Comments on: With Prop. 30 passed, Oakland teachers give thanks — and return to the bargaining table

By: J.R.

J.R. — Tue, 27 Nov 2012 22:16:58 +0000

Correction an should be a, I was going to put another word but thought better of it.

One teachers opinion regarding the cartel:

http://educationwonk.blogspot.com/2005/01/union-nonsense-california-teachers.html

By: J.R.

J.R. — Tue, 27 Nov 2012 22:09:12 +0000

This is an disturbing excerpt from a blog regarding the Miramonte debacle and discussion about the impact the bill SB1530 would have had on the case.

“The bill(SB1530) also would have made admissible evidence of misconduct older than four years. Berndt had prior reports of abuse that had been removed from his file, because a statute of limitations in the teachers contract in LAUSD prohibited their use”.

http://toped.svefoundation.org/2012/06/28/dismissal-bill-falters-in-assembly/

It seems as though regardless of opinions to the contrary, unions and their contracts do cause damage intentional or not.

I am also not surprised to find that CTA was against parental notification as well.

http://archive.lwvc.org/action/prop0811/prop4.html

http://legacy.cta.org/media/publications/educator/archives/2006/200610_tas_05.htm

Do these people really have your child’s best interest at heart, or is there another incentive here?

By: Doug Appel

Doug Appel — Tue, 27 Nov 2012 20:30:40 +0000

1 Day

I found your list interesting and thought provoking–good on you. I don’t know what your sample size was or how it was selected, but, nonetheless, I suspect it reflects some segment of OEA’s membership as much as anything else.
I viewed SB 1530 as a histrionic and unnecessary bit of legislation. Once charged with offenses of the type which occured in LA (sex or drug in particular), employees are put on unpaid leave. If they are found guilty of the charged offenses, they generally lose their credential pretty quickly. If not guilty, they retain their due process rights–as they should.

By: teacher

teacher — Tue, 27 Nov 2012 15:20:20 +0000

When I was a credential candidate, one of my classes involved visiting established classrooms suggested by my professor. Unbeknownst to me, several of them were “union die-hards.” I have to say that still, all these years later, I still remember the amazing instruction in those rooms. #12 above makes it seem as though the most involved in the union are there because they are poor teachers, and these types of generalizations are central to the perception of teachers/unions being solely about protecting lousy teachers’ jobs. Every really lousy teacher I have seen (but one) was NOT involved in OEA. I think “die-hards” are there because they: are interested in the political process in general, tend toward activist type activities, like being involved, believe they can affect working and learning conditions and believe strongly in organized labor unions.

Data does show that ALL of the top states in education have strong teacher labor unions, and that all of the bottom states do not. Whether it is a direct correlation or not, it certainly does not support the claim that unions are the root cause of all problems.

There are many good points on the list above though. I think that sb1530 is a more complicated issue and needs to be fully addressed and discussed rather than just mentioned.

By: 1day at a time

1day at a time — Tue, 27 Nov 2012 14:34:50 +0000

31 things to know about Oakland teachers.

Oakland teachers…
1. Want better pay
2. Aren’t overly connected to the unions’ political activities, especially CTA
3. Are too busy teaching to pay much attention to OUSD board elections
4. Make a conscious choice to be a complainer or not (the lounge dilemma)
5. Think good staff needs balance of young and older
6. Dont want salary held against them in school budgeting
7.Think its “sobering” when good teacher is cut over bad one due to seniority
8. Dont see other people teach very often
9. Are very well aware of instructors’ skills in feeder grades/classes
10. Are virtually clueless about teachers in non-feeder classes/grades
11.Think the flatland v hills thing is overblown. Hills parents can be difficult
12. Mid-top teachers have diverse views on union. Poor ones are usually diehards.
13. Spend a ton of their own money on school items
14. Acknowledge the need to call BS more often
15. Know teachers who shouldn’t be teaching
16. Would like some job-embedded pathway to higher pay
17. Aren’t completely sure how best to use technology in class.
18 Don’t know about the union’s “code of conduct”, don’t feel bound by it
19. Believe that having a great principal is important
20. Feel torn about ineffective teachers. They understand pressure & frustration
21. Are surprised & embarrassed to learn that sb1530 was killed by their unions*
22. Think schools are run by uber-liberals. Frustrating if you’re not.
23. Would pay more attention to people focused on solutions
24. Loathe paperwork
25. Like collaboration, but also want their professional space.
26 Good leadership and school culture impact quality of life
27. Can get demoralized when poor teachers stay
28. Can get demoralized when great teachers leave
29. Get inspired by kids who defy the odds (hence the draw to OUSD)
30. Feel public critique of union often seems like teacher bashing, intended or not.
31. Have to be careful not to overwhelm their loved ones with “school talk”

*most dont know what sb1530 was about

This list was created from teacher conversations. Had good couple people vet final list. Food for thought

By: J.R.

J.R. — Thu, 22 Nov 2012 20:43:57 +0000

I feel sadness for those teachers of moral courage,faith and the integrity to stand for something in order to not fall for anything. A majority of wrong is still wrong!

By: J.R.

J.R. — Thu, 22 Nov 2012 20:06:57 +0000

1day,
Can you really trust a person or organization that will not take a stand to do what is right for the most vulnerable inn our society, because it may(I stress may) have an affect on what amounts to jobs and paychecks. It really makes you wonder……..

By: 1day at a time

1day at a time — Thu, 22 Nov 2012 16:14:10 +0000

CTA opposed sb1530. Protecting child abusing teachers from swifter removal.

Teacher union claimed the bill weakened due process.

Why didn’t the Trib cover this?
Why would teachers sit silent while their unions wreck havoc in their name?
Does being a democrat mean you have to always support teachers unions?

I read the bill and saw the voting roll. Four ed committee members “took a walk” during the vote so it wouldn’t pass.

Teachers, wake up!!

When the Police department, Child Abuse Prevention Centers, Superintendents, School Boards, and Mayors all strongly support something they believe protects children from abuse but your unions say no because they say it infringes on due process… you need to really think about who you allow to speak for you.

Is it possible the people in Oakland are so disconnected from our kids that we just dont give a rats behind about any of this. Many vote however the teachers union tells them to vote. Many support them blindly and dont hold them or CTA accountable for their actions and positions.

intent vs impact

intent: protect due process. protect vs arbitrary abuse of power
impact: child molesters have cover

Shame on the union and any teacher who blindly follows the published union code of conduct that essentially says “no snitching!”

https://docs.google.com/a/oaklandea.org/file/d/0B62syHoya4ECNDMwNjc2M2QtYzEwOS00NDlkLThjY2EtNGFhZTMxZGMxZjI5/edit?hl=en&pli=1

Really…

By: J.R.

J.R. — Thu, 22 Nov 2012 01:56:25 +0000

Jim,
Any time someones opinion is countered by reason and evidence, you can bet personal attacks will not be far behind. It’s expected when there is no counter argument that insults are inevitable. I told him the system is failing many kids, and the evidence shows this to be true.

http://www.ibabuzz.com/onassignment/2011/09/07/a-closer-look-at-spending-and-test-scores-in-east-bay-schools/#comments

http://schoolspending.apps.cironline.org/county/alameda/district/oakland-unified/

By: J.R.

J.R. — Thu, 22 Nov 2012 01:18:39 +0000

Doug,
For the sake of accuracy, I said “you were part of the system that “is” the problem” and there is a difference between the two because there are many wonderful teachers who are being denigrated(and or thrown under the bus) through no fault of their own. We have the best data of all before us, decades worth of lack of achievement under status quo business as usual.