Comments on: Furloughed

By: J.R.

J.R. — Wed, 30 Mar 2011 18:53:45 +0000

Gordon,
The example of my job was used to illustrate some very disturbing truths in the education system. Because teachers are essentially paid by taxpayers, what they do and what they fail to do matters. The system is broken, and no one wants to fix it. As far as the law goes, here is a little primer:

http://pace.berkeley.edu/2011/02/23/teacher-employment-and-collective-bargaining-laws-in-california-structuring-school-district-discretion-over-teacher-employment/

http://www.ed-data.k12.ca.us/Articles/Article.asp?title=Negotiating%20Teachers%20Contracts

http://law.onecle.com/california/education/44955.html

By virtue of the fact that education is 40% or more of California budget(it used to be 50%), furloughs are necessary. As for education days missed for students, that’s directly related to politics and pay structure bestowed upon us by the union. If we(the taxpayers) want them(teachers) to work more we would have to pay them more, therefore the low number of negotiated learning days for students. It’s all related, and with the help of information people are beginning to catch on.

Jealous No, overtaxed, shortchanged and pissed off yes!

By: Gordon Danning

Gordon Danning — Wed, 30 Mar 2011 02:26:33 +0000

JR:

“A lot of what teachers do(or don’t do) has been codified into law” — Says who? Where is your authority for that statement? (BTW, in my class we follow Chicago/Turabian, so you will need to employ a footnote or endnote). I’ve taught for 15 years, and I have a law degree from Cal, and yet I have no knowledge of such a law.

PS: I am the first to argue that many, many teachers do a pretty poor job. The same is true, of course, of many, many freelance computer troubleshooters, or whatever it is you ostensibly do. But, guess what? YOUR JOB IS WHOLLY IRRELEVANT TO THIS DISCUSSION. Either furloughs are sound public policy, or they are not; the pay and conditions of other jobs doesn’t change that, except to the extent that prospective teachers opt for those careers instead of teaching.

By: J.R.

J.R. — Tue, 29 Mar 2011 04:53:17 +0000

Gordon,
The jury is still out on whether or not the teachers are getting the job done or not(its been sliding for decades now). Hard data doesn’t look very favorable at all. It’s not much more than babysitting in some cases.

By: J.R.

J.R. — Tue, 29 Mar 2011 04:46:14 +0000

Gordon,
A lot of what teachers do(or don’t do) has been codified into law(thanks to the union owned politicians)one of the few professions that does so(outside of traffic controllers and a few others). All this damage from the past few decades will not be reversed very quickly or easily(especially with the union standing in the way as they almost always do). You can call it whatever you like, it makes no real difference(reality is what it is).The next time anyone moans about underpaid this… or overworked that… or accountability this …. or working condition bla bla bla…….think about what you are really saying. You’re welcome!

By: Gordon Danning

Gordon Danning — Tue, 29 Mar 2011 02:29:06 +0000

JR:

What, you think teachers don’t know what it means to put the hours in, no matter what, in order to get the job done? Really? Like, when grades are due, or when you promised to get papers back to kids?

And, do you think I have never freelanced in the private sector, and dealt with drop-dead due dates? Think again.

OBVIOUSLY lots of people do that. I took issue with your claim that you put in those hours, “for less” than teachers make. As my students say, I call “shenanigans.”

More importantly, suppose you work twice as many hours as teachers do, for half the pay. SO WHAT? As I ask my students, “That implies that your argument is correct because __________????? If you can’t fill in the blank, there is something wrong.

By: J.R.

J.R. — Mon, 28 Mar 2011 23:30:15 +0000

Holidays?
Computers don’t care what day they break(holiday or not), and there are no holidays, when it comes to the vital information age.

By: J.R.

J.R. — Mon, 28 Mar 2011 23:28:22 +0000

Gordon,
Between my normal job and free-lancing, I don’t have much down time, and I’m always doing projects(websites and so forth). That’s my reality, sink or swim. I know you could never comprehend it, what else is new? In the real world you do what has to be done, and just be glad you have something to do and are getting paid for it. Maybe teachers who have worked in the private sector would understand though(dog eat dog and all that).

By: Ms. J.

Ms. J. — Mon, 28 Mar 2011 22:00:15 +0000

JR,
330 days? Wow. My hat is off to you. It must be terrible to not even have weekends off, much less state holidays.

By: gordon danning

gordon danning — Mon, 28 Mar 2011 20:58:59 +0000

JR:

You would have more credibility if you didn’t make stuff up. 330+ days a year, really? That’s more than 6 days a week. Anyone who works that much for less than what a teacher makes gets little sympathy from me, since he or she must be awfully low skilled to have to work so hard for so little. The argument that teachers should make not a penny more than the stupidest, most ill-educated person on the block grows tiresome. How about an actual policy-based argument, as opposed to one based on petty jealousy?

By: Ms. J.

Ms. J. — Mon, 28 Mar 2011 15:25:36 +0000

That is pretty much what I had feared, Can’t. On a related note, I am curious about PAR. I think it seems very promising route to more authentic and helpful teacher evaluations. Has this been your experience? Katy, I would love to know more about such programs in the bay area if you have the chance to research/write about them.