Raiders confirm Wylie hire
By Jerry McDonald - NFL Writer
Monday, January 31st, 2011 at 12:34 pm in Oakland Raiders.
The Raiders announced the hiring of Bob Wylie as their offensive line coach Monday.
“Bob is a spectacular teacher, motivator and drill sargeant,” coach Hue Jackson said in a statement. “His vast knowlwedge and experience, including last year iwth a team in our division, will really helup us as we move forward in assembling a good offensive line.”
Wylie runs an annual offensive clinic which features blocking seminars and instruction from many NFL coaches, which last year included the Saints’ Aaron Kromer, the Colts’ Howard Mudd and the Jets’ Bill Callahan.
He coached three years in the Canadian Football League before joining the Denver last year as the Broncos switched from zone blocking gap and power blocking system, a transition the Raiders appear to be undergoing after the departure of head coach Tom Cable, line coach Jim Michalczik and line assistant Chris Morgan.
Where that leaves current Raiders linemen remains to be seen. Right guard Cooper Carlisle in particular has been a zone blocking specialist, playing in the system with both Denver and Oakland. Bruce Campbell, should he remain at right guard, is expected to get a long look whenever the team convenes after players and owners come to a collective bargaining agreement.
Left guard Robert Gallery, scheduled for unrestricted free agency in the event of a CBA, saw his play improve when he was moved from tackle to guard in Cable’s zone system.
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January 31st, 2011 at 12:36 pm
Not sure were you get your stats from, but payton had the lowest yrds per completion.
***********
I quote “This season, the Raiders didn’t live up to the tradition of their deep ball aerial game. Campbell’s completions traveled just 5.76 yards in the air each, making the Raiders’ first non-losing season in several years very much like their last AFC championship run with Rick Gannon under center.”
5.76 yards per catch without YAC
January 31st, 2011 at 12:37 pm
http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_ylt=AjrQsNu8M0e2xZm6bRoTxRT.uLYF?slug=ys-intangibles012711
Theres the link.
January 31st, 2011 at 12:40 pm
402.
Just because a player makes a probowl desnt mean that the team is any good. Samuals is a decent player, but is often injured, also the rest of the line was crap.
Portis couldnt stay healthy, and is a locker room cancer, & notorious under achiever.
Moss is clearly not the player he was in ny, and out side of moss, the foreskins have had a terrible wr group. Even worse than the group we have fielded.
Cooly is good player, but you could argue that jc made him into a probowler by finding him in the passing game. This also points to the fact that jc didnt have many pass catching threats. when cooly and moss are your biggest weapons you dont have much.
Some of these guys made the probowl as alternates, so they were not elite level players at all. Also this team has been in disarray since gibbs left. Stop trying to make the forskins out to be a good team. they sucked, end of story.
January 31st, 2011 at 12:45 pm
repost
HayesDaze37 Says:
It’s a great day to be a Raiders fan. Isn’t it?!
Another QB to push JCampbell for the starter’s job??
One of the great things about an Al Davis presser is that, get this…he actually speaks to the point, and he’s done that a few times regarding JC.
Anyone who thinks the Old Man wants to rattle JC’s bones by bringing in a “big name” (regardless of stats, a la Carson Palmer)…hasn’t been paying too much attention. If the Raiders reach out for a name bigger than Bruce Gradkowski, JC will be under the gun all over again (but worse).
JC is the undisputed man at QB for the Raiders…and his replacement, when the time comes, needs to be a younger guy who is brought along until he takes over by sheer force of play. If he’s not that young guy…the JC experiment will be an utter failure. And other close-but-no-cigar QB’s will continue to lead us to mediocrity until we hit the jackpot.
January 31st, 2011 at 12:46 pm
Most yards after catch per completed pass jc is number1.
This means he had to get rid of the ball fast ( teribble pass protection) dispelling the myth that he holds the ball and cant read defense.
This means not a lot was open down the field 9 sub par wr play.
This also means he often made the right read and hit guys in spots where they could do something after the catch. This is a good thing, not a knock against him
January 31st, 2011 at 12:49 pm
407.30 year raider Says:
January 31st, 2011 at 12:48 pm
alot of new guys on here i see… some oldies too, what up Debo!!! where u at rockstar??
January 31st, 2011 at 12:51 pm
been reading some previous posts… i gotta say HELL NO to vince “im gonna killmyself” young!! hell no!!!
January 31st, 2011 at 12:51 pm
McRaider5150 Says:
January 31st, 2011 at 12:48 pm
bcz24 Says:
January 31st, 2011 at 12:35 pm
Not sure were you get your stats from, but payton had the lowest yrds per completion.
***********
I quote “This season, the Raiders didn’t live up to the tradition of their deep ball aerial game. Campbell’s completions traveled just 5.76 yards in the air each, making the Raiders’ first non-losing season in several years very much like their last AFC championship run with Rick Gannon under center.”
5.76 yards per catch without YAC
——————————-
And were her is this coming from???
Can I get Manning or some other QB’s yards per catch without yac???
Who are the WR??
January 31st, 2011 at 12:52 pm
someone earlier mentioned kevin kolb??? i would like to see if philly would be willing to entertain the idea of parting ways with kolb and at what price???
January 31st, 2011 at 12:55 pm
If y’all thought Redskins fans hated JC, you should have heard what some Eagles fans I was talking to thought of Kolb.
At any rate, Kolb’s arm isn’t big enough for Al. Not that Al is going to be bringing in another QB anyway…
January 31st, 2011 at 12:57 pm
No, Mistic — It means he had talent catch that ball and run with it.
JC held the ball too long…his now-HC even said as much. Your love of JC is glossing-over a lot of his faults, including the number-1: JC held the ball too long with regularity…causing routes to break down, and closing ball-delivery windows that are open for very short periods.
Jason holds the ball too long. Period. Saying otherwise proves you fail the Eye Test.
JC was a fundamental disaster last year, and has been a lot more work than anybody hoped, to play even AVERAGE QB. If he gets it this year…really gets it…the Offense will be great. If he can just be a little better this year, across the board, the Offense will be almost great (assuming the O-Line is at least as (reliable?) as it was last season.
If he doesn’t get it…we better have that kid growing on the bench.
January 31st, 2011 at 1:01 pm
Here’s a not-so-bold prediction:
Unless we pull Peyton Manning or Tom Brady (haha), Al Davis never again invests more than $40Million for a QB.
January 31st, 2011 at 1:06 pm
383.RaiderRockstar Says:
January 31st, 2011 at 12:00 pm
Agreed with Lonetree.
VY should be used in the same sentence as Leinart, Quinn, Russell & A. Smith
******************************
Agreed.
January 31st, 2011 at 1:09 pm
Mistic,
does making the playoffs make them a good team? Because they did, without JC, twice, while JC was there.
Hey, Hayes in #11 gets it! Glad to see there is hope here.
January 31st, 2011 at 1:10 pm
We need to trade CC to Seattle for a low round pick 4th or 5th would be good. Prob not gonna happen. Maybe a 7th.
January 31st, 2011 at 1:11 pm
And the reason some of us don’t want to bother talking about guards not playing up to their potential…
The Packers, Bears, and Steelers O-lines all were among the worst in the NFL this year, and laughed at early in the year.
A good QB trumps a bad O-line.
Who we have at RG next year will matter 1/100th to who we have throwing the ball 25 times a game.
January 31st, 2011 at 1:18 pm
HayesDaze37 Says:
January 31st, 2011 at 12:57 pm
No, Mistic — It means he had talent catch that ball and run with it.
JC held the ball too long…his now-HC even said as much. Your love of JC is glossing-over a lot of his faults, including the number-1: JC held the ball too long with regularity…causing routes to break down, and closing ball-delivery windows that are open for very short periods.
Jason holds the ball too long. Period. Saying otherwise proves you fail the Eye Test.
JC was a fundamental disaster last year, and has been a lot more work than anybody hoped, to play even AVERAGE QB. If he gets it this year…really gets it…the Offense will be great. If he can just be a little better this year, across the board, the Offense will be almost great (assuming the O-Line is at least as (reliable?) as it was last season.
If he doesn’t get it…we better have that kid growing on the bench.
——————–
I am a JC supporter, but I agree with you 100%. At least you seem to be open to the possibility that Jason can improve.
Jason has to improve, but he also needs a top notch WR that he can count on. We just don’t have that righ now
January 31st, 2011 at 1:19 pm
HayesDaze37 Says:
January 31st, 2011 at 12:57 pm
No, Mistic — It means he had talent catch that ball and run with it.
===================================================
Hayes some one had to throw them the ball, and put it in a spot where they could do damage after the catch.
You cant give all the credit to the pass catcher and at the same time disparage the qb. It takes both.
January 31st, 2011 at 1:19 pm
The Dirtee Raccoon Says:
January 31st, 2011 at 1:10 pm
We need to trade CC to Seattle for a low round pick 4th or 5th would be good. Prob not gonna happen. Maybe a 7th.
—-
lol….we would be very very lucky to not get hung up on let a lone a 4th round pick for him…
January 31st, 2011 at 1:24 pm
I give JC credit where it’s due.
He made a few AMAZING throws this year. Maybe a half-dozen or so. He made a few.
He also made a lot of average throws. But…he made a TON of bad throws…and some of his best plays were actually made by the receivers who had to bail him (us) out.
So…yes, I support Jason Campbell, as I will support all Raiders starting QB’s…but I cannot ignore what my very-well trained eyes tell me, or what the rest of the world already knows…
The Raiders NEED top-flight play from a QB if they want to be an elite team. If JC can’t provide it, we’re in deeper than we were last year.
January 31st, 2011 at 1:25 pm
alex7 Says:
January 31st, 2011 at 1:11 pm
And the reason some of us don’t want to bother talking about guards not playing up to their potential…
The Packers, Bears, and Steelers O-lines all were among the worst in the NFL this year, and laughed at early in the year.
A good QB trumps a bad O-line.
Who we have at RG next year will matter 1/100th to who we have throwing the ball 25 times a game.
——————-
A good oline makes a good QB Great.
An bad oline makes a good QB Average
A bad oline makes average QB Horrible
January 31st, 2011 at 1:27 pm
McRaider,
thank you for completely ignoring the fact that the Bears, Packers, and Steelers O-lines consistently were deemed throughout the season to be subpar.
If your little saying makes you happy, have at it.
Truth is, those three teams have quality QBs that mask what scouts and statistics alike show is a bad O-line.
January 31st, 2011 at 1:30 pm
We were throwing denver o-line around like rag-dolls,strange hire
January 31st, 2011 at 1:30 pm
greatness
January 31st, 2011 at 1:31 pm
alex7 Says:
McRaider,
thank you for completely ignoring the fact that the Bears, Packers, and Steelers O-lines consistently were deemed throughout the season to be subpar.
If your little saying makes you happy, have at it.
Truth is, those three teams have quality QBs that mask what scouts and statistics alike show is a bad O-line.
——————–
Alex — You been drinking out of MR’s Kool(Kell)-Aid pitcher??
It looks like McRaider’s little saying indicated exactly what you were talking about. Just looking for a spat?
January 31st, 2011 at 1:32 pm
19.DeuceDeuce Says:
January 31st, 2011 at 1:19 pm
The Dirtee Raccoon Says:
January 31st, 2011 at 1:10 pm
We need to trade CC to Seattle for a low round pick 4th or 5th would be good. Prob not gonna happen. Maybe a 7th.
—-
lol….we would be very very lucky to not get hung up on let a lone a 4th round pick for him…
**********************
Ok true, a 7th?
January 31st, 2011 at 1:33 pm
23.oo Says:
January 31st, 2011 at 1:30 pm
We were throwing denver o-line around like rag-dolls,strange hire
****************************
Yeah I am not too sure about it either. Maybe to teach Wiz how to coach?
January 31st, 2011 at 1:34 pm
Also, there’s a report that Raiders linebacker Rolando McClain purchased a firearm Thursday prior to the shots being fired at his car later that evening in Alabama.
http://www.footballnewsnow.com/2011/report-rolando-mcclain-purchased-gun-prior-to-shooting/
This is a little unsettling…Rolando seems more and more like a sketchy dude. refuses interviews, has alot of family issues, the lawsuit, and now this…al davis did admit that the raiders are awful at background checks…
January 31st, 2011 at 1:36 pm
How many 1st round picks do the Colts, Patriots, and Steelers invest in O-linemen?
Colts = 0 in the last 12 years.
Steelers = 2 in last 12 years.
Patriots = 2 in the last 12 years.
Unless you argue that ALL of their low-round draft choices were diamonds in the rough, you can see that a top QB makes an average to below-average talent at O-line look great.
January 31st, 2011 at 1:37 pm
HayesDaze37 Says:
January 31st, 2011 at 1:31 pm
alex7 Says:
McRaider,
thank you for completely ignoring the fact that the Bears, Packers, and Steelers O-lines consistently were deemed throughout the season to be subpar.
If your little saying makes you happy, have at it.
Truth is, those three teams have quality QBs that mask what scouts and statistics alike show is a bad O-line.
——————–
Alex — You been drinking out of MR’s Kool(Kell)-Aid pitcher??
It looks like McRaider’s little saying indicated exactly what you were talking about. Just looking for a spat?
lol
Thanks Hayes. Wasn’t sure what Alex’s beef was on that one. Maybe I forgot to say:
An average line doesn’t really change when you have a good GB. Right now Rogers and Ben are not “Great” but they are very good with an average line.
January 31st, 2011 at 1:38 pm
Hayes,
your so called eye ball test equals your opinion, and that is all. We disagree.
Some one posted stats from an article, and that is what i took from them.
January 31st, 2011 at 1:39 pm
A good qb can make a an o-line look good, but a good o-line and recievers can make a qb look good as well. look at cassel. by all accounts he is not a very good qb, but he has done well when he has a running game, pro bowl linemen and pro bowl recievers.
January 31st, 2011 at 1:39 pm
Ahh, yes. The shills are out in force today, trying to convince us that Wylie Coyote is the second coming of Joe Bugel’s presence in Washington in the early ’80s. Here come the Oakland Hogs. Or, the second coming of….drumroll…TOM CABLE! “In Cable I Trust”. Remember that, Hayez?
January 31st, 2011 at 1:39 pm
No Hayes, that saying states that a bad O-line declines the play of a QB, which the Bears, Packers, and Steelers proved this year proved all year is completely false.
It’s kinda simple. Top QB = correct reads, quick release, pocket awareness = more defenders dropped back = O-Line doesn’t have to hold blocks as long
Or, top QB = quickly beat a blitz = O-line looks great that play.
January 31st, 2011 at 1:40 pm
alex7 Says:
January 31st, 2011 at 1:36 pm
How many 1st round picks do the Colts, Patriots, and Steelers invest in O-linemen?
Colts = 0 in the last 12 years.
Steelers = 2 in last 12 years.
Patriots = 2 in the last 12 years.
Unless you argue that ALL of their low-round draft choices were diamonds in the rough, you can see that a top QB makes an average to below-average talent at O-line look great.
—————————-
That is a bit of a stretch don’t you think. Either you are blocking for the QB and not allowing sack, or you’re not.
Manny, Brady, Rogers. don’t block do they?
Ben on the other is hand, they get to him, but can’t bring him down.
January 31st, 2011 at 1:43 pm
MR — What are you changing the subject for? To make it come around to you? Why not just jump into the convo…or do you just want a scrap??
January 31st, 2011 at 1:43 pm
100percent
By all accounts Cassel is not good? Are you sure (I am) you’re not focusing on the last two times you watched Cassel, and ignoring his body of work in NE and most of this season?
How do you just throw away 27 TDs and 7 Int in an entire season of NFL football as “not good”?
He had ONE pro-bowl lineman, not plural as you stated.
So not sure where your argument is that the O-line gets the credit there. Same O-line there last year when they and Cassel stunk. He simply played much better this year, his 3rd as a starter.
January 31st, 2011 at 1:44 pm
Why are you putting the Bears in there. They were good, but the D is what got them where they ended up.
And to say a bad QB doesn;t decline a QB’s play is plan stupid. It GB had a Good Oline, they would have lost about 2 games Roger would have been hurt and out for game and they would have been the number one seed. Damn!!!!!!
January 31st, 2011 at 1:45 pm
I’m actually surprised you (MR) came back so quickly after you got slapped around so much by KK! That was HILARIOUS! Didn’t you think so?
January 31st, 2011 at 1:45 pm
McRaider,
a stretch??
Three teams with future Hall of Fame QBs spent a measly FOUR 1st round picks in 36 combined years of drafting,
and you think the O-line is what makes the QB, and not vice-versa?
Amazing.
January 31st, 2011 at 1:46 pm
You cant get to the conference championship with bad o-line play. The units struggled early and played really well going into the play offs.
These arguments are really weak
January 31st, 2011 at 1:47 pm
McRaider,
I don’t even know where you were all year.
Did you not repeatedly hear about how bad the Green Bay, Pittsburgh, and Chicago offensive lines were?
Did you miss Chicago giving up 10 sacks to the NYG?
Did you miss Green Bay having no running game all year?
Did you miss most Steeler fans lamenting their horrible O-line?
Yet there they were, all 3 deep into the playoffs, because of…..QB play.
Bears D didn’t do much for them last year huh, when Cutler struggled.
January 31st, 2011 at 1:49 pm
Alex? Does the number 7 stand for you football IQ???
I thought so.
Ask anyone that actually played football or knows something about it how important a good oline it.
Bye the way what 3 QB are HOFers???
January 31st, 2011 at 1:51 pm
Mistic,
your “improved” O-line play got the Bears two 100-yard rushers their final 11 games, and gave up 6 sacks the final game of the season.
Wow, just wow.
January 31st, 2011 at 1:51 pm
Big Ben is definitely elite, if not great statistically. His W-L record is what matters. If he wins another Super Bowl playing this way, he absolutley must be considered a great QB.
Aaron Rodgers is close…and if he continues to play the way he has been, he’ll be considered elite also. If he wins this Super Bowl, he will be elite enough for me.
Aaron Rodgers exhibits skills and touch that great QB’s have. Big Ben, like him or no, exhibits a tendency to win, and a desire to compete that can’t be questioned. If JC comes around, his personal stats probably will be like Ben’s…now, if he could find a way to win like him!
January 31st, 2011 at 1:52 pm
I dont see the Packers letting Perry & Moss both leave…
January 31st, 2011 at 1:53 pm
McRaider,
Brady, Manning, and Ben – the three QBs whose teams invested a measly 4 OUT OF 36 1st round picks on O-linemen the last 12 years.
They kinda know top QBs don’t need top O-linemen.
But hey, I’m sure you’re smarter than those three organizations and their shiny Super Bowl trophies.
January 31st, 2011 at 1:53 pm
33.The Real MaddenRaider Says:
January 31st, 2011 at 1:39 pm
Ahh, yes. The shills are out in force.
***********************
You called?
January 31st, 2011 at 1:53 pm
*Steelers & Packers
January 31st, 2011 at 1:54 pm
alex7 Says:
January 31st, 2011 at 1:53 pm
McRaider,
Brady, Manning, and Ben – the three QBs whose teams invested a measly 4 OUT OF 36 1st round picks on O-linemen the last 12 years.
They kinda know top QBs don’t need top O-linemen.
But hey, I’m sure you’re smarter than those three organizations and their shiny Super Bowl trophies.
—-
But im sure Tom Brady wished he had top lineman in the SB against the Giants when he was getting manhandled…
January 31st, 2011 at 1:54 pm
No, KK, in this instance I can’t!!
You two guys are hilarious…and it’s great you two keep coming back to prove you love being the laughing-stocks of the blog.
There’s no other way to explain it — thanks for the laughs!!
January 31st, 2011 at 1:55 pm
hey Dummy,
Did the Bears win that game they gave up 10 sacks on???
Did those olines plan horrible down the stretch or inthe pay-offs?? do you think the coaching staff made adjustment to what they were doing.
Dummy, if you don’t block, the QB can’t get rid of the ball??
Can you say Mike Vick????
Eagles line sucked down the stretch and in the playoffs and Mike couldn’t do a thing about it.
Brady had a horrble game again the jets because the line did not block.
January 31st, 2011 at 1:55 pm
Actually…I should’ve said “you two guys with multiple personalities”….
January 31st, 2011 at 1:55 pm
Alex7 Says:
January 31st, 2011 at 1:53 pm
McRaider,
Brady, Manning, and Ben – the three QBs whose teams invested a measly 4 OUT OF 36 1st round picks on O-linemen the last 12 years.
They kinda know top QBs don’t need top O-linemen.
————————————
McRaider, the above is too stupid to debate, in fact, it’s nothing but bait.
January 31st, 2011 at 1:57 pm
K Kelly has been gettin RUN for years in here, he says one thing funny/witty and the old bish thinks he’s the big kid on the block. KK yer still a coward.
January 31st, 2011 at 1:58 pm
Mistic,,
your “improved” O-line play got the Bears two 100-yard rushers their final 11 games, and gave up 6 sacks the final game of the season.
Wow, just wow.
January 31st, 2011 at 1:59 pm
your “improved” Packers o-line had Aaron Rodgers be the LEADING rusher for them in 2 of their final 4 games.
Again, you can’t just make stuff up and expect it to be true.
The Bears, Packers, and Steelers O-lines were horrible ALL YEAR but their top QBs with high IQs and quick releases can mask that.
January 31st, 2011 at 1:59 pm
where u at rockstar??
***
whats up 30YR?
how u been man ???
January 31st, 2011 at 2:00 pm
alex7 Says:
January 31st, 2011 at 1:53 pm
McRaider,
Brady, Manning, and Ben – the three QBs whose teams invested a measly 4 OUT OF 36 1st round picks on O-linemen the last 12 years.
They kinda know top QBs don’t need top O-linemen.
But hey, I’m sure you’re smarter than those three organizations and their shiny Super Bowl trophies.
———————-
You show your ignorence evertine you post.
I never said a TOP Notch QB needed a TOP Notch Oline, but a bad oline will not get them to the superbowl.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:00 pm
6 sacks vs one of the best defenses in the nfl. They played well enough to get them to the conference championship.
Teams dont get that far without good o-line play.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:00 pm
aww KK, he can’t speak for himself huh?
You would think if O-line were so necessary for the success of QBs, that the teams with HOF QBs would invest heavily early in the draft getting top O-linemen huh?
But no, as usual, you’re wrong.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:01 pm
Mistic,
lol you are apologizing for your “improved” o-line giving up 6 sacks just because they played a great team.
Not much improvement shown then, agreed?
QB play buddy. QB play.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:02 pm
alex7 Says:
McRaider,
Brady, Manning, and Ben – the three QBs whose teams invested a measly 4 OUT OF 36 1st round picks on O-linemen the last 12 years.
———————–
Alex — You’re trying too hard.
4 out of 36 = 11%
That means 11% of the 1st-round picks by those teams in the past 12-years were O-Linemen.
Considering there are more than a dozen positions to be filled on a football team, that 11% figure at those OL positions is right about average.
Find another stat to tell us what we already know…great QB’s make up for bad OL’s…but only to a point.
And…WHO ever said Cutler was a great QB, or close to one?? He sure didn’t overcome…
January 31st, 2011 at 2:03 pm
McRaider,
you’re embarrassing yourself.
Two of the teams with the worst O-lines in football are PLAYING in the Super Bowl.
Aaron Rodgers leading rusher 2 of the final 4 games. Haha. Way to open up those running lane holes.
You probably think Manning never gets sacked because he has 5 HOF linemen blocking for him.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:05 pm
Good Hayes,
you agree that teams don’t put any premium into o-linemen when they know they have a top QB.
They just go draft whoever they want at other positions, knowing the QB will take care of the O-line, like Ben and Rodgers have done all year.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:05 pm
alex,
no apologies needed. Any body that knows anything about football, knows that good o-line play is a must if you want to win in the playoffs.
hence the saying ” the game is won and lost in the trenches”
January 31st, 2011 at 2:06 pm
C’mon, KK. Mike, baby…can’t we go back to the way it used to be?
Remember…more than a year ago — before your meltdown and subsequent stalking charges — when I warned you to not let too much personal info out in here??
Not only did you ignore it, but you flaunted it. Hey, I tried. Now, you hate hate hate…refusing to see how poisoned you’ve let your personality become.
Guess that means we won’t be having that beer anytime soon, eh?
January 31st, 2011 at 2:08 pm
67.alex7 Says:
January 31st, 2011 at 2:03 pm
McRaider,
you’re embarrassing yourself.
Two of the teams with the worst O-lines in football are PLAYING in the Super Bowl.
Aaron Rodgers leading rusher 2 of the final 4 games. Haha. Way to open up those running lane holes.
You probably think Manning never gets sacked because he has 5 HOF linemen blocking for him.
++++++++++++++
When the Raiders start using an offense that has quicker check downs, better hot routes, or a mobile QB like Rogers or a QB that almost can’t be tackled like Roethlisberger, then this might be relevant. Until then, we need a better pass blocking o-line.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:08 pm
HayesDaze
It’s time for Davis’ sponge bath, run along.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:11 pm
Yes…we need a better O-line.
What say you to that, KK?? Any football to discuss, or just your hatred of everything fun?
January 31st, 2011 at 2:13 pm
Dakota,
I see your reasoning, but it’s lame seeing that we are adjusting our philosophy to fit our below-average QB.
What has Cleveland gotten out of Pro Bowl linemen Alex Mack and Joe Thomas?
I hope Hue realizes the need to address the big pink elephant in the room after next season.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:14 pm
HayesDaze
It’s time for Davis’ sponge bath, run along.
___________________________________________________
Link?
Source?
Will it aired live?
January 31st, 2011 at 2:14 pm
VY: What do you think the Titans can get for him?
You think he can turn it around? Vick 2.0, in the distance future?
***
Dutch,
I don’t think the Titans can get ANYTHING for him
at $12.75 million he’d virtually untradeable imo, despite Alex’s feelings that he would gladly restructure for less money and a long-term deal (pure speculation) you don’t get to pick the team that trades for your rights and I don’t think any NFL team would make him the clear cut starter from Day 1 with no competition
He’ll eventually get released and then he’ll sign an incentive laden contract with $5 million base salary and all sorts of esculators. I wouldn’t ever compare him to Michael Vick. Vick was the best athlete in the league before he got arrested. Going to prison and meeting with Tony Dungy was the best thing that could have happened to him, both as a man and an NFL player. Sitting behind a pro like McNabb for a year with a stable franchise and an excellent coach like Philly/Reid was the perfect fit
Mike Vick in Philly is rare. Mike Williams in Seattle is too. Ricky Williams in Miami after the CFL once more
but these things don’t happen every day. It depends on the player and the situation/environment.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:15 pm
Hey…what happened to MR?
Didn’t I read earlier, that MR said Gruden “built a winner” here??
HUH?!? I could swear Al wouldn’t let a HC “build” anything here? How many of Gruden’s staff were hired by Gruden, and how many by Al??
If Gruden didn’t hire any more asst’s than other Raiders HC’s hire…then, doesn’t that mean that AL built the winner? Or…maybe Al and Jon built one together??
If it’s true for the losses, it’s gotta be true for the wins, right?
Right, MR??
January 31st, 2011 at 2:16 pm
OAKlifer,
I’m not sold on Robert Gallery without Tom Cable and the ZBS … and I don’t think he’s sold on Oakland for the same reasons
January 31st, 2011 at 2:16 pm
I’m stoked for this super bowl I’m feeln like an upset is about to happen….. Green Bay 27 Pittsburgh 17…… Cwood or the rookie opposite him with a pick six against the speedy but young receiving core….. Great article on C Wood maturing from his days with us, he was so inconsistent with us I wish he would have taken his job more serious…
http://m.espn.go.com/nfl/story?storyId=6071466
January 31st, 2011 at 2:16 pm
Mistic,
“the game is won and lost in the trenches” was correct back in the 3 yards and a cloud of dust days.
How many All-Pros do the Packers have on either side of the line?
How many Steeler O-linemen and D-linemen are All-Pros?
You think the Colts have been a dominant team because of their dominant O-line and D-line?
Didn’t the Patriots just make the playoffs AGAIN despite trading their best D-lineman?
So winning games, whether in the regular season or playoffs, seems to correlate more with QBs than O-lines.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:19 pm
What has Cleveland gotten out of Pro Bowl linemen Alex Mack and Joe Thomas?
_______________________________________________________
Peyton Hillis!
Cleveland, no QB and no receivers!
Delhomme is not the same QB. Wallace is pretty good, on Madden. Reserving judgment on Colt. The Raiders have a better receiving core than the Browns.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:19 pm
71.alex7 Says:
January 31st, 2011 at 2:13 pm
Dakota,
I see your reasoning, but it’s lame seeing that we are adjusting our philosophy to fit our below-average QB.
What has Cleveland gotten out of Pro Bowl linemen Alex Mack and Joe Thomas?
I hope Hue realizes the need to address the big pink elephant in the room after next season.
_________________
I agree. I will always take a great QB over a great LT. But great QBs do not grow on trees. You work with what you have. Right now we have a below average to average QB in Jason Campbell and no prospects of finding a great QB in the draft, nor in free agency (although I hold out hope that an opportunity pops up).
The only way the Raiders will get better on offense is to protect the QB, and get some WRs that can make some plays. Playing 10 on 11 every game is really hurting our passing game. If DHB doesn’t improve by week 4 of next year it is time to sit him and get a real football player on the field.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:20 pm
HayesDaze37 Says:
January 31st, 2011 at 2:15 pm
Hey…what happened to MR?
——————————-
He’s right here as Alex, dumbass.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:20 pm
No doubt Al built the Gruden team, Hayez. That west coast, ball control offense had Davis’s signature all over it. Gruden couldn’t wait to get out of here and start stretching the field.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:22 pm
the Broncos switched from zone blocking gap and power blocking system, a transition the Raiders appear to be undergoing
***
the Raiders were the #2 rushing team in the NFL last year
the Broncos were 26th
156 rushing yards per game versus 96
4.9 yards per carry versus 3.9 ypc
19 TD’s versus 13 TD’s
9 fumbles versus 12 fumbles
January 31st, 2011 at 2:22 pm
wow Hayes, that’s out there.
Davis would have never in a thousand years brought in Gannon if not for Gruden.
Guys like Gannon, Rolando Williams, Elijah Alexander, an aging William Thomas (with Gruden connections to Philly) a 42-year old Rice, not exactly the “bigger/faster” athletes that Davis covets.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:23 pm
You dont have to have all pro line men to have a good o-line.
Can any one name a team that won the superbowl with a bad o-line?
January 31st, 2011 at 2:24 pm
the Broncos switched from zone blocking gap and power blocking system, a transition the Raiders appear to be undergoing
***
Donks ranked 18th in rushing (2009) and dropped to 26th (2010)
How much can the Raiders expect to decline ???
January 31st, 2011 at 2:24 pm
Thoughts On Kolb?
Just read on ESPN they might trade him.
Not sold, seems like a lot of QBs could do well with Philly’s talent (not a knock on Vick).
January 31st, 2011 at 2:25 pm
I can’t think of any quarterback we’ve ever had who fits Al’s idea of a QB more than Rich Gannon. Gannon’s tendency to take whatever’s available underneath is what Davis lives for. It’s everything Al wants in a QB. So, no doubt, Hayez, Al Davis definitely built that team Gruden coached. Gannon is a carbon copy of Darryl Lamonica. I think he’s related to him, he’s so similar.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:26 pm
Dutch,
no response to post #73 ???
Agree? Disagree? your opinion?
January 31st, 2011 at 2:27 pm
Heres my fix for the all star game
Most players elected to the first team dont play so give them the award but let them stay home.
Insteadhave the “all stars” made up of first and second year players. Have them play against the current college all star team.
Remeber when the pros played the college all stars at Soldier field?
January 31st, 2011 at 2:28 pm
And, to get to your next point, Hayez, because I know what trap you’re trying to lure me into, I don’t know why Al let Gruden have so much control of offense and personnel, and the locker room in general. I’ve heard some say that Al was too busy with lawsuits at that time, whatever. Maybe that one 4-12 season in ‘97 made Al wake up. Who knows? All I know is that he ran Gruden out about as soon as the team started to play well, and the closest coach we’ve had to a Gruden since was Kiffin, who Al ran out about as soon as he hired him. Jackson has similarities to Gruden, so why should I believe it won’t end for him the same way it did for Kiffin? Jackson’s saying all the right things right now. So was Kiffin, at this point.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:29 pm
Wow, I’m checking back 3 hours later and the topic is still the same?
Campbell is B- to a B+ depending on who you ask. He’s the 2011 starting QB, barring some blockbuster trade, unlikely camp showing by a backup, or injury.
He’s not great, but he’s a solid game manager with great play action skills who improved dwn the stretch.
I would love to have a Pro Bowl type elite QB, but so would 25-27 other teams as well.
We have more pressing needs, IMO, all of which are easier to address than franchise QB.
-Sign our free agents
-WLB
-CB (especially if Nnamdi walks)
-Another DT (or beast NT if we go 3-4)
-More organized secondary and O line play, more efficient passing game.
Getting a new guy in a new system vs. Jason (hopefully) maturing in the same system with a few familiar faces?
Unless the guy replacing Soup is
-Brady
-Manning
-Brees
-Rodgers
-Rapistburger
-Schaub
-Rivers
fugheddaboutit.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:29 pm
Thoughts On Kolb?
Just read on ESPN they might trade him.
***
Whoever trades for Kolb is only on the hook for 1-year at less than $1.4 million
low risk, high reward
I’d take the gamble, depending on Philly’s asking price. nothing more than a 4th!
January 31st, 2011 at 2:29 pm
@Rockstar
Weren’t the Denver running backs injured coming out of camp?
I just remember stories of them being taken off the field on carts?
Also, Clady had a bad injury.
Not sure they had the back talent we did, just saying.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:29 pm
Moving on, anybody got anything interesting on Wylie?
January 31st, 2011 at 2:29 pm
Wait till Hue benches Russell.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:30 pm
Alex7,
You’re speaking in absolutes, and the only examples of QBs that win without quality offensive linemen you give are future Hall of Famers.
Jason Campbell is not going to get confused with Tom Brady, Peyton Manning or Ben Roethlesberger. Neither are the majority of the other NFL quarterbacks. The vast majority of the other quarterbacks in the league need good offensive linemen to protect tham and to block for their running games. They also need receivers that can run pro routes and catch the ball when it’s thrown to them. They also need defenses that can stop people when they have to so the team isn’t playing from behind and forcing them to throw the ball.
I understand your point, but what you’re trying to convey as a universal point only applies to a small percentage of NFL teams. Everybody else needs an o-line, and even the great ones struggle when they don’t get protection. All you need to do is watch Rivers or Manning or Brady when they’re continually harrassed back there. They aren’t very good under constant pressure, either.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:31 pm
86.DutchRaider77 Says:
January 31st, 2011 at 2:24 pm
Thoughts On Kolb?
Just read on ESPN they might trade him.
Not sold, seems like a lot of QBs could do well with Philly’s talent (not a knock on Vick).
______________________
Last I heard Philly wanted 2 first rounder’s for him. I would only do that for a proven quality starter, not a shot in the dark guy like Kolb.
Also, back when he was starting at the beginning of the year people were questioning his ability to get his WRs the ball and saying he checked down too much….sound familiar?
Pass.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:31 pm
LA,
in hindsight, should we have traded Nnamdi Asomugha for Big Ben (and “little ben”?)
January 31st, 2011 at 2:31 pm
I say Al sticks with Soup.
No USC wannabee pro, no USC once was a pro, No kornkob, no texan who singlehandly beat the condoms for the BCS.
Al will give JC a shot with noone looking over his shoulder
January 31st, 2011 at 2:31 pm
Wait till Hue benches Campbell.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:32 pm
Some might read your last few posts as sarcasm, RMR, but I know you are actually being quite serious. Of course it was Davis who brought in Gannon, the WCO and all the short passing- because as you so often tell us, Davis NEVER gives coaches any leeway to coach the way they want and interferes with ALL the decisions. So it must have been all Al Davis . . . right?
January 31st, 2011 at 2:33 pm
# Plunketthead Says:
January 31st, 2011 at 2:31 pm
Al will give JC a shot with noone looking over his shoulder
……..
So, Al’s purposely not going to carry a viable backup QB? There’s an owner who puts winning above all else.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:34 pm
LA To TheBay Says:
January 31st, 2011 at 2:29 pm
Moving on, anybody got anything interesting on Wylie?
—————————————–
Spent the latter part of his career in the minor leagues, didn’t seem to have other options……..cheap…..sounds like same ole, same ole.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:34 pm
@Rockstar,
Totally agree, took it for gospel. Cannot see anybody taking his contract or giving up a draft pick. Dudes says he wants to start, can’t see him going anywhere that would gurantee him to be the man from day one.
Seems to me, he has a lot of talent and could end up being Vick 2.0, but chances are it wont happen.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:34 pm
again lol
January 31st, 2011 at 2:34 pm
Davy, of course it was Davis who brought in Gannon and the WCO! I agree. I mean, Davis has been all about the WCO his whole life. I remember when Shannahan was trying to go vertical and stretch the field, and Davis wouldn’t let him. Set it up with the dink and dunk, Davis would tell Shannahan. Poor Shannahan got fired because he just wanted to throw the ball down field. Al woulnd’t have it. He’s all west coast. Al’s a Niner guy.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:36 pm
Who said anything about a viable backup?
Dont even think about starting your games with me.
You whupping will make Randys broken jaw look like a pimple by the time I done typefighting with the likes of your Raider hating troll self.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:36 pm
Oh, I get it, Al was “distracted with lawsuits” during the Gruden years. Perhaps he was “napping”, as he is on those rare occasions when something goes right in Alameda. All of the blame, none of the credit. Got it. *yawn*
January 31st, 2011 at 2:37 pm
Alex7 Says:
January 31st, 2011 at 2:34 pm
The Real MaddenRaider Says:
January 31st, 2011 at 2:34 pm
——————————-
Really?, Seriously?
January 31st, 2011 at 2:38 pm
So who likes my all star game?
We would get to see draft picks play against some decent young NFL talent and both sides would try hard for the money!
January 31st, 2011 at 2:38 pm
so far, here is the laundry list of what we need to win next year:
better WRs for JC
better linemen for JC
no backup QB putting “pressure” on JC
no defensive pressure on JC
better OLB
D-coordinator who can run his own show
JC to improve his play beyond anything he has shown thus far in 70 games.
I dunno, I’m taking bets on the 9 win under right now.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:39 pm
Plunketthead,
I’ll tell you who doesn’t like it.
Every college player that’s about to become a 1st or 2nd round pick, and doesn’t want to risk his knee popping in a contrived scrimmage game 1 month before the NFL combine.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:40 pm
rmr, what is the west coast offense?
West coast offense is just another version of the gilman / Davis offense. The emphasis on shorter drops and quicker passes, and pass routes.
Remember Bill Walsh is a direct descendant from the Davis coaching tree.
So indeed Davis is the grand father of the so called west coast offense
January 31st, 2011 at 2:41 pm
Weren’t the Denver running backs injured coming out of camp?
I just remember stories of them being taken off the field on carts?
Also, Clady had a bad injury.
Not sure they had the back talent we did, just saying.
***
Dutch,
Ryan Clady started all 16 games last year
Moreno started 13 games at RB, with Maroney starting the other 3 (like Oakland : McFadden 13, Bush 3)
Buckhalter was active for 15 games, like Cartwright or Reece
I’m not making any excuses for Dungver!
January 31st, 2011 at 2:42 pm
Davy,
I would think, if a CEO hires a bright mind who develops an incredibly profitable product, that the CEO gets credit for hiring the worker, but not for the actual product.
Yay, Al Davis hired Gruden.
Uh-oh, he traded his best coach with no long-term backup plan. Umm, right smack before the most important season in team’s history.
And we had a historically-bad slide. I think we know who was more important.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:43 pm
You could always let the top picks or anyone else who wants to stay at home on the couch.
Theres still lots of guys on the edge of getting drafted who will want to show off or guys that want to move up
January 31st, 2011 at 2:45 pm
im out this jc / davis bashing is tired
January 31st, 2011 at 2:47 pm
oooh, plunketraider’s testy today.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:48 pm
Davy, are you saying I’m giving all of the credit for our success to the coaches, and all of the blame for our failures to Al Davis? Yeah, I guess I am. Maybe because it’s true?
January 31st, 2011 at 2:49 pm
plunkethead didn’t get his fiber this morning. Watch out, everyone.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:52 pm
the excuse for Denver is simple:
They installed a copy of the Patriots play-action pass-first offense.
The passing, for the most part, succeeded.
They had no defense and a RB that struggled with hammy injuries (DMac last year w/ toe). Their overall talent level has been low for a few years now, and are still 2 years away.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:53 pm
# Mistic1 Tha Supavillain Says:
January 31st, 2011 at 2:40 pm
rmr, what is the west coast offense?
West coast offense is just another version of the gilman / Davis offense. The emphasis on shorter drops and quicker passes, and pass routes.
Remember Bill Walsh is a direct descendant from the Davis coaching tree.
So indeed Davis is the grand father of the so called west coast offense
………..
No doubt, Mistic.
I mean, everything Bill Walsh knew he learned from Al Davis. That 49er offense of the ’80s was a replica of the ‘63 Raiders. In fact, the reason Walsh drafted Montana is because he had shades of Cotton Davidson in him. Walsh would watch Montana’s Notre Dame game film and his mouth would just water at the way Joe would ignore a wide receiver wide open on a cross 10 yards downfield, with nobody between him and the goal line, and instead force it to a wideout streaking down the sideline in triple coverage. “That’s our guy!”, Bill said.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:56 pm
Dutch,
Ryan Clady started all 16 games last year
Moreno started 13 games at RB, with Maroney starting the other 3 (like Oakland : McFadden 13, Bush 3)
Buckhalter was active for 15 games, like Cartwright or Reece
I’m not making any excuses for Dungver!
____________________________________________________
Sorry, only point was that I thought we had superior talent to Denver in RB position.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:58 pm
The answer you’re looking for, MR…is the same answer you don’t want to know, KK…
Al Davis lets WINNERS coach, and have a larger say in the operation of the team. If a guy with little or no HC experience comes along (Lance), he’ll make sure that person has the tools around him to improve. If the guy shows he has a WINNER’S aptitude, he’ll carry more weight.
Gruden carried some weight when he won…and Al got fair value for him at the time when he traded his rights. However…to just turn-over a team to ANY HC is the stupidest idea one can have. Would you turn over YOUR half-billion-dollar enterprise to someone, just because he can draw X’s and O’s? Verrrry doubtful, no matter what you say.
Al lets winners coach…and he helps winners develop. However, neither Gruden nor Lance ever showed one iota of having better hiring/drafting skills than Al has. Even if a name comes to mind (and I can already hear it)…that one option (or many) is no better the strike/homerun ration than the average NFL team has when selecting players or staff.
Al gives winners a long leash…but it pains MR, KK, and the like to admit it. It hurts whatever tired argument they have left to disparage anything good about the Raiders.
January 31st, 2011 at 3:02 pm
edward teach Says:
January 31st, 2011 at 2:30 pm
Alex7,
You’re speaking in absolutes, and the only examples of QBs that win without quality offensive linemen you give are future Hall of Famers.
Jason Campbell is not going to get confused with Tom Brady, Peyton Manning or Ben Roethlesberger. Neither are the majority of the other NFL quarterbacks. The vast majority of the other quarterbacks in the league need good offensive linemen to protect tham and to block for their running games. They also need receivers that can run pro routes and catch the ball when it’s thrown to them. They also need defenses that can stop people when they have to so the team isn’t playing from behind and forcing them to throw the ball.
I understand your point, but what you’re trying to convey as a universal point only applies to a small percentage of NFL teams. Everybody else needs an o-line, and even the great ones struggle when they don’t get protection. All you need to do is watch Rivers or Manning or Brady when they’re continually harrassed back there. They aren’t very good under constant pressure, either.
___________________
This is a great post Ed. I wonder why Alex didn’t address it???
January 31st, 2011 at 11:42 pm
Actually Alex 7, I got stuck at post#22. You’re completely ignoring the fact that the packers, bears, and steelers have top ranked defenses that keep them in games. If you don’t think that a good offensive line could help elevate the play of a quarterback, then you’re just ignorant. Yes, a talented quarterback that can avoid the pass rush helps A LOT, but not if every play is horrid o-line play.
February 1st, 2011 at 9:53 pm
I like how this new staff is coming together.
September 9th, 2011 at 2:13 am
iphone 4 refurbished…
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