that myth on everyone. However, that does not mean that they must be destined for minimum wage jobs. Many jobs with living wages exist in the allied health fields such as x-ray technologists, certified nursing assistants, dental hygienists, etc. And of course, there are the traditional trade jobs such as plumbers, electricians, and mechanics. However, I suspect that kids need to be shown a clear academic road map to understand why they need a certain level of math or science to obtain training in those occupations.
December 15th, 2010 at 2:04 pm
I had a real visceral reaction when I read the post by Troy Flint. Ugh! Maybe this ‘we’ll take over your life; feed, dress, house, teach you’ mode of providing education will work for some, but I highly doubt it. I don’t think that providing a social service Mecca will make the failing students flourish. I also think it oversteps what public education should entail. If that’s what the plans are, however, I wish the students luck.
What I do know is it further alienates me, as an upper middle class parent. I send my children to public schools and I want the schools to provide an opportunity to learn, period. I am not interested in a facility where the family gets immunized, cavities filled, new coats, and housing. I understand that there are social issues that are different for some families, but if you want me to buy into public education it must fit my values and needs, too. If you make a public school model that looks like it fits the needs of only the most disenfranchised, then we’ll have to join the rest of the crowd who has already turned to private education. All we want is the opportunity for our children to get a solid public education. Rigorous teaching, safety, discipline – that’s all you need to attract and retain a whole lot of families.
December 15th, 2010 at 2:09 pm
Additional questions:
“Additional Sessions” means more classes?
Is this 1 example proof of racism? I ask because:
-It is 1 example and as such anecdotal, not statistical or broad;
-The other example is Kim’s son who apparently did not have the same negative experience (or presumably it would be included in the article);
-Are there other potential explanations, such as feeder school, out of region or network, etc.?
-I know white students who have had trouble getting into the school or program of their choice. They’ve also had to fight tooth and nail to get into programs they were originally rejected for. How is this different?
I’m not saying racism wasn’t a factor here, I’m only saying it shouldn’t be automatically assumed that there is, and there should be some iota of proof if and when the claim is made.
Kim, Did you ever get what you felt was a logical, honest explanation of why the young girl was not originally accepted? Or was it hard to tell through bureaucratic obfuscation and side stepping?
December 15th, 2010 at 2:11 pm
i’m still waiting for someone to tell me and the community, how this racial data (which much resources are used in gathering …) is relevant, to the task (effective Teaching) in the classroom?
The program at Brewer i am sure is fine … but i read thread after thread on this blog, where racial data is thrown around and requested. “We” didn’t used to track everything based on race. We don’t hand out race-based diplomas …
The problem has been mentioned on this blog. Its discipline. These task forces are useless, worthless, drains on (precious resources) unless the adults are allowed to teach.
Stop enabling disruptive behavior and our schools will flourish!
December 15th, 2010 at 3:18 pm
Mr. Flint:
Please define rigorous as it looks in the elementary classroom, middle school classroom and high school classroom.
There are very, very few classrooms in Oakland, three of my five included, several years of my sons elementary school and with the exception of a very small number of high school classes I have not seen what I define as rigorous in high school either.
How is your and the district’s vision of rigor compared to the minimum state standards that I post on my classroom walls.
Please define rigorous.
December 15th, 2010 at 3:22 pm
Donna:
My experience at Oakland High has been the opposite: we are so desperate for Latino and African American AP students — especially African American males — that we push marginal students into AP classes even if they are not particularly interested. Marginal Asian-American students are generally not pushed (though they are more likely to come by 1 week into school and ask to come into the class, possibly to be with friends, but sometimes also to escape classes that they deem too easy or too chaotic).
December 15th, 2010 at 3:51 pm
Gordon: I think we push these students into AP because many of us discovered (I did while getting my Master’s in Urban Education) that the districts has ZERO African American and Latino/Latina students in many AP strands across the district. Zero – for years and years.
When you request the information from the district, you have to sign that you will not publicize the information without the district approval. So I will not specify what strands – perhaps Katy can get the information without these requirements under the Freedom of Information act. The district can’t fire her.
December 15th, 2010 at 4:51 pm
#37 mentions Brothers on the Rise.
Is it true that the Edna Brewer principal has cut that wonderful program from his budget next year? Again, can’t OUSD support this program if it has just received $7.5 million for wellness programs from Kaiser and the program would cost a tiny fraction of that amount?
December 15th, 2010 at 4:52 pm
Please excuse this if it is a repeat of what I posted,but I am not sure that the original went through.
After reading this blog, which by the way I find very informative, I am sad to say that there is probably no real difference between your school district and mine.
We fail to prepare, or for that matter to expect, a good majority of students for AP classes. In my city, not only does this apply to Latino and African American students, but also to a large number of non-minority students.
I belive that the bottom line is districts make money when they have students that score basic or far below basic. It appears that there is no lack in grant money to “improve test scores and academic performance”. Textbook vendors and consultant firms, who exist solely to teach teachers how to teach, would be out of business. What would be the incentive for districts to really improve the lot of their students if they then lost funding sources; ways to continue to pay excessively high salaries for administrative postitions?
I truly do believe it’s the money, not the students.
December 15th, 2010 at 4:55 pm
Sorry. I meant #30 mentions Brothers on the Rise
December 15th, 2010 at 5:28 pm
exstep,
Again you have hit the nail on the head. Many Black Parents of financial Means have done the same as Ms. Shipp as far as the education of their children. I know many families who have sent their children through private schools and now are at schools such as Bishop O’Dowd for their high school experience. Now many of these students who did have a public school experience hounded their parents to allow them to finish their last year at a public high school to experience the “social” aspects, ( sports activities, senior balls, etc.), most of the private schools do not have these activities.
And yes you are right, we find so much fault in our public school system but it is a nice place to recieve a check, as so many of our “professional” people are doing. Again, I think you will begin to see a different way of doing business here in Oakland. It will take time to correct the wrongs, but correction is happening.
I am not one to preach, I just do, and it does not have to have a financial gain attached to it.
Remeber education in OUSD is personal in my house. I know that atleast a few students are recieveing the best education possible, they are in the classes with my grandchildren on the Castlemont Campus. I do not feel that I have sacrificed these two teenagers to poor education, rather seeing true life situations that will help mold their personalities in turn making them a well rounded human being.
Again, this is jut my opinion.
P.S. I am still waiting for you to come to board meeting.
December 15th, 2010 at 5:32 pm
Well, if something is successful, why continue it? This is OUSD after all. 1 step forwards, 2 steps back. Better to try something we’re uncertain about…
December 15th, 2010 at 5:34 pm
#21
I have requested the information, it does exist. Someone may be too embarressed to let the public see it, but the administration is too aware of the numbers. That is the impetus for re arrainging the configurations of a couple of high schools.
Let’s see how long it will take them to deliver it. Stay tuned.
December 15th, 2010 at 5:51 pm
Mrs. Spearman,
I love people who take the bull by the horns. We need more school board members with your ability to say it like it is.
Thanks for your help and keep it up! Now, I know why so many people in our community support you for this job.
December 15th, 2010 at 7:35 pm
Ms Shipp,
Can you share why your son left his private school (I remember you blog when you moved him to private), and why he has returned to Skyline (of which your description was not flattering). Why move your child back to a school you feel is so lacking?
I am pleased to have (what I assume) is a fine young man back in OUSD and at Skyline, but curious as to why you switched back and why to Skyline?
December 15th, 2010 at 9:10 pm
I think it is equally an indictiment for schools that say they offer all honors and AP courses to their students. That is unrealistic in the “real world” .
What is AP anyway? Many schools ,outside of Oakland, do not offer AP courses yet kids go on to college. But what is the worth of college anyway? I have friends who attended Ivy leagues or expensive liberal arts colleges only to work as an underpaid, over worked low paid jobs.
No…AP is also a farce for bragging rights that will begin to be attacked in this era of cuts.
December 15th, 2010 at 9:33 pm
#44 I reluctantly let my son return to Skyline for his senior year because frankly he was really depressed at the private school. Although he did relatively well, he endured a lot which I chalked up to be a good experience for him even though he may not realize it now but I feel he will later. He was there on full scholarship and they wanted him to return, so money was not the issue. The early mornings and long evenings at school, the fifteen miles each way commute, his feeling isolated really took its toll. He never felt part of the school community. I can’t blame it all on the school because there were people there who I feel really tried to make him feel like he was part of the school, even though as I said before there were definitely some issues there. He attended Bret Harte and maintained his middle school friends throughout high school and he wanted to spend his last year of high school with them. I feel for the most part he benefited from the private school experience in a lot of ways, but in the end I had to make the decision of what was more important, one more year in private school or a son with a broken spirit? As parents we sometimes have to make tough decisions for the benefit of our children. Even though I’m a little worried about senioritis and the heavy load he decided to take (4 AP courses), he’ll be O.K. I think he’ll be able to take both experiences with him to college. As for moving back to a school that’s lacking, I never thought with Skyline and a few other schools that its always a lack of resources, but again a lack of willingness on the part of some. I think for me as a parent, it has been a tale of two cities so to speak. I also feel that I’ve benefited from both experiences.
December 15th, 2010 at 9:59 pm
@Catherine
It’s true that OUSD has historically failed to define and to encourage a systematic understanding of rigor. As a result, many of our classrooms are lacking in this regard. We recognize this situation as a serious shortcoming that inhibits our ability to provide consistent high-quality education and we are taking measures to rectify it.
Specifically, we are working to develop a common understanding of rigor across the District that involves:
• Promoting deep disciplinary knowledge
o Developing central ideas in the discipline first while postponing interesting but secondary details
o Establishing interconnections among central ideas of the discipline
o Deepening understanding of themes over time
• Engaging students in generative disciplinary concepts and skills
o Having students anchor new knowledge to central concepts to build understanding
o Having students apply familiar, central ideas or strategies to their emerging understanding of new concepts
o Inviting students to build increasingly complex explanations of disciplinary concepts and processes
• Engaging students in generative cognitive skills (higher-order thinking)
o Having students combine facts and ideas to synthesize, evaluate, and generalize
o Having students build arguments, solve problems, and construct new meanings and understandings
One step in this direction occurred last week during the first installment of a five-day professional development (PD) program on academic language and literacy where principals study seven principles (academic rigor, high expectations, cultural relevance, meta processes, quality interactions, language focus, quality) that can contribute to excellent teaching.
Principals are reading and learning about rigor. They are also watching and analyzing video of instruction to see if it meets the standard. This training will be supplemented by five days of paid professional development in June and August where teachers learn instructional strategies in their content area that are aligned to the seven principles.
There’s a lot of work to do in this area and this is just the surface, but I hope this provides an idea of where the District is headed in defining and ensuring rigor.
December 15th, 2010 at 10:42 pm
I am both excited and depressed about what I am reading here. As a member of the Oakland Tech community I am very proud of what the Paideia program has accomplished with its students. However, right about now is the time of year that African-American males are shuffled out of the program and into the “lower level” classes; classes which often have better teachers with more engaging lessons and spend hours upon hours after their contracted hours to work with students that need extra help. Please walk into any of these teacher’s classroom and look them in the eye and tell them that they aren’t doing their very best.
It is true that the school is tracked starting from registration. Walk into the pre-paideia and bio-9 classes and you are hard pressed to find a statistically relevant representation of african-american and latino students. Walk into the Physical Science, Algebra 1, or Freshman English courses and you will not see an even representation of asian or white students. It is a terrifying reality.
Please do not forget that there are excellent teachers in our community that have the most challenging demographics to work with. It is very easy to sit back and write in a blog about how all of these teachers “don’t care” but have many of you tried to teach a classroom full of (at the start of this school year) 60 students that don’t have chairs to sit in? Have any of you tried to teach a classroom of high school students that are reading at a 4th grade level? These are the realities that high school teachers are facing. Our students do not get breakfast (hot chips and soda do NOT count) and oftentimes dinner. They are dealing with the senseless deaths of friends and family. They are dealing with things that so many of us can not even begin to imagine…and they are not even into adulthood yet.
And yes, OUSD’s “task-forces” are a waste of time and money. Why does the district insist on paying somebody to tell us what we already know. We already know we are failing our african-american boys. The question is what are we going to do about it. But few people downtown seem to be asking that question. I have seen little to no action from said “task forces” in accomplishing anything. Oh sure, they send us a list of at risk students (which is based on low test scores) but the last time I checked good teachers know the test scores of the students coming in. Thanks for all the help, task force.
And let’s not forget something folks. Parents that send their children to private schools are more engaged in the education process than public schools. They invest a lot of time and money to get the student to the school…the student had BETTER do well! What are the public school teachers to do when they call home to discuss grades and behavior and the response is “well I know s/he acts like that, I don’t know what you want me to do.” You would be hard pressed to find a parent that sent their student to a private school and had that response. Let’s give the teachers some support and stop bashing them for everything they are NOT doing. Why don’t we take a second to think about what the teachers ARE doing. Teachers often feel isolated and unappreciated for what they do. After all, how would you feel if somebody came to your desk/office/courtroom/operating room/whatever and told you that you suck at your job? Let’s recognize the strengths and support the teachers. Let’s stop shoving our “ideas” down their throats and support them with their own ideas. We have amazing teachers in the district that burn out or leave because of the lack of support and appreciation. Let’s do something that keeps them around and allows them to continue the amazing work that they do.
December 16th, 2010 at 6:01 am
What Mr. Flint is describing is welfare really and says nothing of academics and the real problem- dicipline.
I agree with Nextset when he says that OUSD should only be ready to seve the thugs.
Its funny- not sad- but of course that is when you do not have kids in the district. When will city leaders step in to save their housing efforts- oh yeah- they are just the same . First Dellums and his model city speech not jean Quan- who by the way served on the OUSD board that sent this district to the bailout!
December 16th, 2010 at 6:48 am
Alice Spearman writes “That is the impetus for re arrainging the configurations of a couple of high schools. Let’s see how long it will take them to deliver it. Stay tuned.”
Can you elaborate on how rearranging the configurations of a couple of high schools is going to improve things? Which high schools are you talking about specifically and do you know for certain that they aren’t already improving even without your idea to reconfigure? Please elaborate. I would hate to see programs that are already improving be reconfigured and then fall back to where they were in 2003.
December 16th, 2010 at 9:05 am
I agree that Mr. Flint’s long posts, have nothing to do with helping the problem: discipline.
Mr Flint wrote: “• Promoting deep disciplinary knowledge”
What the hell does that mean? Does it mean there will be a new directive to actually suspend, or DHP, unacceptable behavior? That young ladies dressed like exotic dancers will be sent home? Does he mean it’s not “all about” the A.D.A. anymore?
I disagree with nextset and Shawn. I don’t want to Balkanize the district.
Is anyone listening to the parent voices on this topic?
Discipline, Discipline, Discipline!
Stop the racial profiling in OUSD.
OUSD has NO PLAN for all this racial data.
Here’s an idea for a task force: let’s find a rubric to measure the effectiveness of our site administrators, Superintendent and School Board!
Lets do an audit of all the money spent on task forces and useless racial profiling.
December 16th, 2010 at 11:21 am
I’m a little confused re: why people are jumping down Mr. Flint for posting a response to a query re: what constitutes rigor. I am even more puzzled regarding why people seem to think that discipline, alone, will create meaningful academic success.
Yes, discipline is a problem. But an equally serious problem is that there are many, many classrooms in which students are orderly and on task, yet no real learning is taking place because the students are not being even remotely challenged. I am SURE that students who read this blog can back me up on this.
So, yes, the District needs to step up re: discipline, but it also needs to raise its game re: rigor.
December 16th, 2010 at 12:30 pm
So… there are over 50 respondents to this posting and only 4 for the budget cuts that are looming over the entire state?
That is telling in of it itself!
As an Oakland taxpayer, I would rather have Ms. Spearman and Mr. Flint respond to how OUSD will stay afloat with such burdensome debt, massive cuts, empty schools, and the vision for the “neighborhood zones”?
I have got the eerie feeling that more measures for more taxes are coming, more pleas to forgive the 100 milion dollar loan (which by the way) is public money, and more crafty shell games are on the horizon with this and many other districts in the state.
December 16th, 2010 at 12:45 pm
@Arismom – post 54. OUSD is no different than most of America. We all seem to love to talk about what we want and need and leave the conversation of how to pay for it until after we have committed ourselves.
That’s not always a bad idea (e.g. man on the moon), but it is literally bankrupt as a way of life. When you make it a way of life, you become Greece, Ireland and California.
December 16th, 2010 at 4:29 pm
Re: back-to-school nights attendance.
You know, we’ve been struggling with attending all these back-to-school nights, open houses etc., for years. They all get routinely scheduled for the same night in elementary, middle & high school – so how are parents to attend? I’ve been talking to pricipals, trying to reschedule, make them aware, try to plan better for future years – routinely our Joaquin Miller events were on the same night with Montera, Montera with Oakland Tech (look – tonight they’re both having their semi-annual music concerts at the same hour; their back-to-school nights were at the same hour, too). This scheduling just shows how much OUSD cares about us having chance to attend. The only response from all principals involved is “have them reschedule. why should I?” Seriously.
And why in the world ABSOLUTELY ALL school events are on Thursday nights. Could it be varied sometimes, a little bit. I teach on Thur nights, so am out of the loop whether I want it or not. I don’t get to attend ANY of my kids events, while wanting to attend each one. Why not make some of them on Mon, some on Tue, some on Wed?
Simple questions, but it shows how much OUSD cares v. just doing it for a checkmark.
December 16th, 2010 at 4:38 pm
@Arismom:
This is Oakland- what do you expect!
Once again- welfare Baby- welfare!
December 16th, 2010 at 4:56 pm
Arismom re the budget is right. And just for once I wish the CA State PTA would announce a family march on Sacrament BEFORE decisions r made, rather than just reading about it in the paper after the fact.
Along with mouningt a campaign, calls to state leaders, a statewide call for volunteers (including all the Seniors who r saving tons of Prop 13 taxes while their grandkids suffer massive cuts). Something we can actually do to influence things, instead of sitting on our asses watching it happen.
Our PTA was forwarded a letter from the state PTA about meetings they r in with Jerry and other state officials, and possible action they might take. Has anybody else heard anything similar (or asked) their PTA?
December 16th, 2010 at 5:20 pm
Wait a minute. Livegreen, you are suggesting that seniors pay for the going rate property tax! Wow, obviously you are not an economist!
Have you seen the checks cut to seniors from pensions and SSI? Most are not well to do in this state! My father worked as a machinist and has a union pension that allows him to barely meet his medical bills, housing costs and food- yet you think he should give it to the educrats who will then spend it on things such as the OUSD Thriving Students Plan and welfrae dream espoused by well intentioned people like Mr. Smith and Mr. Flint? Seniors, who have worked most of their lives and paid the state and feds twice over to pay for future droputs, and thugs who could care less about an education and further pay public employee pensions for a nice and comfortable all expense paid retirement package?
You livegreen yet do not acknowldege those who pick the green in the fields do you. You speak from your middle class haven of course!
Do you know what dying and homeless seniors will cost the state?
No- I agree that we should chop the public school pensions, eliminate waste such as the County Offices of Education, eliminate the need for libraries in school (why do taxpayers pay to build up public libraries and then for a school library?), and things as such.
This budget will whack all that old school PTA nonsense that by the way is a union ploy to espouse their views.
Crazy times are coming you watch- soon all of these charcters in the district will be gone and where will our tax dollars be????????
Welfare dreams are a nightmare for us the working class.
Wake up….change is coming!
December 17th, 2010 at 12:09 am
Harold, why do you have a problem with Mr. Flint stating that the schools need to promote deep disciplinary knowledge? I would hope that a student would have a deep knowledge of the various disciplines (English, History, Science etc.) rather than a shallow one.
I would say that the goals are laudatory but dream on. I never cease to be amazed by the incredibly low abilities to understand the simplest concepts or even to follow simple instructions, which I see on a daily basis at my high school. The other half of the class is texting or talking or playing around so they make no effort to listen to the instructions anyway.
It is a crime that these kids ever got promoted from 8th grade, or even 5th grade. Let’s not blame the teachers – even if they flunk the kids the school still sends them on.
According to the OUSD parents’ handbook,a child may not be promoted unless they:
• Maintain a Grade Point Average of at least 2.0
in core courses. Students who fail a core course
(English/language arts or ELD, social studies,
science or mathematics) must repeat the failed
course(s) during the following year.
• Score at the Basic, Proficient or Advanced
Level on the recent California Standards Test
in both language arts and math.
I know a lot of children who didn’t manage to do those two things but still got promoted every year at Montera. So what gives? Mr. Flint, will you try to make sure that policy is followed? Maybe if the kids and their parents know for a fact they wouldn’t be promoted they would actually try to learn.
December 17th, 2010 at 12:49 am
Shawn, Not all Seniors are poor. It’s simply not true. We have neighbors who throughout their lives earned much more than we do, and yet they pay 5% of the property taxes we do.
Not all kids who go to public school in Oakland or in the State of CA are thugs. And if that’s what you think about all young people, then you are discriminating based on age, the same way Prop 13 does.
Most (by no means all) of the “Greatest Generation” and the Baby Boomers are happy to sit on their buts from the lousy economy they’ve left their youth, and pocket their profits and kick back and watch the State and the Country sink around them.
Remember, the current generations are the first to earn less than their parents. The pensions of the elders are much better than the pensions of current employees, and will be of future employees (public or private). So I don’t know why you’re biased for elders and against the young. It’s not just pay that’s getting cut. It’s ALL education for ALL kids. (You willfully ignore in your argument).
I agree that Seniors in poverty should not have to pay more than they can afford in taxes. But Wealthy Seniors should not have to pay the same rates as the poor seniors. There’s something in between everyone of a certain age getting Prop 13 (the current system) vs. just the poor of a certain age.
Prop 13 is age discrimination against the young, all benefits go to the old.
“Apres Moi le Deluge” is the mantra of the “Greatest” and Baby Boomer generations. With very few of them volunteering in our schools.
December 17th, 2010 at 6:04 am
Two years ago this very day, I wrote to a nationally acclaimed African-American public policy speaker and author about some of the difficult problems facing Oakland public school youth. Here is his response:
“There’s a lot I can say in response to the problems you cite, but allow me to briefly focus on one – school environment. Civility and orderliness is a first-order condition for meaningful education to occur. If that condition is not met, there’s little in the way of academic excellence that can be achieved. If it requires the expulsion of half of the students, it must must accomplished. I’ve visited and given scholarships to schools such as Marcus Garvey (LA), Marva Collins (Chicago, Cincinnati), and Ivy Leaf (Philadelphia). Each of these schools are black founded schools, students are from low and moderate income families (often female-headed). At each of these, 95 % and more of the students are at grade level, and up to 4 years above. Foul language, disorderliness or disrespect for one another and teachers is not tolerated. In other words, they have an environment conducive to learning and I’d say that should be your first order of business.”
Professor Walter E. Williams
George Mason University, Economics
4400 University Dr., MSN 3G4
Fairfax, VA 22030
http://www.walterewilliams.com
December 17th, 2010 at 7:07 am
@#60 – Because the district is all talk. Actually, the district is all task force. I blame the adults for the discipline problems that occur in Oakland schools, or any other school district. We make the rules … I’m tired of the enabling administrators, who are obsessed with ADA. I’m tired of nexo’s, who tell administrators not to suspend students, who disrupt the learning environment.
December 17th, 2010 at 11:26 am
With regard to post #62:
Black schools before the “civil rights” movement were generally run by black males – often with military experience (vet’s preference, etc). There was no such thing as foul language, barnyard sexuality and physically acting out going on. Anyone who tried it was instantly punished and ultimately expelled.
Women and white liberals got control of black education and the disaster we have resulted. Their point is that the Negroes are still so traumatized by slavery we can’t correct them, physically or verbally. And we can’t expel them either since we have to keep them around and tolerate anything they do. That’s nonsense.
The rest is history. Years of black advances rolled back in a generation or two. Unemployable “graduates”.
Kill ‘em with kindness.
We need to approach the ghetto schools with the thought that the students there are in greater need of discipline and basic skills than the white students, thanks to the government destroyed family structure. And give it to them.
This is off thread to some extent. Paideia is patently constructed to be (largely) Negro Free. Whoopie for them. Whatever makes them happy. There are differences between the two groups, let them go their own ways.
Now what are we going to do for the (largely black) student population reading at 4th grade level at 9th grade? In Oakland there are more of them than there are of Paideia candidates.
December 17th, 2010 at 11:38 am
Great blog. My son and I have taken about the same route. Private schools, charter school, and Skyline. I feel your pain.
December 17th, 2010 at 3:35 pm
This year, as of day 72 of school, I have had 14 changes in my class make up–transfers to our school and from it–and that’s out of 24 kids. It is difficult for the rest of the class, for the teacher, and for the students who are being moved from one situation to another. As anyone who has ever interacted with children knows, consistency and routine are extremely helpful in establishing expectations for behavior as well as achievement.
Sometimes a situation which doesn’t seem very good isn’t very good. But often a situation improves with tenacity and commitment.
December 17th, 2010 at 7:01 pm
#51 & #54,
I am talking about the schools on the Castlemon and Fremont Campuses. With budgets being as they are now, secondary schools that has enrollments of 300 students or less are not able to offer the academic classes needed for students to acheive at high levels, they can now only offer the minimum of services. So to throw the baby out with the bath water is not an option either. Taking what is working and adding to it will be the focus of the district with these schools. The district is looking at bringing the schools together under one roof, which combining the enrollment allows for greater funding to utilize. Offering a larger variety of class offerings, being able to provide couselors, intervention services which are greatly needed and delivering a high level of academic services to our students.
There has been a “student flight” away from these campuses, enrollment is now at an all time low. We can no longer sustain these schools in their present configuration.
Now let’s talk about Budget. Last year, the district cut 122Mil from it’s operating budget, it is expected that we will cut more in January after our new Govenor makes his cuts to the state budget. We have a 19M operational deficit. No matter what the district does, we have to maximize our services on a leaner budget. Employees are clamering for raises, well deserved, but what will be sacrificed to achieve this, at this time I have no idea what this sacrifice will be. We do know some things we can do, as the year progreses, the choices will be clear.
Nexstep, We should meet for coffee, contact me, alice.spearman@ousd.k12.ca.us.
Finally, if folks are really upset about that state of education in Oakland, you really should contact your State Legislators and demand the state stop cutting education funds. Contact your Federal Legislators and demand more funding for General Education.
December 17th, 2010 at 7:51 pm
Wow! This is so much to take in! Blame OUSD, blame the teachers, blame the budget, blame the Union, public vs. private…I just wish that parents would simply be parents and actually raise their own children. It’s so sad, have you ever heard of “What a Business Does With Inferior Blueberries?” http://www.openeducation.net/2007/12/21/what-does-a-business-do-with-inferior-blueberries/
In any case, I show up everyday to teach children at a school that I would never send my own children to. I have options, but sadly the parents in the community where I teach don’t. I try to express my concerns to my Administrator who simply has his own agenda to just be “principal” (whatever that means because he needs help at doing a better job). I’m so glad that I had a mother who never allowed me to “settle for less”. I come from the same neighborhood where I teach and I live near there too. This is why I’m so passionate about my career in teaching. Everyone has an opinion, but no one has ever taken time to ask for mine. Not as a teacher, not as a parent, not as a product of this very school district.
Blah, blah, blah as the conversation continues while ignoring the most important stakeholders. All I can do is model the great teachers that I once had here in Oakland, and remember the mistakes of the not-so-great-ones trying not to make them myself. The education saga conintues…
December 17th, 2010 at 8:50 pm
Alice: Have we thought of doing what Alameda School District has been doing to offer courses which require specialized teachers that we cannot hire or afford – and that is to allow students to take the courses at the community college (Alameda City College) where the district picks up the $70 tab – rents books, if students cannot afford them – and the students attend in the evenings at a significant savings to the school district.
In this case, an advanced Math or Science Teacher for 40 students would cost about $6,000 per year for tuition and another $8,000 or so for books. So, about $14,000 would do it – much cheaper than a teacher, personnel department, supply clerk, etc. The community colleges often need the seats filled and everyone gains – except maybe the consultants.
I have taken foreign language classes with 15 year old students who see examples of responsible adult behavior in these classes. The students, young and not so young contribute to each others’ learning and everyone in the class seems to benefit. These classes also teach teens that certain behavior, such as sloppy speech, vibrating cell phones and eating in class will not be tolerated. It also shows them that respect is earned and given to those who work, share, achieve and commit.
I think this would be something for the school board to consider in light of the expense cutting that must take place in the coming year.
December 17th, 2010 at 9:40 pm
It’s tune for OUSD to move beyond this race vs. that, this economic spectrum vs. that. We already have well functioning successfully diverse schools in Oakland. Yet because they aren’t the poorest or the wealthiest, few pay attention or acknowledge that they are a model for how Oakland can navigate both the ethnic and economic diversity we have.
Bringing those kids, families and communities together. Not tearing them apart somewhere between unruly races vs. social equity for all poor.
Bring the families together, give their teachers and families the resources to manage them, and bring in the parents to participate (by force if necessary) and more schools will b successful…
December 19th, 2010 at 12:10 am
#69
Yes we are currently looking at that program. We are in conversations with Peralta at this time. However what has risin to the surface last month, it looks like due to state requirements, students taking more that 6 units in the Community College System will be required to pay full fee’s. I spoke in front of the Peralta Board Committee last month to oppose this requirement as did the school from Alameda. At this time Alameda is in conversations regarding payment of the fees. If they are no successful, we will see how Alameda proposes to continue the courses because all the students are students who’s families cannot affor the fees. Hopefully it will be workd out.
December 22nd, 2010 at 2:21 pm
Nextset-I really wish you would stop perpetrating the genetic argument for academic success or failure. Often I find some of your arguments plausible, but not when you fall into Bell Curve territory. If a child studies hard, learns tenacity and perseverance and is disciplined in their study habits, they can succeed in Calculus. Many kids give up on math because they give up easily when the problems become difficult, or they lack essential math skills they should have mastered in their early childhood. Those who are successful often have parents who sit at the table with them and force them to complete their math problems. Is that related to genetics? No. Could it be cultural or reflective of the values or work ethic of the family? Possibly. Never say genetics and never attribute academic success to genetics and race….wrong answer!
December 23rd, 2010 at 8:05 am
Public School Teacher: I agree with you that motivation can be better than “giftedness.” This is my huge argument against excellent scores without effort in elementary school.
In studies on “gifted” and “highly motivated” elementary students tracked in longitudinal studies looking at how they do in college and career, the biggest predictor of dropout, jobs / careers below intellectual level and dissatisfaction has nothing to do with ethnicity, socioeconomics, race (yes, may be different from ethnicity – also may be biracial), religion, parents’ marital status, sexual orientation of parents or students, IQ (assuming in this case it is at least 115 or higher as it was done on a specifically identified population), or the overall quality of the school (although 80% or more of the teachers must have been credentialed) – the biggest predictor of not finishing college in SIX years and/or being underemployed had to do with excellence without effort in elementary school.
Why we do not require extreme rigor in elementary school is beyond me. It is where students learn to think, learn to build their perseverance. Students who must work hard in elementary school learn self-motivation, self-discipline, and self-direction. I, too believe that students can learn I think we as teachers hold them back academically in elementary school and then expect them to soar in middle and high school – it doesn’t work that way – at least not for those learners fleeing the district.
December 23rd, 2010 at 12:38 pm
Public School Teacher; You’re living in a fantasy world. Grow up and study the numbers.
If you want to sit around the campfire and pretend the numbers we are all faced with are a result of nurture not nature, you are free to do so. I say that both are involved with nature being dominant. Now what are you going to do tomorrow about the OUSD kids?
The liberals have had their way with public education since the 1960s. The results are more than plain. Continuation of these destructive policies raises the issue of extinction of blacks as a political and economic force in the USA (combined with immigration). It’s just that simple. The black common denominator is being pushed so low the group can’t avoid hiest rates of premature death by venereal disease and homicide much less economically prosper in the best economy in the world for the upwardly mobile. And then there’s the crime numbers, what, some 15x as likely to end up in prison??
And you swear all this is just nurture, we’re not nurturing enough. So you presumably want more taxpayer’s dollare to nurture some more. You plan to get some more blacks into Paideia, you think that’s the answer to these stats? It is not the answer. Paideia is not the answer to the black dropout rate. Programs like this is much of the cause for the black dropout rate in Oakland.
Until OUSD puts together an education program that is appropriate for ghetto blacks, OUSD is going to continue to have a 50% plus drop rate with the concurrent morbidity and poverty rate amond the Oakland Blacks that at the moment are the core constituiency of OUSD. We need less college prep (as in almost none) and more Voc Ed, more military prep, more life skills, more home & consumer ed, and more socialization and deportment, more standard english and basic math, more PE and health (and weight control) and more apprenticeship and internships.
(4 year) College prep should be in a different campus. Jr College should be the primary route for all who can take additional training.
The (4 year) college bound can teach themselves as a practical matter, if the school doesn’t get in the way. No it’s not always that easy, but I think OUSD has to stop using the “college bound” as the sole excuse for ignoring and throwing out the far more numerous lower class black enrollment of OUSD.
December 23rd, 2010 at 12:39 pm
typr: Paragraph 3, “highest rates”
December 23rd, 2010 at 9:08 pm
Nextset- Don’t over-generalize what I said. I am not living in a fantasy world. I agree with many of your points, but disagree with the genetic argument. Don’t go into your liberal diatribe with me…wrong person. I didn’t say anything about tax payer dollars, but I do believe we need to strengthen elementary school programs so that kids succeed.
You need to relax and stop saying things like, “ghetto blacks”. It’s pretty disgusting to hear, even though you think it’s the truth. It demeans the many students who work hard in school, black or otherwise. Merry Christmas.
December 24th, 2010 at 11:04 am
Public School Teacher: OUSD has a drop out rate approaching 50% of the black students. Combine that with the black students who stick around OUSD but can’t write a letter or read a newspaper.
That’s a large number, and a large percentage of the OUSD population. These are the ghetto blacks I refer to. These are the people I argue OUSD is here to service, not the college bound. And “ghetto” is a very specific and useful word. It fully describes what you are dealing with here.
As far as being disgusting to hear, it’s supposed to be. OUSD has these people coming of age without the care that should have been given, especially given the money OUSD gets from the treasury. This group is not college bound. They should have been attended to better so that at age 18 they would have some skills to make a living with. I don’t believe that group have above average IQ but that doesn’t stop one from becoming marketable or from making a living.
The results are pretty clear and the OUSD students are not desired by employers or the military. That could be improved a lot. If the operation of OUSD changed a lot. And that improvement needs to come without any more money.
My concern over your conclusion that nuture is the answer is that I fear you and people like you will continue to berate blacks with IQs below 90 that they have to take college prep, plan to go to (4 yr) college, and other such craziness. I believe that bad behavior on the part of “educators” is what is driving the black drop rate and what is going to make it worse. I feel you believe anyone can jump through any/all the hoops – so you are going to waste time, money and opportunity and wreck every chance the ghetto blacks have to improve themselves and assimilate into society while at OUSD. Which is what we have here. Then when it happens the “educators” piously say “we don’t know what happened” and need a larger budget and pay raises for the teachers.
So I do feel that it’s important that policy makers in ghetto schools do understand the “nature” issues. I don’t think you do.
Brave New World.
December 24th, 2010 at 12:25 pm
Nextset-Once again, you are making a blanket statement about my beliefs which mirror what you think about everyone who challenges your theories. My point is that kids whose parents pay attention to them and value education, tend to do well or better in school. I’ve taught kids, black kids, who are in college now, and the two factors that distinguished them from their peers were active parents and the desire to do well in school. I repeatedly say that kids should not be passed along in elementary school until they master grade level skills. I believe that this problem escalates over time to where the kid is too far behind in high school.
So, where in my “liberal” argument did I say that everyone has to take a college prep curriculum?
December 24th, 2010 at 5:42 pm
PST: Reread your post #72.
Reread it again.
No. Ability to do well in calculus is not “cultural”. It is not a product of “two parents” in the home – etc. It has little or nothing to do with
Students with IQs below 100 are not going to do well in calculus, end of story. Much less IQs below 85. If your students are screened to have the chops for calculus and college prep classes, great for them.
But you should be screening first before you enroll them in such classes.
Even if they do have 2 parents at home. “Those who are successful often have parents who sit at the table with them and force them to complete their math problems.” which is your quote – is a nice passage but what you are not saying is that first and foremost is those who are successful (at calculus) have IQs above the white average of 100 – and most likely at or above the Asian/Jewish Average of 115.
Half of all students are below “average”, you understand, and ethnic & national averages are quite different. You can find high scoring students, good for you. Just don’t make this an important part of OUSD because your constituiency in Oakland is not interested in Calculus. And you can’t make them become interested.
I have a problem with OUSD taking the money they take and running off more than half the black students before graduation while you want to push calculus. I don’t see your calculus classes providing the return for Oakland Black Students that say, a Home Economics program would. Or an Academy of Hotel Housekeeping, or food service.
The college prep courses at OUSD can be had in one campus. What are you doing for the masses?
December 26th, 2010 at 11:03 am
Nextset, I implore you to resolve this coming year to dig a little deeper in your quest to analyze the weaknesses in Oakland schools. IQ is not purely genetic. IQ tests (which I don’t think are given in school anymore) were not given until a child was school age. A lot of learning goes on in the first five or six years of a child’s life. While there may be some genetic factors in one’s mental capacity, all kinds of environmental factors influence a person’s ability to learn. I agree with Public School Teacher that what goes on in the home is, in most cases, the biggest factor.
As an example, in my kindergarten class this year, I have at least six students who did not attend preschool. One started the year as a strong student. His mother had worked with him regularly at home. Since early in the year, I’ve been sending home learning aids (alphabet charts and individual letter cards, sight word cards, etc.) with students who are struggling, and I have instructed the families on how to use them. The students who have shown the most progress are the ones whose families have been using the materials regularly, and who make sure their children do the homework consistently. One has become one of my top students. (I neglected to mention earlier that our school population is predominantly African-American, as are all of the students I’m speaking of now.)
Fortunately, I have a parent volunteer who assists in my class for an hour and a half two mornings per week.
Between the two of us, we give as much assistance as possible to the struggling students. Recently, I’ve even resorted to letting a few restless (but strong) students tutor the weaker ones during our half hour rest period.
There is definitely a problem with African=American students achieving (and I am African-American also, by the way). But it has little to do with IQ and a whole lot to do with a lack in families’ ability or willingness to support their children’s education at home, and schools’ inability to, among other things, give extra academic support to students who do not get what they need at home.
December 27th, 2010 at 11:14 am
Let’s Get Real is correct. Modern scientific evidence is overwhelming that IQ differences between groups is not genetic. To site just one example: “When researchers tracked down the children born to German mothers and U.S. soldiers during the Allied occupation of Germany [after] World War II, they found no difference in the IQ scores of children with African-American versus European-American fathers.” (Steve Olson, Mapping Human History, p. 62).
And more news showing the problems of using student test scores to evaluate teachers:
New Teacher Evaluation Systems Face Numerous Hurdles
The New York Times (12/27, Otterman) reports, “It is becoming common practice nationally to rank teachers for their effectiveness, or value added, a measure that is defined as how much a teacher contributes to student progress on standardized tests. The practice was strongly supported by President Obama’s education grant competition, Race to the Top, and large school districts, including those in Houston, Dallas, Denver, Minneapolis and Washington, have begun to use a form of it.” However, “the experience in New York City shows just how difficult it can be to come up with a system that gains acceptance as being fair and accurate” as “rankings are based on an algorithm that few other than statisticians can understand, and on tests that the state has said were too narrow and predictable.”
And
Professor Finds That Evaluating Teachers Based On Test Scores Has Flaws
The Deseret Morning News (UT) (12/27, Loftus) reports, “The constant push for education reform has teachers feeling the pressure. A recent study by Lars Lefgren, an associate professor of economics at BYU, questions the importance of evaluating teachers based on student test score performance.” According to the Morning News, “Lefgren found that ‘most of the gains from a highly rated teacher vanish quickly. In reading, 87 percent of the benefit fades after one year. In math, 73 percent fades after one year.”
December 27th, 2010 at 6:31 pm
Catherine wrote: “Why we do not require extreme rigor in elementary school is beyond me. It is where students learn to think, learn to build their perseverance. Students who must work hard in elementary school learn self-motivation, self-discipline, and self-direction.”
Rigor keeps being thrown around–I am still not sure what it means. Could you give explicit examples of your understanding of rigor at the first grade, third grade and fifth grade levels?
Mr. Weinberg: I think it’s important to dig deep at those “highly effective” teachers’ scores as well. I, for one, know of “highly effective” teachers whose students are not proctored, have had high levels of erasures for years and are seen as awesome teachers, but maybe, really are not. Look at Redwood Heights’ wonderful teacher, how many more are there like that? Perhaps the non-”effective” teachers just don’t know how to test effectively (wink-wink). The tests are supposed to be standardized but test delivery is not. What do you think?
December 27th, 2010 at 10:43 pm
Jesse, Over ten years of examining test scores results for many schools in the district, I have seen only a handful of results that look like they might have resulted from cheating by the teachers. I think teachers are, as a group, extremely honest and ethical. But I think that if tests like the CSTs are used to determine whether or not teachers keep their jobs, there will be many more incidents of cheating (most of which will not be caught). I think of the explanations I read several years ago about why Barry Bonds started using steroids. The authors of the stories said that Bonds was upset that less able players were setting records by using steroids, and that he had to do so also to have a fair chance. I can see this happening easily in schools as well. People who would normally never consider giving kids answers might do so if they thought that everybody else was and that they might lose their job if they did not.
Harvard education professor Daniel Koretz, in his book, Measuring Up, points out a greater problem than individual cheating, and that is teaching to the test so that the tests are no longer a random sampling of student knowledge and the results are no longer valid. He also sites studies from fields outside education that show similar patterns of “numbers cooking,” for example, hospitals know they will be ranked based on the success ratio of certain operations, so they refuse to perform those operations on high risk patients who could have benefited from them.
December 28th, 2010 at 8:55 am
Jesse James: A colleague of mine who teaches first grade teaches rigor in writing these two ways: she will use a word they are studying, such as “transportation” – using the letters only as many times as they appear in the word transportation, the students must find as many words contained within the word as they can. She works in a Title 1 – Flatland school. She is African American as is many of her students. These students work for up to 35 minutes at a time – which will be increased to 50 minutes before the end of the year working on finding words within transportation. The students who work rigorously (5, 6 and 7 year olds) can find on average 40 – 65 words.
Many other teachers who teach first grade would say this is nearly impossible for first grade students to stay on task for 35 minutes – they would say that there should be “starters” or the teacher should be walking around prompting students.
When the students are looking for words this teacher is able to work independently one-on-one with struggling students. Other students learn to build their time working.
I have sixth grade students who cannot write independently for 35 minutes. Just to see how my students compared I used the word “Gingerbread” on the Friday before break and asked sixth graders to come up with as many words as they could – my colleague was to ask the first graders to do the same thing.
The results – the students in first grade and the students in sixth grade came up with roughly the same number of words (6 year olds and 12 year olds) – The six year olds were able to stick with the task more easily than the 12 year olds. What do this “prove.” Nothing really – however, I would rather have a six year old building that mental muscle early – learning how to think critically.
Jesse – I don’t think you realize what we are asked to do as teachers – we are told to scaffold anything and everything that is difficult – we are to create sentences starters where our sixth graders fill in the remainder of the sentence. We are to have small groups so that students work together rather than having to depend on their own self-discipline. When my students ask why they can’t do every project or writing assignment in groups – I used to ask myself what the students will do when they have to take a driving test, college entrance exam, or write a scholarship essay. Without group work, pair-share work, or whole class, students do not have the rigorous self-determination and self-motivation to stay on task with writing or projects that takes an hour or more.
Rigor means you work at something just beyond your mental grasp and you have assignments which require ever-advancing working that is just beyond grasp. You master each assignment or set of tasks and work hard on the new tasks.
In this two weeks I have spent time reflecting on the “gifts” my students gave me with their words Friday, December 16- “Ms. M. Why are you so strict?” “Ms. M, this is too hard.” “Ms. M. I need heeelllppp!” “Ms. M. Why do I need to know how to find words – why do you keep saying vocabulary, vocabulary, vocabulary – people know what I mean?” All of these statements were said because students were asked to come up with words in the word gingerbread – first graders 42 -sixth graders 40.
December 28th, 2010 at 9:10 am
The second way the teacher teaches rigor is to write a sentence on the board such as “The best birthday party I ever had . . . ” students in the first grade must then write for 35 to 40 minutes using writing with all five senses – begin each sentence with a capital letter, end each sentence with an appropriate end mark (student know the terms declarative sentence, exclamatory sentence and interrogative sentence and the appropriate end marks based on the type of sentence) and use commas and capital letters appropriately. The vast majority of my sixth graders cannot name the three types of sentences and match them up to the appropriate end mark. Most do not know what to capitalize and often have every word in sentences begin with a lower case letter.
Rigor is the expectation that at each grade the writing will be better. The writing will improve in punctuation and the vocabulary of writing will also increase.
The vast majority of my sixth grade students have a working vocabulary of 500 works – about the same as my colleague’s first grade class – for some of my students they actually have a vocabulary that is noticeably smaller that the first grade students.
Once again, both populations come from poverty / working class backgrounds, are English learners or standard English learners and are students of color. This difference – rigor. It is not rigorous when we say in sixth grade – Sentences that tell need a period when students should have learned declarative sentences end with a period. To do so is demeaning to the rest of the students. It also says if you slack, it’s okay, I and the rest of the class will dumb down with you. Yet, this is what is asked of most Oakland teachers every day. Just as a English learner or standard English learner can learn the word “tell” they can also learn the word “declarative.” Declarative is rigorous – Tell is not rigorous.
Jesse James – I hope these two small examples clear up any misconceptions about my use of the term RIGOROUS.
December 28th, 2010 at 12:48 pm
Let’s Get Real: OK I’m implored.
And I implore OUSD and it’s teachers to produce a different result with the black students of OUSD (and by this I mean all of them, including those that are processed into dropping out).
Stop running the black ghetto kids out of education.
Make the black children employable or productive at 18 – like the white children tend to be.
Get the black children’s reading and verbal level up to at least the white 8th grade average – by age 18.
Train the black children to assimilate into mainstream – read that “white” society.
Train the OUSD black children to avoid the criminal justice system – as victims or criminals – and to avoid premature death from trauma and disease.
I could go on but the above points seem like I’m asking too much. I don’t believe OUSD believes it has any responsibility whatsoever for these things.
Which is why “schools” like OUSD do a disservice to the black kids. Such “schools” fool the kids and their parent into thinking they are “educated” when they are not.
Merry Xmas, Happy New Year!
December 30th, 2010 at 3:00 pm
Nextset, I think most OUSD faculty and administrators have the best interest of all Oakland students at heart. Unfortunately, as has been the case in many other urban districts with large numbers of African-American students, there has not been a strong enough focus on discipline and academic support. Disruptive behavior is a huge time-waster, and students who come to school ill-prepared academically need lots of extra support. When OUSD officials finally get the picture and make adjustments in school policy and funding accordingly, we will begin to see significant improvement.
By the way, Nextset, as a professional male African-American, you would make a great role model for our students. You should consider becoming a mentor or, if you’re retired, a classroom volunteer. We can use all the help we can get.
Happy holidays to you, and all other blog readers!
December 30th, 2010 at 9:09 pm
Let’s get real: Do you REALLY feel that GATE identified students of color in program improvement schools (elementary and middle school) are a priority for OUSD administration? Do your really, truly believe that OUSD works to help them achieve their potential?
I would be really curious to know. I do not know of one single program improvement elementary or middle school who has done anything to advance the academic rigor or “differentiate” learning for the GATE students of color. I could be wrong and if so I know that someone on this list will be able to enlighten me. For the most part these students are not disruptive, give the schools decent to good test scores and whose parents do not know their rights so they do not complain.
December 31st, 2010 at 1:43 am
Catherine, my post was a reference to Nextset’s comment and was meant to address his concerns about underachieving African-American students. You are correct that more should be done to meet the needs of high-achievers, as well.
Differentiation is going on to some degree, and administrators are pushing for teachers to challenge their advanced students. But at the same time there is overwhelming pressure for teachers to move their lowest students to proficiency, and that becomes the main focus for teachers and administrators alike. This is especially true in schools where many students are scoring basic or below on the state test.
You will see more going on in the way of enrichment in schools where the number of advanced students is greater, and where the parents (generally) are able to raise funds to provide special programs, etc. I think funding for the GATE program has diminished significantly, and that affects all GATE students, regardless of color or school.
Some elementary schools have an ELA and math computer program called SuccessMaker which is individualized so students can move forward at their own pace. The struggling students keep getting similar questions until they get enough correct to advance. The advanced students keep moving forward as far as they can–even to the next program. Even my kindergartners enjoy our SuccessMaker time, and my stronger students are definitely getting challenged. In the classroom, I generally differentiate during periods of independent work, allowing advanced students to do more challenging assignments.
Hopefully, you’ll get some more feedback from other teachers, but I hope this at least partly addresses your concern.
December 31st, 2010 at 12:50 pm
Let’s Get Real: I bring up the subject of gifted kids of color because they contribute to the “brain drain” facing Oakland at the end of 5th grade. A number of students I expected to see in 6th grade based on conversations with the local 5th grade teachers’ GATE identified students in the flats often does not come to fruition.
When the teachers ask the younger siblings of these students they are often in public schools in other districts or have been recruited with EXTREMELY reduced tuition (as much as 95%) for private schools in the area. Again, these are the high performing kids who do not cause disruption in the classroom.
Oakland is at a crossroads. I understand the need of Tony and the school board need to address the issue of students of color – Title 1 and school money gives approximately $11,000 – $12,000 per student – when you add in the other money not being used for Title 1 GATE kids – often the district can spend $15,000 per truly “at risk” student – is that enough to make up for absentee parents, gangs around the school, weapons, teen and pre-teen pregnancy? Probably not, but by not spending the money to help highly motivated and gifted students of color move ahead in science and social studies instead of just concentrating on math and language arts – in many cases this does not even include heavy doses of writing or rich vocabulary development.
What I think should be done is what is required at our school beginning this year. Every week we must provide written lesson plans that address the needs of the GATE / highly motivated students for 60% of the classes / class time. This means that at least three days per week I am required to have writing assignments that require additional depth, deconstruction of ideas in literature, vocabulary using Greek and Latin roots with affixes, mapping of sentences and paragraphs, examples of excellent writing in literature or periodicals and so on. I must also spend 20% of EACH class period devoted to the needs of the high achieving students so that other students see what grade level and more complex work looks like from our students.
I really believe until we begin addressing the needs of gifted and highly motivated students of color in our flat land schools we will see a continual decrease in overall test scores in middle and high school, we will continue to see a larger percentage of students dropping out (fewer students in middle and high – same or similar number of dropouts = higher percentage of dropouts per student population) and the brain drain will continue and more parents realize that their students are capable of doing the work to get them into Cal and private universities if only they are given access to the increasing complex math and science required.
December 31st, 2010 at 1:49 pm
Catherine, At the school I worked at, Frick Middle, we have done a number of things over the years to help GATE and other high achieving students of color (all we have at Frick) advance. For several years we offered special math sections for advanced students starting in sixth grade, and when those students reached 8th grade our number of student Proficient or above in Algebra increased substantially. Later we set up an advanced track for all academic subjects. (We justified this by reducing class sizes in all the other sections.) Again the math scores showed improvement, but it not seem to make much of a difference for the other subjects. Last year there was no ability-grouping, but class sizes for all students were reduced substantially and we had the best tests scores the school has ever had in every subject except Algebra. (Based on my experiences I believe that ability grouping is vital in math, but not necessary for other subjects, but so many things affect student test scores each year it is hard to draw firm conclusions.)
Overall the GATE students we have had at Frick have continued the rate of growth they showed in elementary school and left for high school well prepared for challenging course there.
December 31st, 2010 at 2:29 pm
An interesting issue was brought up in the above posts.
PSAT and SAT scores overpredict black success in college. Ditto GPA. Black students will drop out at a higher rate than the white students regardless of higher scores.
Thus if a college admissions office is trying to avoid miss-matching the black students with the school and it’s mainstream students they might need to hold out for higher scores on an applicant if the applicant is black. This is especially true in Law School & Med School.
I suspect this is because of negative cultural behaviors and values the black students tend to bring with them. If you are mentoring black students at any level you tend to have to start with the basics – things the white/jewish competitors already understand.
December 31st, 2010 at 2:54 pm
Nextset: I know that this is true when you look at Cal graduation rates for black and Hispanic / Latino students. I believe that this is why is critical that we do ability grouping – not for test scores and not for college ADMISSIONS – but for long term academic and career excellence of black and brown kids.
GATE kids recognize patterns – they will often score well on standardized tests. This is how they were identified as GATE in Oakland – through the Ravens Progressive Matrices (a non-verbal PATTERN test or by two consecutive years of advanced scores on the CST).
While I understand what Steven is saying about math – my concern is how GATE and high potential (maybe missed GATE cutoff by a few points) students can write high level essays – understand relevance of math across disciplines of science, architecture, religion (the Koran is based on the prime number 19) and such subjects. In other school districts these are the topics – deeper rather than wider or earlier – that high performing students are able to access.
I still believe that if we do not want to continue the brain drain of Oakland we must consider the needs of our black and brown GATE students. As Nextset pointed out, he is rare in his black background. We need to have students not just enter high school and college, but have the background to succeed once they are there. Why all middle schools do not offer geometry to students who finish algebra is 7th grade is beyond me. Dozens of countries recognize that students who “see” or “sense” patterns in abstract thought can tackle algebra in fifth, sixth or seventh grade without a great deal of difficulty (this is not to say they don’t have to work hard – only that the material is within grasp).
Even if we keep more students of color actually graduating and having blue collar careers or acceptance in college, we will still have poor ratios if other schools and / or districts are siphoning off our top talent.
May 19th, 2011 at 1:29 pm
I could point out that this article does a lot of public school bashing but gives little advice on how to fix the system. I could also rip this article in twain for being so oblivious to the reasons why private schools are more involved with their students than public schools. A better student/teacher ratio is one. Teachers being paid more to do more is another. But why worry about that when I could talk about what I believe the real problem is with the public vs. private school debate.
I went to Oakland Tech and was a paidea student. My desk was the one right in front of Ms.Wolfe in the picture at the top of this blog. I’ll try to keep my comments short, but it is hard to do so with such a complicated subject.
Ms. Kathy or Shipp (I’m not sure which one wrote the article) needs to realize the position of entitlement they are coming from. Most of the students at Oakland Tech do not have the money to choose between public and private schools. While I understand that you need to make the best choice for your children, I implore you to think about the implications of your decision.
One student going to CPS or Bishop O’Dowd will probably not change the academic atmosphere at Oakland Tech. However, if ten or twenty talented students are taken out of the school, the learning environment changes. As a tutor at the boys and girls club, I have seen firsthand the amount of knowledge a student without a proper social/familial network can pick up over time in a proper learning environment. If there are enough capable students in a classroom that concentrates on success, the expectations will be raised for everyone in the class. In my experience, higher expectations have always produced higher results.
Oakland Tech needs motivated students to change the atmosphere of the school. While Paidea classes are great and have helped formed me into the awesome young man I am today, there is a huge problem with the rest of Oakland Tech which I believe the article touches upon quite nicely. A majority of the teachers at the school are not good at their jobs and/or do not care about their students. I had to wait many times for Ms. Brantley to show up to her 3rd period class and give the worst spanish classes possible. My friends routinely complained about how dumb Mr. Chan’s lesson plans and grading system were. This is not to say that paidea and engineering are the only good classes in the school; Ms. Chai and Ms. Keeran are some of the finest teachers I’ve ever had the pleasure to study under, but there is a large portion of the school that can have their entire schedule filled with crappy teachers. As a long time liberal and believer in unions, it pains me to say this, but we need to find a way to hold these teachers accountable.
Anyway, I am spiraling away from your all important children. Going to a public school vs a private school will not decide much about the quality of their futures. If you are involved enough in your child’s life to debate public vs. private school, you are probably already giving them the foundation they need to thrive. The decisions your kids (not you) make within these schools will determine what happens to them and the people they develop into. Both public and private schools have drug dealers and idiots walking their halls. If kids want to get into bad things, they will. If you want to have your child be a good, hard working person, they have to hold these values before a public or private school can corrupt them.
I need to end this little tirade so let me emphasize a few key points and shut up.
1.No matter what school you choose, your child will be able to find a place to thrive. It will be harder at some places than at others, but Oakland Tech is abound with opportunities.
2.The biggest problem I have with a talented student going to private school is that it deprives public school students the chance to learn from him or her. A good learning atmosphere can be pulled out of public high schools. The example of a good classmate is much more valuable than a good teacher.
3.This entire public vs. private school debate is geared toward parents with the means to send their child to private school. The majority of these students will be fine regardless of what school they go to. The debate needs to involve students that cannot go to private school and are at a much higher risk of failing, dropping out, and turning toward inauspicious ways to make a living . THIS IS A SOCIETAL ISSUE, NOT JUST A PERSONAL ONE.
4.A lot of teachers don’t care about their students and should be fired.
5.A lot of parents care only for their kids and should be chastised by society.
The key to public education working is everyone, including current private school students, teacher and administrators, using all the resources possible to fix public education. The fact of the matter is that private school is a large drain on resources that could go to the betterment of an entire generation, not just part of it. As it stands, those that can go to private school get a much better education while those who can’t have suffered from going to an institution that is hemorrhaging money. Like it or not, private education and charter schools are harming public education by pulling funds away from it.
Of course private schools are more involved with their students. Less people to worry about plus more money equals more involvement in a child’s life. The real question we must address is what happens to the students that can’t afford private school? They are the majority. Should they just be left to figure out the remnants of a system that the upper class has left behind or should public education be fixed and become a valuable resource for everyone?
If you would like to talk more on the subject, my email is tvernon23@gmail.com.
May 19th, 2011 at 1:44 pm
I must say one last thing which I hesitate to add only because it will draw attention from my other, more pressing points. I am an African-American male. Never once did any paidea teacher do or say any racist thing to anyone during my time Tech. The sad reality of the situation is that there are few African-American males that come to Tech with the scholastic ability to pass paidea classes. There is a surplus of white and asian kids that can keep up with the work. Yes there is a problem that there aren’t more black male faces in AP classes, but do not blame that on the teachers that have given me and anyone who can keep up a fantastic education.
May 19th, 2011 at 2:02 pm
Thanks for sharing your perspective, Trevor. Do you think there’s anything Oakland Tech could do to bring more black and Latino students into these successful programs? If you were in charge of the program (or the school — or the district, for that matter), what would you do to change the status quo?
May 19th, 2011 at 2:22 pm
Trevor Vernon: An interesting post, but you seem to take it for granted that collectivism is the way to go, and that people in general share your interest in collectivism.
Moreover you don’t seem to allow for ethnic and cultural value differences in the population. High IQ populations may or may not have an interest in self sacrifice for the collective good (actually they don’t). Their decision – and it is theirs to make – to associate with the lower SES students is first required for any of their magic to rub off on the proles (I think that’s your point). You can’t put guns to their heads and make them attend Oakland Schools.
So in the end it may not matter what people think or what people want. The “people” vote with their feet. And right now, the polls do not favor (cognitively) integrated schools.
So what must happen is everybody takes care of number one and we see what the results are. The most the government can do about it is to have a large selection of schools that various people would like to attend. Like we did in 1965.
Or like we still do in Piedmont. I doubt people avoid the place because they hate the schools.
I would argue that all the problems with OUSD are as a result of the refusal to operate the schools as a good-better-best set of (cognitively) segregated campuses each open to district wide enrollment but each run to different standards of performance, deportment and academic programs which are enforced. The herd of students would to a large degree self select and the standards enforced by flunking out and forcible transfers to lesser schools of students who fail a given schools’ requirements. One would think that such a school system run without a concern for racial balance or any other PC issue would not have the problems OUSD has now with attendance or performance. Teachers would be happier and so would students.
In a free society you can’t make students attend your bad schools filled with bad students. If your desired demographic refuses to enroll or attend your schools, you know what you have to do. Run better schools. How hard can that be? Look at what San Francisco Unified has done with Lowell High.
May 19th, 2011 at 2:25 pm
Trevor,
Well thought out,and well reasoned(albeit just a little naive). Well done young man!
May 19th, 2011 at 2:39 pm
Next,
The problem isn’t about IQ(hard work and diligence can pretty much close that gap up to the point of genius). The problem is mainly attitude and indifference. Family wealth and influence can secure a degree for anyone. There are problems with the affirmative action(quota system)merit has taken a back seat to entitlement in this country, and we all suffer for it.
May 19th, 2011 at 4:23 pm
J.R. I think you’re wrong.
Low IQ cannot be fixed by hard work and diligence. It is what it is and the person involved is always going to be more vulnerable to certain risks and hazards than a normal person.
While there are certain things you can do to train a willing and compliant low IQ person, you cannot just fix it. You do the best you can. Some people in addition to having an IQ of 85 have other risk factors such a mood disorders, predisposition to drugs and alcohol, and issues with sexuality and personality disorders such as conduct disorders or worse, antisocial personality disorder. You can have these if you’re smart but having them as a low IQ person is gas on the fire.
The people we see in the criminal courts have plenty of these issues with low IQ being one the the first. The cognitive deficits keep them from learning how to function well with the other disorders fueling the drama.
May 19th, 2011 at 8:47 pm
Nextset,
If we’re talking about normal IQ which is 90-110(also where the majority of people are nestled). Dulls(as you call them) are below 80 and not all that common statistically(do you see where I’m going with this)? Most people are average or better and thus are capable of meeting state standards(which are minimums relative to grade level). For the majority of people there is no valid excuse for not achieving standard grade level work(aside from retardation, spectrum disability, or mental disorder. For most people it comes down to attitude,effort and fortitude. There are also some valid scientific claims about exposure to lead and low academic performance that no doubt are a factor as well. The fact is you make far too much of this IQ thing, it just does not come into play in the real world that often to be applicable here in this situation.
May 20th, 2011 at 7:37 am
J.R.
Normal IQ varies by race and by nation. There is just no other way around that – we have too much data. Why is not the issue, the scores are stable. Whether the varience is rooted in genetics, diet, breast feeding habits, or anything else – these numbers are not going to change within the lifespan of the populations involved.
The life of a CA resident with IQs of 65, 85, 95, 115, 135 are starkly different. And then we have the other personality and behaviorial profiles besides (strictly) IQ. What about the age of onset of puberty? I believe the latest data says 23% of black girls are entering puberty at 8. How does that affect OUSD’s lesson plans? Especially comparing the blacks to the Southeast Asians? And then we have certain other traits which are genetic. Ever work with a groups of native Indians? Maybe OUSD doesn’t have to either. My point is people are different.
You cannot expect public school teachers to have similar progress or program participation for each group. And you can’t pay based on this or puniosh the teachers based on performance of different groups. People are not the same.
Granted the basic performance required for High School Graduation should be reachable by most IF we don’t artificially jack up the graduation requirements to screw certain groups which is the trend lately. Liberals want to make college a norm which it can never be. They think all are equal so there’s no harm is steadily increasing requirements (beyond basic) damn the consequences. Remember, it takes only very small increases in requirements to get very big racial variances in graduation rates. Likewise DMV imposing time pressure testing for driver’s licenses.
May 20th, 2011 at 8:50 am
@Trevor Vernon, I don’t know all the folks who teach at Tech, but I think your evaluation of the staff (as a whole) is way off. Engineering and Paideia are well known, established programs. But, I have heard wonderful things about the Health Academy, TRYUMF, Performing Arts and PE Department’s (Hockey in Oakland!) at Tech. Does anyone know any other Tech students who might be interested in sharing their opinion(s) of the school?
May 20th, 2011 at 1:13 pm
Oh wow, a lot of things to address.
Katy Murphy: I don’t think there is much that Oakland Tech can do to get more black and latino students into advanced programs. If you’re struggling to keep up in 9th grade, it seems like a near impossible task to pass a class designed for college freshmen while in high school. Elementary and middle schools have to prepare students properly if they are to have a chance at higher level classes. Easier said than done. The best indicator for a child’s success is the involvement and expectations of a parent/guardian. Minority parents have to be more involved in their children’s education if they are to succeed. I have no idea how to do that. Parenting is hard.
I want to stress again though that race should not be the issue here. Poverty is the issue.
Nextset: You have some wild ideas. I disagree with you, but I am a fan of your out of the box style of thinking.
Yes, my response was an appeal for collectivism. Yes, collectivism fails because it is a system that requires everyone to get on board. No, I do not think the public shares my belief in collectivism. That is why I am frustrated. We need to think like a group but we lose this when it comes to educating each individual child. Turning attention from charter and private schools to fixing public education will probably not happen soon, but that does not mean I should to stop fighting for this change. Just because a majority feels a certain way does not mean they are right.
I don’t want to put a gun to people’s heads to make them go to Oakland Tech. I want to make Oakland Tech a place where everyone has access to a quality education. My whole point is that the people who are “voting with their feet” are screwing over everyone else. I’d much rather have everyone be able to read and write at an average level than have 20% (number off the top of my head) be excellent students while the rest suffer.
I wouldn’t like to send good student to bad schools either. I’d like to eliminate bad schools and students all together. You seem to think this is impossible. We’re talking about getting kids though high school. Hard work can get the dullest of students through most college level classes. (Believe me, I went to UCSC.) You’re thought on IQ is wrong and borders on eugenics. Prepared students can pass classes.
As I’ve said before, I’d rather address a public issue more than an ethnic/cultural one. You said on the subject, “you don’t seem to allow for ethnic and cultural value differences in the population.” We’re talking about reading, writing, and low level math. If a culture or ethnicity has a problem with its people achieving these scholastic goals, that part of the culture needs to be dropped. Cultures can be in the wrong. Change is possible.
One last thing you said: “So what must happen is everybody takes care of number one and we see what the results are.” This is stupid. Lets change the results now. We can avoid an uneducated lower class.
JR: We’re on the same page. My response was a little pie in the sky, but why not talk a big game on a blog.
Harold: No doubt there are great parts of Oakland Tech. I got a top class education while I was there. I don’t want to stomp on the reputations of teachers that don’t deserve it. Overall though, the school is in disarray. I kind of think of Paidea and engineering as a SF City hall metaphor. It looks great, but there are a lot of homeless people on the steps. Sit in on a few of the classes that aren’t put in the spotlight and you’ll see what I mean. You’ll be hard pressed to find a Tech student that thinks the school provides a quality education outside of the programs you’ve listed.
May 20th, 2011 at 3:29 pm
Trevor Vernon: You’re young. It shows in your thinking. I can say that because I was your age once and I can remember the difference in thought processes.
Your points are rooted in wishful thinking – magical thinking as some call it. Fundamentally you want things to be as you please and you’re not experienced (yet) in dealing with life as it is. That’s going to come to you soon enough.
You speak of the black families as if they think the way you do now and they want their kids to “go to college” and all the other great things you seem to think everybody wants. That’s a common liberal thing – they cannot see through the eyes of others. They really think they can (factually, morally, etc) impose their worldview, their pleasures and their desires on other free people who want none of it.
News Flash – most Oakland black kids and their families don’t want to “go to college” because they have no intention whatsoever of doing the prerequisites (much less the “college” work). Remember this is Oakland, the city where 50% or so of the black students drop out of secondary school. The same people don’t want a lot of other things you might think of as normal – handwashing, for example, sexual restraint, for example, keeping the radios turned down, for example. You get the idea.
People have different tastes in food, music, narcotics, whatever. That tastes includes doing homework or reading a book also. To each his own, you don’t get to make other people do anything they don’t feel like doing.
You say: “If a culture or ethnicity has a problem with its people achieving these scholastic goals, that part of the culture needs to be dropped. Cultures can be in the wrong. Change is possible.”
By this you mean that you are the dictator of these people and by golly they’d better do as they are told.
Good luck with that.
As I said, you are young.
You have only begun to come nose to nose with people who are very much capable of whatever violence they want as you go through your daily routine.
You don’t get to be the boss of anyone. And neither does this government. You cannot have a welfare state like this one and command people to live life your way. People do what they want.
And right now that includes cutting taxes and cutting government spending. This isn’t 1965 where we were coming off decades of the post-WWII expansion of budgets and government and there was always more of everything tomorrow.
And as far as the IQ thing – deal with it, it’s not going away. It’s not here just because you don’t want it to be here. Get to know people in the various IQ bands and understand the differences and the distinctions of how they are going to live and how they are going to die. If you are a parent – or a teacher – and you are trying to “help” 4 boys and 4 girls with the different scores, a 75, a 85, a 95 and a 115 you try and figure an appropriate school schedule, a career path, medical & legal issues – even birth control methods… See what it’s like.
Now try envisioning being a OUSD teacher with a class of 35 with the typical distribution in a 9th grade.
OUSD has a terrible job to accomplish. It’s tough. What they’ve done is say adios to most of the blacks (dropouts) – that is their solution.
May 20th, 2011 at 3:32 pm
In rereading that above post I don’t want to go off on a tangent about the stats on VD and such. They are a problem but that’s not to say everybody has the problem. Just way too much of certain people. Anyway the schools have decided to ignore health and race because there’s only so much they can be expected to cover and the racial disparity in health outcomes is not an OUSD responsibility. Sorry about bringing that up here.
It’s another sore subject with me. Some people are getting worse on health and mortality since the glory days of the 1960s.
May 21st, 2011 at 7:32 pm
Nextset: You are old. I can say that because you called me young.
What’s wrong with wishful thinking? This is how I think the world can be. Hard work can get us there.
Black families don’t want their children to go to college? They don’t wash their hands or show sexual restraint? Dude, you’re a racist. I’m sure that’s not the first time you’ve been called that, so don’t let it get to you. Who cares what some young idiot thinks?
I don’t want to be the ruler of anything. I want to argue for my position, have people see the logic in my thought, and hopefully get them to agree with me. I’m just a broke dude with a computer, not some sort of socialist obama-appointed czar.
The civil rights movement was only half a century ago and now the president is black. The status quo (like a high drop out rate) can change.
Really though, we’re just a couple of dummies butting heads on the internet. Go ahead and think what you want to think.
May 22nd, 2011 at 5:49 pm
I kind of like what Vernon says Nextset. You are old…But Vernon remember that Nextset’s generation had to be better than equal to get ahead. you owe him that respect.
Vernon has probably given an accurate picture of many schools, not just Tech- a few spots of competence and even brilliance surrounded by lackluster educators treading water and blaming “the kids” for all their troubles. However if the Padeia program is “great” it would raise all boats in the harbor, not just the performance of Asian and Caucasian students with a small smattering of Blacks. Tech’s CST scores clearly show this program is elitist, and what is teaching but taking what you have and making it better. It is not enough to say “the kids are not prepared” and let it go at that. Where are the recruitment efforts, where are the feeder honors classes in middle school, where are the seminars and articulation efforts to get more students into the program, where is an open enrollment program which allows anyone with the desire to take Padeia classes? They are afraid. This is clearly an administrative failing as well as a failure of the teachers in that program. What is their legacy- we taught all the smart kids? Anyone can do that.
May 22nd, 2011 at 6:52 pm
Is it “fair” for students who studied hard in Middle School to sit around why the Teacher is trying every type of differentiated instructional tool, to catch up half of the classroom?
Everyone can’t got to UC Berkeley. Or, are we going to let every one in there too (sink or swim)?
Why does everyone expect public schools to make miracles, but don’t have the same expectation for higher education?
College prep for all (high school students) is the DUMBEST thing to come out of OUSD in decades!
The Engineering and Paideia programs have been at Tech for nearly thirty years. There’s no secret. No racism keeping anyone out. You just have to have the requisite knowledge to get in and thrive.
Here’s a question i know won’t get answered: Why does OUSD socially promote unprepared Middle School students to High school? I know a few kids from a couple of OUSD Middle Schools who earned all F’s in eight grade, but somehow the High School Teacher is supposed to turn that child into someone ready for College Prep coursework by the tenth grade at a school like Tech? Really??
May 23rd, 2011 at 7:56 am
“Why does OUSD socially promote unprepared Middle School students to High school? I know a few kids from a couple of OUSD Middle Schools who earned all F’s in eight grade, but somehow the High School Teacher is supposed to turn that child into someone ready for College Prep coursework by the tenth grade at a school like Tech? Really??”
This is exactly one of the points of contention, in many cases the whole system is breaking down and letting far too many kids slip through the cracks(which in some cases are chasms). Kids are not being educated, they are just being passed through the system.Why aren’t these kids even learning the basics early on? Multiple people are not doing their job of educating children. We are in fact running a jobs program for adults within the education system(there are of course exceptions to this rule). The point is Harold, these students were passed on through the early years without mastering the basics and therefore weren’t able to handle much of anything resembling rigorous work later on. Parents,admin, children and teachers are all to blame when this happens.
May 23rd, 2011 at 10:00 am
Harold (#109) brings up a good point. Suppose Mary is a visual learner, and Egbert is a kinesthetic learner (assuming that those terms have any scientific validity [see discussion here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Learning_styles#The_2009_APS_Critique.
Classroom A uses one form of instruction. Mary learns 80% of the material, and Egbert learns 40%
Classroom B uses differentiated instruction. Mary learns 60% of the material, and Egbert also learns 60%.
It is not even remotely obvious to me that Classroom B is more “fair” than Classroom A. In each case, one student is falling short of his or her potential.
May 23rd, 2011 at 11:52 am
Trevor Vernon: Don’t think just because you are young that you can spout off all the fantasy ideas for as long as you like. It’s later than you think. I know of people younger than you (likely) who were years away from their peers in their teens and very early 20s in classwork and in career placement. They worked with adults as equals and they started college early and fit in as peers with those who were older. You don’t sound like you will make that cut.
So what I’m saying is that Childhood’s Over – you need to get into life and participate as an adult. That means seeing first hand what works and what doesn’t and watching people you like “not make it”. It doesn’t take too long to become far more pragmatic that you are. In the meantime you would do well to analyze contrary views rather than at 18 or whatever you are, climbing on a horse taller than you are.
Cries of “racist” are the sign of a weak mind. That you’re resorting to that in public discourse marks you. Not only do you have a pie in the sky idea of how people are (typical for a product of your “schools”) but you think you can emote and discount strangers decades older than you without analyzing their points and perspective. You need to realize you have been trained not to do that – someone like me – a more educated and experienced person in the professions can see you coming and simply hire a better applicant. These debates are not about whether we like each other. They are about policy.
Perhaps because you know I’m black you have become emotional thinking I am some how betraying some obligation to you or your politics. Again, very bad school training for a young graduate. Typical training at OUSD I understand. You are perhaps going to work in industry or attend higher ed where you will certainly run into competitors who can make roadkill out of you. The more lethal ones might actually smile at you. Do you think strangers owe you anything? Your training as displayed is not that of someone I expect to do well in a competitive college program, any competitive program. That is my experience and it’s no fun to see people I’d like to do well fail because they won’t change and they enjoy thinking about life as you do now. (The behavior persists across many fields of thought and endeavor – refusal to be analytical and being driven on emotion once established gets in the way of all higher study.)
Back to the points at hand. What part of 50% black drop rate do you not understand as you argue for more college prep at OUSD? What part of the Black scoring gaps in basic literacy and skills do you not understand? This thread is about the drop rate in the College Prep program & OUSD in general. My point is that OUSD needs to stop the emphasis on college prep and raising graduation requirements, slam all of it into reverse, and start fielding programs that get the black population safely into basic literacy, deportment skills and job readiness reserving the college prep programs for those (of any ethnicity) that say they want it and satisfy the prerequisites to go to the smaller separate campuses where such programs would be housed. Cramming unwanted college prep into the dull students is what’s creating the historically high black drop rates and the higher requirements create bars to graduation that are unreasonable.
And I don’t care if you or anyone else thinks this is “racist”. Save us from white liberals.
Brave New World.
May 23rd, 2011 at 1:41 pm
J.R.:
You asked the question: ““Why does OUSD socially promote unprepared Middle School students to High school?”
The short answer is that the School Board ignores the fact that the policies the Board passed ending social promotion in the 90s was dropped by the State Administration under Randy Ward and the Board has not acted to put promotion policy in place. Few principals had been trained in the Board’s policy ending social promotion prior to the Board’s promotion policy being dropped when Randy Ward replaced most of the Oakland School Board policies with the model policies of the California School Board Association. Even today there is no School Board policy on promotion prior to the Board policy on graduation.
When the District’s policy was in place, the District put in place a report card that is standard’s based and is still used for elementary schools.
In the 90s the State legislature passed Ed Code that requires each school board to pass regulations ending social promotion in compliance with the following:
48070. The governing board of each school district and each county superintendent of schools shall adopt policies regarding pupil promotion and retention. A pupil shall be promoted or retained only as provided in the policies adopted pursuant to this article.
48070.5. (a) In addition to the policy adopted pursuant to Section 48070, the governing board of each school district and each county board of education shall, in those applicable grade levels, approve a
policy regarding the promotion and retention of pupils between the
following grades:
(1) Between second grade and third grade.
(2) Between third grade and fourth grade.
(3) Between fourth and fifth grade.
(4) Between the end of the intermediate grades and the beginning
of middle school grades which typically occurs between sixth grade
and seventh grade, but may vary depending upon the grade configuration of the school or school district.
(5) Between the end of the middle school grades and the beginning of high school which typically occurs between eighth grade and ninth grade, but may vary depending upon the grade configuration of the school or school district.
(b) The policy shall provide for the identification of pupils who should be retained and who are at risk of being retained in their current grade level on the basis of either of the following:
(1) The results of the assessments administered pursuant to Article 4 (commencing with Section 60640) of Chapter 5 of Part 33 and the minimum levels of proficiency recommended by the State Board of
Education pursuant to Section 60648.
(2) The pupil’s grades and other indicators of academic achievement designated by the district.
(c) The policy shall base the identification of pupils pursuant to subdivision (b) at the grade levels identified pursuant to paragraph(1) and (2) of subdivision (a) primarily on the basis of the pupil’s
level of proficiency in reading. The policy shall base the identification of pupils pursuant to subdivision (b) at the grade levels identified pursuant to paragraphs (3) through (5) of subdivision (a) on the basis of the pupil’s level of proficiency in reading, English language arts, and mathematics.
(d) (1) If either measure identified in paragraph (1) or (2) of subdivision (b) identifies that a pupil is performing below the minimum standard for promotion, the pupil shall be retained in his or
her current grade level unless the pupil’s regular classroom teacher determines in writing that retention is not the appropriate intervention for the pupil’s academic deficiencies. This written determination shall specify the reasons that retention is not
appropriate for the pupil and shall include recommendations for interventions other than retention that in the opinion of the teacher are necessary to assist the pupil to attain acceptable levels of
academic achievement. If the teacher’s recommendation to promote is contingent upon the pupil’s participation in a summer school or interim session remediation program, the pupil’s academic performance
shall be reassessed at the end of the remediation program, and the decision to retain or promote the pupil shall be reevaluated at that time. The teacher’s evaluation shall be provided to and discussed
with the pupil’s parent or guardian and the school principal before any final determination of pupil retention or promotion.
(2) If the pupil does not have a single regular classroom teacher, the policy adopted by the school district shall specify the teacher or teachers responsible for the promotion or retention decision.
(e) The policy shall provide for parental notification when a pupil is identified as being at risk of retention. This notice shall be provided as early in the school year as practicable. The policy
shall provide a pupil’s parent or guardian the opportunity to consult with the teacher or teachers responsible for the decision to promote or retain the pupil.
(f) The policy shall provide a process whereby the decision of the teacher to retain or promote a pupil may be appealed. If an appeal is made, the burden shall be on the appealing party to show why the
decision of the teacher should be overruled.
(g) The policy shall provide that pupils who are at-risk of being retained in their current grade be identified as early in the school year, and as early in their school careers, as practicable.
(h) The policy shall indicate the manner in which opportunities for remedial instruction will be provided to pupils who are recommended for retention or who are identified as being at risk for retention.
(i) The policy adopted pursuant to this section shall be adopted at a public meeting of the governing board of the school district.
(j) Nothing in this section shall be construed to prohibit the retention of a pupil not included in grade levels identified pursuant to subdivision (a), or for reasons other than those specified in
subdivision (b), if such retention is determined to be appropriate for that pupil. Nothing in this section shall be construed to prohibit a governing board from adopting promotion and retention policies that exceed the criteria established in this section.
Jim Mordecai
May 23rd, 2011 at 3:34 pm
Jim,
Thanks for the post, I have always been aware of the systemic shortcomings and the manner in which politics plays a part. To address another angle of this issue, the very parents who scream loudest about their child being retained are often ones who don’t even pay taxes(except sales taxes). Districts,principals,and teachers should not have to fear reprisals from substandard parents any more than a child should be subjected to a substandard teacher. The disastrous progressive ideal of -SOCIAL JUSTICE- has played a large part in the self induced crippling of our education system.
May 24th, 2011 at 5:07 pm
Nextset: What’s wrong? You seem upset. We we’re having a somewhat civil conversation and you had to go and blast my future. I’ve already told you I’m an idiot. Do you have to rub it in so hard?
Here’s the thing though, you’re totally right. I don’t know how I could have thought that way for so long. I guess I am just a child and need to grow into an adult. Come to think of it, I’ve never had an adult conversation, this one included.
I love standing by and watching people I like “not make it.” I kind of get off on it. That’s why I tutor disadvantaged students. My dumbness rubs off on them and they fail like I have. I have a few questions for you though. Seeing as how you have seen into my life and know I am going to not make the cut or ever get hired, should I give up on life in normal society? If so, what should I move on to? I’m partial to jumping off the bay bridge.
Your wisdom astounds me. My weak mind did not realize that one could say that black people do not show sexual restraint while not being a racist. You’re clear reasoning has show me this. I have to ask you, black man to black man, don’t you hate washing your hands? I sure do.
Good for you for not caring if anyone calls you a racist. Public perception is overrated. I have a plan I think you’ll like. Lets only prepare white students for college and make minority students vocational workers. With a little work, we can take this country all the way back to 1776.
You’re brilliance must be a burden, but it has helped you make the cut. As a black man, it’s incredible you made it to the middle class. You’re doing great working at what I assume is a white collar job, making enough to be fine even if everything crumples around you. Why help anyone out while you’re doing so well?
Once again, you continue to be right. As a child, I can’t spout off fantasy ideas all day. The first amendment was not written for children. I’ll try to keep my opinions in line with yours. You’ve earned control of my thought process. I didn’t really get your Brave New World reference because I’m stupid. The old me would have thought it was about the government controlling your life and opinions, but I was confused back then.
The nicest thing about all this is that you know I’m too dumb to write satire, so you know everything I say is genuine. Save us from white liberals.
1984.
May 24th, 2011 at 8:34 pm
Now we are getting somewhere, Trevor. That’s better.
The next step is for you to pose an argument that the OUSD black students are collectively improved in their quality of life by college prep programs and imposition of college prep classes for a diploma. (as opposed to the small percentage of students who are, Jewish, for example? Persian? Egyptian, Asian Whatever else??
Mind you, we are not talking of “some” black students, say a fraction of the current 6th graders for example. We are talking about the group as a whole.
I’m waiting…
What percentage of the current black OUSD 6th graders do you suppose are statistically likely to get a 4 year degree? Even using 6th graders at OUSD from 12 years ago, or 15 years ago. This is where that drop rate becomes problematic. A 50% drop rate for OUSD blacks or thereabout. So tell me how you are going to “help” with the college prep thing.. Increase the algebra requirements a bit more?
You assume I think from your post above that I points are a matter of making the poor black folk take voc ed. You seem to think that I would take away the college prep, maybe reserve it for whites. (if you can find any (significant number) in LA Unified or OUSD).
Your arguments are flawed because you don’t want the population to choose of their own free will what educational program to enroll in. It’s not like you’re supporting a wide variety of options (Charters?).
As far as preparing white students for college and deliberately not preparing blacks – or mexicans (which is what I really believe OUSD and LA Unified are actually doing) – Try preparing blacks for prison, welfare and early graves and not having any white students to speak of, the whites having sidestepped ghetto districts in favor of white (ie Negro Free) districts.
Not only are we not preparing the black students for a 4 year degree, we are (at ghetto school districts such as OUSD & LAUSD) quite carefully making them unemployable and non-competitive. Basic education, deportment and voc ed is vastly more important than the college prep programs for white OR black students in the urban public schools. If we have to cancel all the college prep courses for the few to maintain the basic ed for themasses – especially the 50% dropouts who had no program they found worth showing up for – it could be justified.
It’s the local school board that decides the balance of what they will sacrifice on basics to fund the strivers. There is a balance. Right now OUSD is throwing the majority of the black kids under the bus (no driver’s ed and training, for example) in order to fund college prep for some. Good for the school board, they are elected to make those decisions and somebody has to get defunded.
I just think we are WAY too eager to consign a huge percentage of the blacks to non-education. When the Mexicans complete their takeover of the municipalities you can bet the priorities are going to change. They are under far fewer illusions of what is what – elitism notwithstanding.
The problem with OUSD is the unacceptably small percentage of black “products” that can even get a job at McDonalds or get accepted in the Army. Spare us your pious comments about college prep. The role of OUSD is to provide a floor below which the average black student can’t fall. Not to feed to Stanford. OUSD doesn’t do a good enough job providing a floor. The district needs to concentrate it’s energies there.
Your satire is better, by the way.
May 24th, 2011 at 10:36 pm
There is no getting through to you so I’m going to say a few last things and leave it at that.
You keep putting up statistics, saying that’s the way it is, and that’s that. That’s wrong.
The key to making OUSD better is getting the students to a higher level, not lowering the difficulty of the classes. As an OUSD alum, I know the classes are plenty easy. I want to make students better. You want to make classes worse. It’s clear to me that I’m right. Look at your own logic before critiquing mine.
Just because you think so low of me, I’d like to point out a few of the highlights of my life. I spent a month in New Orleans gutting houses post Katrina/Rita. I graduated from UCSC with a 3.5 GPA and will be attending Colorado State to receive my masters in mechanical engineering. I tutor at the Boys and Girls Club and bring fruits and sandwiches for the kids with money out of my own pocket. I’m not worried about making the cut you are so interested in. I am concerned with improving the quality of life of the people around me, even if mine has to take a hit. I’ll be fine regardless of what you think.
I’m not going to change your mind so you’re not worth talking to. I’d say have a good life, but you haven’t earned that type of respect from me. Here’s your chance to have the last word.
May 25th, 2011 at 7:57 am
Oh, the young…
Notice the snide remark at the end… classic.
Notice the inability to answer the main point of contention. Does pouring money and “education” on students with lower IQs and/or unwillingness to pursue education magically transform a dull student to a college ready student? Libs believe so, mainly because it’s job security. Experiences says absolutely not.
So Trevor, the purpose of America’s Public School System is to prepare (mainly the proles) for Industry, Military Service or Higher Education. Only a percentage of students are fit for higher education. This is not a new concept.
Everybody cannot reasonably go to college. Only a fraction of public school students have any business in a real college. Especially now that the taxpayers have reduced their contribution to the cost and the students have to sign non-dischargable debt to pay for the experience. If they don’t have a reasonable expexctation of earning power to carry the debt they don’t belong in “college”. So much for Black Studies and the other basketweaving majors.
The party days of the 1960s with UC costing less than $300/year are over.
Good luck with your career in Mechanical Engineering. Good luck with altruism. I don’t approve of that so much. I tend to agree with Ayn Rand on things like Habitat for Humanity and I’d have had nothing to do with the Katrina cleanup, leaving that to the stakeholders.
Tried thinking the other way. I grew up. You will too. While I “help” people, I am nowhere near as indiscriminate and unfocused as when I was your age. Not complaining, it’s just how life works.
May 25th, 2011 at 8:03 am
Typo above on “expectation”.
And a final thought..
One of the things I did learn from when I was your age and running around “helping” people indiscriminately was that I helped them get worse – or persist in their bad behavior. Oh they said they would change, but in the end I learned that my “help” was really part of the process where they worked (even without planning to) to maintain the status quo or worse. And another thing – people you age cannot tell when they’re being lied to – by anybody.
So you really have to be careful with your “help”.
Good luck with that.