<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: Attention education experts! Why do so many kids graduate with poor reading and math skills?</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/2012/06/07/attention-education-experts-why-do-so-many-kids-graduate-high-school-with-poor-reading-and-math-skills/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/2012/06/07/attention-education-experts-why-do-so-many-kids-graduate-high-school-with-poor-reading-and-math-skills/</link>
	<description>Katy Murphy&#039;s blog on Oakland schools</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Thu, 20 Jun 2013 04:35:08 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=3.5.1</generator>
	<item>
		<title>By: Nontcair</title>
		<link>http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/2012/06/07/attention-education-experts-why-do-so-many-kids-graduate-high-school-with-poor-reading-and-math-skills/comment-page-2/#comment-54340</link>
		<dc:creator>Nontcair</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 30 Jun 2012 05:59:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/?p=15074#comment-54340</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Those sex ed courses to 6th graders must be making a tremendous impact because I&#039;ve heard that some of those kids have been using the school bathrooms to engage in (hetero) sexual activity.

Yep.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Those sex ed courses to 6th graders must be making a tremendous impact because I&#8217;ve heard that some of those kids have been using the school bathrooms to engage in (hetero) sexual activity.</p>
<p>Yep.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Nextset</title>
		<link>http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/2012/06/07/attention-education-experts-why-do-so-many-kids-graduate-high-school-with-poor-reading-and-math-skills/comment-page-2/#comment-54338</link>
		<dc:creator>Nextset</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 30 Jun 2012 04:06:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/?p=15074#comment-54338</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Nontcair:

Johnny can read - porn...

Many of the poor performers can read if badly. They can read fine when it&#039;s something they really want to such as a game manual. They don&#039;t read for pleasure unless it&#039;s Hustler or Sports Illustrated and then they go for the photos first.

So what are we supposed to do, beat them?  They don&#039;t want to read. In a pacification school they do what they want. 

In a real school if they don&#039;t master what is required they are expelled and aren&#039;t allowed to be around the  other kids anymore. They have to hang around only kids like themselves - kids who go to &quot;thier&quot; school. That mechanism is one of the important ways you get the &quot;students&quot; to do what you require of them.

Meet criteria for retention and promotion or be transferred to continuation school.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nontcair:</p>
<p>Johnny can read &#8211; porn&#8230;</p>
<p>Many of the poor performers can read if badly. They can read fine when it&#8217;s something they really want to such as a game manual. They don&#8217;t read for pleasure unless it&#8217;s Hustler or Sports Illustrated and then they go for the photos first.</p>
<p>So what are we supposed to do, beat them?  They don&#8217;t want to read. In a pacification school they do what they want. </p>
<p>In a real school if they don&#8217;t master what is required they are expelled and aren&#8217;t allowed to be around the  other kids anymore. They have to hang around only kids like themselves &#8211; kids who go to &#8220;thier&#8221; school. That mechanism is one of the important ways you get the &#8220;students&#8221; to do what you require of them.</p>
<p>Meet criteria for retention and promotion or be transferred to continuation school.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Nontcair</title>
		<link>http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/2012/06/07/attention-education-experts-why-do-so-many-kids-graduate-high-school-with-poor-reading-and-math-skills/comment-page-2/#comment-54337</link>
		<dc:creator>Nontcair</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 30 Jun 2012 03:27:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/?p=15074#comment-54337</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[You want to know why Johnny can&#039;t read? It&#039;s because so many of you want the schools to teach him the gamut.

If that&#039;s not bad enough, you want him to learn things which are paradoxical:

Say &quot;NO to Drugs!&quot; Yes to Ritalin.
Say &quot;Yes&quot; to contraception and &quot;Yes&quot; to abstinence.

The result is that he learns NOTHING.

Unbelievable.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You want to know why Johnny can&#8217;t read? It&#8217;s because so many of you want the schools to teach him the gamut.</p>
<p>If that&#8217;s not bad enough, you want him to learn things which are paradoxical:</p>
<p>Say &#8220;NO to Drugs!&#8221; Yes to Ritalin.<br />
Say &#8220;Yes&#8221; to contraception and &#8220;Yes&#8221; to abstinence.</p>
<p>The result is that he learns NOTHING.</p>
<p>Unbelievable.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: On the Fence</title>
		<link>http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/2012/06/07/attention-education-experts-why-do-so-many-kids-graduate-high-school-with-poor-reading-and-math-skills/comment-page-2/#comment-54333</link>
		<dc:creator>On the Fence</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jun 2012 19:48:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/?p=15074#comment-54333</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Nextset and Observer,

I agree wholeheartedly with the idea that public schools should teach such life courses as driver&#039;s ed, home ec., and sex ed. for all the reasons that you both listed.  In the case of driver&#039;s ed. and sex ed., the people who provide the instruction have particular expertise in these areas that usually  far exceeds the knowledge and delivery that most parents can provide. I especially appreciated the comprehensive sex ed. that my child learned this year in 6th grade.  Sure, we had had &#039;the talk&#039;, but what he learned, and the setting in which he learned it, far exceeded what I could have provided alone.  And I don&#039;t even want to think about my memories of learning to drive with my parents.  Thank goodness I had the experience of learning from an impartial driver&#039;s ed. instructor in high school.  I agree with Observer that this is not a set of skills only needed or desired by the lower classes.  That said, Nextset is correct that it is much more critical for populations that would otherwise not avail themselves to these experiences.  For example, many middle class famiies today pay out of pocket for summer cooking camps and private driver&#039;s ed classes that poorer students may not receive. 

I find myself quite happy to support schools in teaching life and citizenship skills as I don&#039;t find that outside the realm of student education.  What I do find outside the realm of our public schools is the creation of &quot;full service&quot; medical and social service hubs.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nextset and Observer,</p>
<p>I agree wholeheartedly with the idea that public schools should teach such life courses as driver&#8217;s ed, home ec., and sex ed. for all the reasons that you both listed.  In the case of driver&#8217;s ed. and sex ed., the people who provide the instruction have particular expertise in these areas that usually  far exceeds the knowledge and delivery that most parents can provide. I especially appreciated the comprehensive sex ed. that my child learned this year in 6th grade.  Sure, we had had &#8216;the talk&#8217;, but what he learned, and the setting in which he learned it, far exceeded what I could have provided alone.  And I don&#8217;t even want to think about my memories of learning to drive with my parents.  Thank goodness I had the experience of learning from an impartial driver&#8217;s ed. instructor in high school.  I agree with Observer that this is not a set of skills only needed or desired by the lower classes.  That said, Nextset is correct that it is much more critical for populations that would otherwise not avail themselves to these experiences.  For example, many middle class famiies today pay out of pocket for summer cooking camps and private driver&#8217;s ed classes that poorer students may not receive. </p>
<p>I find myself quite happy to support schools in teaching life and citizenship skills as I don&#8217;t find that outside the realm of student education.  What I do find outside the realm of our public schools is the creation of &#8220;full service&#8221; medical and social service hubs.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Observer</title>
		<link>http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/2012/06/07/attention-education-experts-why-do-so-many-kids-graduate-high-school-with-poor-reading-and-math-skills/comment-page-2/#comment-54331</link>
		<dc:creator>Observer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jun 2012 16:15:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/?p=15074#comment-54331</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Nextset---I don&#039;t know why you are saying &quot;unlike Head-Royce, Robert Louis Stephenson &amp; Piedmont Unified&quot;, as these schools DO offer many, many life courses that address behavior, norms and standards that are needed and appropriate in a civilized society. 

Poor schools lack these course because they can&#039;t afford them. Piedmont raises around $400,000 EACH for it&#039;s grammar schools and over $2 million a year for it&#039;s high school. That&#039;s in fund-raising only, does not include the nearly double property tax rate on homes that are valued at nearly double what they are in Oakland. 

No one would pay the tuition they pay at Head Royce if there were not a ton of extra-curricular classes included. No one.

Yes, when those kids go home their parents ride them with really high standards and expectations. But that&#039;s not enough. I have those and it would only go so far without the support of the (one of the few) good school to back up what I do at home. 

Even McCarthy would bristle at the thought of the state not teaching Home Ec, PE, Driver&#039;s Ed and other life courses to our children.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nextset&#8212;I don&#8217;t know why you are saying &#8220;unlike Head-Royce, Robert Louis Stephenson &amp; Piedmont Unified&#8221;, as these schools DO offer many, many life courses that address behavior, norms and standards that are needed and appropriate in a civilized society. </p>
<p>Poor schools lack these course because they can&#8217;t afford them. Piedmont raises around $400,000 EACH for it&#8217;s grammar schools and over $2 million a year for it&#8217;s high school. That&#8217;s in fund-raising only, does not include the nearly double property tax rate on homes that are valued at nearly double what they are in Oakland. </p>
<p>No one would pay the tuition they pay at Head Royce if there were not a ton of extra-curricular classes included. No one.</p>
<p>Yes, when those kids go home their parents ride them with really high standards and expectations. But that&#8217;s not enough. I have those and it would only go so far without the support of the (one of the few) good school to back up what I do at home. </p>
<p>Even McCarthy would bristle at the thought of the state not teaching Home Ec, PE, Driver&#8217;s Ed and other life courses to our children.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Nextset</title>
		<link>http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/2012/06/07/attention-education-experts-why-do-so-many-kids-graduate-high-school-with-poor-reading-and-math-skills/comment-page-2/#comment-54330</link>
		<dc:creator>Nextset</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jun 2012 15:35:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/?p=15074#comment-54330</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Nontclair: Public schools - especially in the urban areas - are for the Proles.

By definition they are deficient in any of the markers for class. They have poor sanitation, they tend towards promiscuity, they are present oriented, they are language deficient and tend towards dialect. They and their birth parent(s) are present oriented. While this is not true for all the students (immigrants have their own issues), there is a dangerous critical mass of undesirable behaviors and tendencies.

In order to get these poor creatures ready for military enlistment, industry and higher education the public schools unlike Head-Royce, Robert Louis Stephenson &amp; Piedmont Unified have to program greater work in civilizing their students. 

This is why the urban/ghetto schools such as Los Angeles Unified and OUSD need what Observer mentions. They also need Driver&#039;s Ed and Driver&#039;s training since that skill is essential to making a good living.

Don&#039;t worry. Part of Pacification includes not doing anything thaty might alter the Caste the kiddies walk through the door with. The modern trend in ghetto schooling is to quite carefully not go there. I don&#039;t see any significant effort to expose or indoctrinate the lower castes in music, sanitation, health, language, and most importantly the mores of the superior castes.

Which is why the ghetto kids sing like canaries and end up confessing tho a variety of crimes whenever a cop hands them an oatmeal cookie. They honestly don&#039;t know that things just might be illegal. To them the behavior is normal and reasonable. The very notion of vicarious liability is beyond them (&quot;I didn&#039;t do it!!&quot;).

One could argue that teaching criminal &amp; civil law in low class schools is essential (eliminate college prep if needed) to give the students there a chance to stay out of prison and on a job. We&#039;re not going to do that either.

Because there is no intention to do any caste altering.

It&#039;s a Brave New World. Everybody born in their place and staying where they belong.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nontclair: Public schools &#8211; especially in the urban areas &#8211; are for the Proles.</p>
<p>By definition they are deficient in any of the markers for class. They have poor sanitation, they tend towards promiscuity, they are present oriented, they are language deficient and tend towards dialect. They and their birth parent(s) are present oriented. While this is not true for all the students (immigrants have their own issues), there is a dangerous critical mass of undesirable behaviors and tendencies.</p>
<p>In order to get these poor creatures ready for military enlistment, industry and higher education the public schools unlike Head-Royce, Robert Louis Stephenson &amp; Piedmont Unified have to program greater work in civilizing their students. </p>
<p>This is why the urban/ghetto schools such as Los Angeles Unified and OUSD need what Observer mentions. They also need Driver&#8217;s Ed and Driver&#8217;s training since that skill is essential to making a good living.</p>
<p>Don&#8217;t worry. Part of Pacification includes not doing anything thaty might alter the Caste the kiddies walk through the door with. The modern trend in ghetto schooling is to quite carefully not go there. I don&#8217;t see any significant effort to expose or indoctrinate the lower castes in music, sanitation, health, language, and most importantly the mores of the superior castes.</p>
<p>Which is why the ghetto kids sing like canaries and end up confessing tho a variety of crimes whenever a cop hands them an oatmeal cookie. They honestly don&#8217;t know that things just might be illegal. To them the behavior is normal and reasonable. The very notion of vicarious liability is beyond them (&#8220;I didn&#8217;t do it!!&#8221;).</p>
<p>One could argue that teaching criminal &amp; civil law in low class schools is essential (eliminate college prep if needed) to give the students there a chance to stay out of prison and on a job. We&#8217;re not going to do that either.</p>
<p>Because there is no intention to do any caste altering.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s a Brave New World. Everybody born in their place and staying where they belong.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Observer</title>
		<link>http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/2012/06/07/attention-education-experts-why-do-so-many-kids-graduate-high-school-with-poor-reading-and-math-skills/comment-page-2/#comment-54329</link>
		<dc:creator>Observer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jun 2012 14:58:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/?p=15074#comment-54329</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Because when schools taught various courses that addressed behavior and conduct-- ie: home ec, art, music, PE, nutrition were all part of regular curriculum when public schools experienced the most successful outcomes regardless of economic status---students are prepared for learning.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Because when schools taught various courses that addressed behavior and conduct&#8211; ie: home ec, art, music, PE, nutrition were all part of regular curriculum when public schools experienced the most successful outcomes regardless of economic status&#8212;students are prepared for learning.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Nontcair</title>
		<link>http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/2012/06/07/attention-education-experts-why-do-so-many-kids-graduate-high-school-with-poor-reading-and-math-skills/comment-page-2/#comment-54325</link>
		<dc:creator>Nontcair</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jun 2012 05:38:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/?p=15074#comment-54325</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Why do people advocate that the schools should teach home-ec, sex ed, and so forth?

The schools have their hands full just trying to teach kids how to read, write, add and subtract.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Why do people advocate that the schools should teach home-ec, sex ed, and so forth?</p>
<p>The schools have their hands full just trying to teach kids how to read, write, add and subtract.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Nontcair</title>
		<link>http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/2012/06/07/attention-education-experts-why-do-so-many-kids-graduate-high-school-with-poor-reading-and-math-skills/comment-page-2/#comment-54324</link>
		<dc:creator>Nontcair</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jun 2012 05:34:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/?p=15074#comment-54324</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[It&#039;s hard to operate an inexpensive private school because of a long list of government regulations which raise the cost of doing business, the most notorious of which set:

a minimum number of schools days per year (about 180)
a minumum duration of a school day (about six hours)

This is all nothing more that &lt;B&gt;protectionism&lt;/B&gt; for the public education unions.

It sounds to me like you depend on the schools to be public daycare centers.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s hard to operate an inexpensive private school because of a long list of government regulations which raise the cost of doing business, the most notorious of which set:</p>
<p>a minimum number of schools days per year (about 180)<br />
a minumum duration of a school day (about six hours)</p>
<p>This is all nothing more that <b>protectionism</b> for the public education unions.</p>
<p>It sounds to me like you depend on the schools to be public daycare centers.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Catherine</title>
		<link>http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/2012/06/07/attention-education-experts-why-do-so-many-kids-graduate-high-school-with-poor-reading-and-math-skills/comment-page-2/#comment-54298</link>
		<dc:creator>Catherine</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 27 Jun 2012 21:16:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ibabuzz.com/education/?p=15074#comment-54298</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Charlie: Not all school districts create &quot;false crises&quot; to get more money. I do believe this is most prevalent in urban areas where teens begin to get on the public assistance when they become pregnant in middle and high school. Then we need to worry about the children born early, with low birth weight, need day care and preschool and mothers need parenting classes and special classes for &quot;recovery&quot; and so on. Then we talk about how these children of teens are more likely to join gangs to feel like a family and belong. And let&#039;s not forget that they need breakfast and lunch and summer food programs. Then they need to have after school programs that give them additional art and science and sports programs. ALL OF THIS BECOMES THE COGS IN THE WHEELS OF EDUCATION THAT KEEP THE MONEY ROLLING IN.

This is why I am so focused on teen pregnancy. We will reduce our costs significantly, increase the quality of life for all citizens, reduce our &quot;crises&quot; and create families who care for their children.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Charlie: Not all school districts create &#8220;false crises&#8221; to get more money. I do believe this is most prevalent in urban areas where teens begin to get on the public assistance when they become pregnant in middle and high school. Then we need to worry about the children born early, with low birth weight, need day care and preschool and mothers need parenting classes and special classes for &#8220;recovery&#8221; and so on. Then we talk about how these children of teens are more likely to join gangs to feel like a family and belong. And let&#8217;s not forget that they need breakfast and lunch and summer food programs. Then they need to have after school programs that give them additional art and science and sports programs. ALL OF THIS BECOMES THE COGS IN THE WHEELS OF EDUCATION THAT KEEP THE MONEY ROLLING IN.</p>
<p>This is why I am so focused on teen pregnancy. We will reduce our costs significantly, increase the quality of life for all citizens, reduce our &#8220;crises&#8221; and create families who care for their children.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>

<!-- Performance optimized by W3 Total Cache. Learn more: http://www.w3-edge.com/wordpress-plugins/

Minified using apc
Page Caching using apc
Database Caching 5/18 queries in 0.066 seconds using apc
Object Caching 285/287 objects using apc

Served from: www.ibabuzz.com @ 2013-06-19 22:48:57 -->