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Raiders live chat Tuesday at noon

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Jon Becker

  • Raider Dell

    I’m with METHOD this loss is demoralizing.

    The loss on sunday reminds me of the Elvis Grbac pass to Andre Rison during the Joe Bugle era. I remember the fans leaving the stadium stunned and ripped up over that last second touchdown. The team never recovered and the team fell apart due to little or no team leadership.

    I sensed that last sunday also, I saw nobody talking , no madness just dispirited looks and major dissapointment.

    This blog loves to pick on a player or play or blame coaches. The players play, coaches coach, and fans are entertained and yell for our team.

    For the life of me, I can’t put my finger on it, this team has no soul or heart right now. When did this happen? What game or play really doesn’t matter. Has the emotional roller coaster taken it’s toll.

    Strong leadership comes from individuals who display it on the field, and mostly from within yourself.

    I agree some plays make no sense, like why is our safety who was on the practice squad, cut and brought back on the bomb to Megatron, with our hobbled middle linebacker with his ankle issues. Get it!!

    This team needs football players and definetly a defensive scheme that plays in todays happy pass league were the rules are definetly set up for passing the ball. Bringing four rushers over 70% of the time just won’t cut it in this three step and quick strike passing league.

    The Raiders d-Line has always been told to attack the passer and stay in with your gap as their responsibility. Don’t you see why we get killed by most teams rushing the ball, we are so gap undisciplined it drives me crazy. We make every teams backs look like Jim Brown. Change the scheme and look no further than across the bay. They play defense and we have better overall players on defense than they have. Oh yes we do. It’s how they play defense, not the players.

    Finally, this team has all the talent in all areas, it’s playing to that level and more.

    Finally, Hue is going nowhere, he is on board for the next few years. We as the Nation get use to his many quirks, like long deep throws late in games or his uncoventional plays at times you just don’t understand. It’s his style and nothing will change.

    My fustration is lessons from past games not learned and that’s scary.

  • Chris in NY

    I agree. This game is all on the offensive line. KC’s front 7 has been tough lately. They really beat Rodgers to a pulp last game.

    And, Boller aside, they owned our o-line in that first matchup.

    If they get owned again it would take something almost miraculous to pull it off.

    If our o-line can dominate this time we will win this game.

  • SnB offense defense specialteams

    I don’t think anyone here can say the KC and SD are slam dunk victories.

    Truth is, we don’t know how this team will show up in a hostile revitalized Kansas City. The defense has shown no ability to stop anyone of late and that should give us all pause with San Diego.

    Hue needs to man up like the Miller Lite commerical.

    Get the team mentally and physically prepared to play.

    Hue also needs to spend more time with the defense

  • YoungAmerican

    RDE – Mario Williams
    DT – (trade up into the 2nd round) Dontari Poe
    DT – Houston
    LDE – Shaughnessy/Bryant

    WLB – Curry (/ Rookie?)
    MLB – Ruud
    SLB – Wimbley

    CB – Routt
    FS – Huff
    SS – Branch
    CB – FA/Draft – maybe Leonard Johnson (Iowa State)

  • LA to TheBay

    I don’t think anyone here can say the KC and SD are slam dunk victories.
    ——————-

    It all comes down to some AFC West Slugfests.

    With all the bullsh;t this season and even after 3 straight losses, I’m not sure this is the perfect way to end it.

    Obviously, we have to hope for help, but that aside, if we go out and beat KC in their barn and close out the season with another win over SD at home, I would say that’s a major stepping stone and will show us where we’re going next year.

    The Texans have been brought up in here a lot. Well, Kubiak runs the O. Pretty much same as it’s been for 2, 3 years straight. They got a great D coordinator and added 1 or two pieces and their elite now.

    That should be the template.

    But lots of pride on the line here last two weeks.

  • Chris in NY

    Curious to see whether KC builds off their win over GB or was so up for that they suffer a letdown.

    My guess is they’ll be up for it with still a glimmer of playoff hope and the fact they’re now playing for a player’s coach like Romeo to possibly keep that job than a dictator who was on thin ice in Haley.

  • Silverandblack666

    Nice post Dell!

    Its almost cruel that we were teased with playoff hopes after 9 years.

    I myself am depressed about it.

  • silverback

    The loss on sunday reminds me of the Elvis Grbac pass to Andre Rison during the Joe Bugle era.
    —–
    Lets hope Hue can communicate with the players better than Joe “I feel so bad for these guys” Bugel.

  • Raider Dell

    Silverandblack666 Says:
    December 20th, 2011 at 10:22 am

    Its almost cruel that we were teased with playoff hopes after 9 years.

    I myself am depressed about it.

    $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

    I agree with your comment. That Buffalo loss and Detroit loss were earily similar. What has not been learned from our DC. I’m so tired of reading or hearing, we learn from our mistakes, when players are interviewed. I’m just saying, why can’t we learn from our wins, the losses are just an excuse to not say, I didn’t play well.

  • bcz24

    Anyone who says this team is talented isn’t looking at the facts. Our depth on defense wouldn’t make a lot of teams practice squads. Yes our starting squads have the talent to make a run, but they are all fvcking hurt. Injuries dont matter? Houston got smoked by Carolina. Indy is 1-13 (a lot of that is manning, but has anyone looked at their defensive injuries? staggering) Green Bay looked just mediocre with the loss of Jennings and the oline injuries. Its easy to blame Hue, and he bears some of that blame, but to say injuries don’t matter is you just fooling yourself. We dont have the depth in Oakland to fight through injuries. That is fact, look at our record, it proves it.

  • Chris in NY

    Why would you guys want to just scrap our DTs in favor of L. Houston and some question mark?

    - TK leads the NFL in sacks by a DT over the last two seasons.
    - Seymour is 4th in the NFL over that same span. He was having an absolute monster season before getting hurt around week 5 or 6. I think he’s been gutting it out at about 70% most of the time since then.
    - Bryant is a beast. He’s the future at the position.
    - L Houston is OK. He’s solid and has the potential to be really good. But right now he’s not as good as any of those other three.

    No idea where this comes from.

    If you want to make a drastic change on defense you’ve got three options that make sense:
    - Hire a new d coordinator. Preferably somebody like Mike Nolan.
    - Get rid of McClain. He hasn’t shown he can play MLB in a 4-3 scheme.
    - Keep McClain but switch to a 3-4. Contrary to popular opinion, we actually have a ton of pieces in place for a 3-4. McClain is better suited for it. Wimbley can be a very good rush OLB. Seymour, TK, Houston, Bryant and Shaughnessy can all play 3-4 DE. Curry could potentially play outside, inside and was a great pass rusher in college. The one piece that’s really missing there is a huge NT. It’s a very important piece. But that’s the only one that we’d really need to fill.

  • raiderinparadise

    Blowing leads is partially your offense (but this offense has been hurt all year in skill sets) and then its your defense not being able to buckle down and dictate the game late. If this defense was at least ok, then we would be 11-5 with no worries laughing at Tebowmania.

    but instead ….

    yea.

  • LA to TheBay

    Chris, I want to see some mean ol run stuffers at DT (or at least one guy at NT) with Kelly and Seymour in a steady rotation.

    I, unlike many semi pros, think Seymour still plays at a high level when healthy (and motivated) and Kelly is great in his role.

  • Dr. Hunter S. Thompson

    For those of you that think Hue is untouchable think again.

    Not
    For
    Long.

    The Raiders need a GM and a new GM will want to bring in his own guy.

    Hue is a good play caller but he is a lousy head coach.

    We need a defensive minded Head coach.

    Jeff Fisher please.

    Just Win Baby.

  • silverback

    LA To TheBay Says:
    December 20th, 2011 at 10:40 am
    Chris, I want to see some mean ol run stuffers at DT (or at least one guy at NT) with Kelly and Seymour in a steady rotation.
    ——
    Rotation or lack thereof being the crux of the matter.

  • YoungAmerican

    Sacks are great. Lack of gap discipline and consistent overpursuit in the run game are not.

    TK was nothing before Richard Seymour came to take attention away from him. And even together they can’t stop the run. Both are on the wrong side of 30, and both are eating up a bunch of salary cap space ($20 million between them if Richard Seymour gets his $7.5 million roster bonus) that their play simple has not warranted.

    The Raiders have several spots on the team that need improvement, so keeping two aging one-dimensional DTs when that money could help improve the LB corps and secondary depth, maybe some other spots as well? Doesn’t seem smart. Of course, this all hinges on the ability of the Raiders to find a young DT/NT in the draft, which would require accumulating more draft picks. McFadden, Seymour, Kelly, and McClain are the only expendable players who could bring in anything in the way of draft picks.

    I like Bryant, but I think he might be best suited at base LDE and DT in nickle packages.

    Houston is playing out of position at LDE. He’s the Raiders’ most consistent player against the run. He’s a natural DT and should be moved back there where his high motor will help him maintain gap control.

  • YoungAmerican

    I think Jeff Fisher would be a perfect head coach… but I still don’t think Hue is going anywhere unless the final two games are flat-out UGLY on the offensive side of the ball.

  • RaidingTexas

    LA To TheBay Says:

    That should be the template.

    —————————-

    This seems to be the part where we continue to differ, LA. I still haven’t figured out why some of you guys think Hue is an offensive genius. I’ve laid out the case as to why you should at least question this.

    Yes, 2010 saw a huge improvement in the offense. Yes, it was Hue’s first year here – as an OC.

    But it was also the first post-Jamarcus season. That alone should be worth the three extra wins over 2009. It was also the closest thing to a full season with DMac.

    Hue’s record as an offensive coordinator in the NFL is not good. Here are the other stints:

    2003 Washington Redskins – 5th lowest points scored in the NFC. Four times they scored 10 or fewer points in a game, including getting shutout once.

    2007 Atlanta Falcons – 2nd lowest points scored in the entire fkn NFL!!! FIVE TIMES they scored 10 or fewer points in a game.

    Both seasons, those teams regressed on offense from the previous seasons. He only served as OC for one year both times. He was not invited to be an OC anywhere else in the subsequent seasons (2004 and 2008). He took lesser roles as position coaches.

    So, again, I ask you guys, where is the evidence that Hue is a great NFL offensive mind? I have yet to see it.

  • ohioraider

    Just Cry Uncle, Hue. This team looks cooked. Maybe Chris in NY can will it to victory.

  • RaiderRockstar

    The Raiders need VETERAN LEADERSHIP

    ***

    I don’t agree. look at the roster

    Offense: Palmer, Campbell, Boller at QB (all vets)
    Bush in his 5th year. McFadden in his 4th. Reece in his 4th. Cartwright. TJ Housh at WR. Schilens in his 4th year. Kevin Boss at TE. Satele, Heyer, Carlisle & Barnes all vets on the O-Line.

    Defense: Seymour, Henderson & Kelly all vets on the D-Line. Moss in his 5th year. Scott in his 4th. Wimbley, Groves & Blackstock all vets at LB. Routt, Sheppard, Huff & Giordano are vets. Branch in his 4th year.

    Seabass & Shane are ancient. Condo is 30

    Saunders & Bresnahan certainly don’t lack experience either … but most of the position coaches (outside of Wylie) or assistants do!

  • LA to TheBay

    Well, being that he’ll likely get another year, we’ll find out.

    He’ll get an entire offseason with how he wants to do things as a head coach on any other team would do (IE, have a say in player acquisitions, drafting, picking his staff, etc).

    You also see what he had to work with in those other two stops.

    And that was a number of years ago.

    Can’t forget that he went to McFadden and asked what DMC liked to run. Nobody bothered to ask him before??

    I don’t know that he is a great offensive mind but I also don’t know that he has to be.

    Every play he called was money on Sunday, even if they didn’t all get executed.

  • Chris in NY

    I realize the D has blown some leads. Buffalo, Denver and Detroit being the most troubling. But they’ve actually persevered at the end of just about all our wins. I think every win except the Jets game has come down to situations like the Detroit game with the defense on the field and the opponent having a chance to win or tie with a successful two-minute drill.

    That’s not to say the defense has been good. Overall it’s been pretty poor and given up a TON of points. But in do or die situations they’ve probably held their own.

  • Dakota

    It amazes me how some of you guys can take this load of crap, munch on it, and then claim it tastes like pumpkin pie.

    Face it, our defense sucks. Our Defensive coordinator is a fool. Our head coach is in way over his head and makes very poor game management decisions.

    If you think otherwise you are just lying to yourselves.

  • YoungAmerican

    Raiders don’t need more veteran leadership, they need guys who make plays when it counts. Moore, Ford, and Wimbley are the closest things to playmakers on the roster. Getting those two guys back on offense (and adding another workhorse RB who can split carries with Bush/McFadden/Jones/whoever is around after the season) will be huge for Carson Palmer, who like it or not, is the Raiders’ unquestioned leader in the locker room now.

    But on the defensive side? Wimbley has had a good season but I think we’re starting to see why he isn’t a base RDE – only one pass rush move, and doesn’t have the bulk to stop the run from a three-point stance. He’s an above average 4-3 SLB and provides enough of a pass rush in nickle packages – that’s the role he should stay in.

    Mario Williams would have the same impact on the Raider defense that Julius Peppers did for the Bears. The Raiders need to shed some salary, acquire some more draft picks in the process, and sign some guys who change the complexion of games.

  • Dr. Hunter S. Thompson

    Don’t forget.

    Things have changed.

    In the past the Raiders have had to settle on the best Head coach that would work with Al.

    Now we can just get the best Head coach.

    HIRE FISHER.

    Just Win Baby.

  • Silverandblack666

    “It amazes me how some of you guys can take this load of crap, munch on it, and then claim it tastes like pumpkin pie.

    Face it, our defense sucks. Our Defensive coordinator is a fool. Our head coach is in way over his head and makes very poor game management decisions.

    If you think otherwise you are just lying to yourselves.”

    LOL pretty funny but sadly true.

  • raiderinparadise

    You know …

    You all just trash coaches, every single one of them. be realistic, its Oakland. Nobody wants to come here. No big name coaches. Thats Al’s old retarded fault. Now the franchise has no stadium, no “true” owner and questionable power ranks, in which Hue just traded away the bank for a 31 yr old QB out of retirement. The players are blatantly overpaid and the schemes have always been controlled by Al, coaches have been mocked, players have been destoryed and the media perseption is ugly.

    Let Hue have his time. He will learn a lot from this season. There are few teams that EVER had this type of year of setbacks emotionally and physically:

    physically:

    Shaugnessy
    Hiram Eugene
    McFAdden
    Cambell
    palmer trade
    ford/moore/taiwan
    Curry Trade
    Seabass hurt
    on and on…. we all know

    emotionally:

    AL
    McClain
    Chris Johnson

    You all will continue to fire and hire for next 10 years? again? let Hue roll with it. since apparently you all think we should be 14-0 right now?

  • Just Win Baby

    Hue Jackson is the typical Raiders coach (with the exception of Gruden) in the modern era. Talk jive ebonics with the guys all week in practice, talk a mouthful of bs at a press conference, and in the meantime the team has no discipline because nobody is held acountable for their f-ups and uncle Hue will stand behind your failures in the press. He still has Al Davis’ sack in his mouth because he is scared to death of Amy Trask, and I wouldn’t be surprised to hear him say how we’re still building a bully here on Friday. I bought into his bs early on, but this team needs leadership and it is so painfully obvious that they aren’t geting it.

  • luvmarvhub

    We’ve done a lot of Hue bashing here for a few weeks, deservedly so, I believe, but look at Mike Tomlin last night: deciding to use and risk further injury to Benmay be one thing, but what the heck was he doing in the final minutes of the last quarter when it was clear the Steelers couldn’t win it with Ben, yet risking further injury to his star.

    That, I don’t understand at all.

  • Dr. Hunter S. Thompson

    Shut your piehole, Dakotex.

    The real reason this team is doing an epic swan dive is because you boy, McFadden is made of glass.

    Go Raiders!

  • RaiderRockstar

    RRS= summertime said Hue wasnt all that….he was right…score one for Podunk….again

    ***

    ROG,

    thanks for the props, but I’m not proud of the fact that I was right. I was hoping Hue would prove me wrong (and he still might)

    my point back then was that Al Davis should get all the credit for the offensive improvements last year – and I still hold to that. Hue Jackson came in and brought Palmer in – a move that I strongly supported. Ditto with Aaron Curry. there were a few head scratcher personnel moves, but nothing to make me call for his head. there have also been quite a few head scratcher play calls – which was also the case last year

    My original point was that Hue Jackson wasn’t QUALIFIED to be an NFL Head Coach. You could argue several other guys weren’t either that have had success in this league, but it’s always a gamble. Usually Al Davis gambles don’t pan out. Not that they never do, but I’d say 9 times out of 10 it’s an epic fail and this is coming from an Al Davis supporter. I understand we didn’t have 150 qualified guys banging on Al’s door for the job, but still feel we could have done better. Now that he’s the head man I’m ok because he’s under contract and I’m sick of the coaching carousel. I say hire a G.M. and let him decide if Hue stays or goes. Another thing, Hue should have NO SAY OR INPUT in who the G.M. (his boss) will be

  • raiderinparadise

    my point back then was that Al Davis should get all the credit for the offensive improvements last year – and I still hold to that.

    ———————-

    I just puked all over my keyboard.

    you can’t be serious? … but apparenlty you are.

  • luvmarvhub

    “Hue inherited an 8-8 team Harbaugh got a 6-10 team.’

    Harbaugh got a defensive team full of talent and an offensive team with a qb that just needed good coaching.

    With the defensive talent that’s on the Niners, maybe even Bresnahan, Ryan, or Al Davis couldn’t screw them up.

  • Dakota

    I don’t know if 8-8 will save Hue’s job. The way his team came out and looked like a high school football team playing the Phins and Packers, and then his brain dead calls that cost us the Lions game…I just do not think he is in a safe position even at 8-8.

    If he goes 7-9, losing the last 5 games in this fashion, he is certainly a goner.

    I think he needs to go 9-7 to save his job now. I know there have been a lot of injuries on offense, and most of the teams problems are on the defensive side of the ball, but he is the head coach, and he ultimately decided to stick with Chucky B. He didn’t have the team anywhere near prepared to play the Phins or the Packers.

    He also has shown that he can’t handle all of his current responsibilities, so a GM has to be brought in, and I don’t see any reason why Mark and Amy would give him say in who that GM will be. He has not earned that right yet. If the team was 10-6 or 11-5, I think they would have listened to him, but he dropped the ball. So the new GM will have no loyalty to Hue.

    I would not be surprised to see Hue back next year, but I have a feeling that a change will be made unless he wins out.

  • Dakota

    275.Dr. Hunter S. Thompson Says:
    December 20th, 2011 at 11:16 am
    Don’t forget.

    Things have changed.

    In the past the Raiders have had to settle on the best Head coach that would work with Al.

    Now we can just get the best Head coach.

    HIRE FISHER.

    Just Win Baby.
    ++++++++++++++++++++++

    Might be the first sane thing you have ever contributed to this blog.

  • Dr. Hunter S. Thompson

    CLOWN SUITS knew when he made the trade for Palmer that it would be considered a failure if the Raiders didn’t make the playoffs, THIS YEAR.

    Al wouldn’t tolerate this COLLAPSE.

    Hire Fisher.

    Just Win Baby.

  • RaidingTexas

    RaiderRockstar Says:

    my point back then was that Al Davis should get all the credit for the offensive improvements last year – and I still hold to that

    ————————

    I second that. It was Al who ultimately had to decide to cut that POS Jamarcus. That accounted for most of the offensive improvement IMO.

  • RaiderRockstar

    you can’t be serious? … but apparenlty you are

    ***

    paradise,

    I’m not going to go over that again. Ask BCZ. He debated with me about it for months!

    at the end we still did not agree :P

  • emil4423

    Who will fire hue?

  • inonewordraider

    we’re 12th in pass yards, 6th in rush yards with DMAC, Moore, Ford out extended periods of time. Our O is fine

  • Just Win Baby

    Amy Trask will fire Hue. Eventually.

  • Silverandblack666

    ““Hue inherited an 8-8 team Harbaugh got a 6-10 team.’

    Harbaugh got a defensive team full of talent and an offensive team with a qb that just needed good coaching.

    With the defensive talent that’s on the Niners, maybe even Bresnahan, Ryan, or Al Davis couldn’t screw them up.”

    Really?

    Lets look at what we pay our “Stars” on defense and what do the 49ers pay their “star” on defense.

    Also name 5 defensive starters other than Patrick willis on that defense?

    Its not the telnet level of their players its the way they play defense with intensity and how disciplined they are in gap assignments. They attack they execute and they have not given up a rushing touchdown all year.

    Its called COACHING!!!!!!

    You cannot convince me otherwise.

  • raiderinparadise

    RaidingTexas Says:
    December 20th, 2011 at 11:26 am
    RaiderRockstar Says:

    my point back then was that Al Davis should get all the credit for the offensive improvements last year – and I still hold to that

    ————————

    I second that. It was Al who ultimately had to decide to cut that POS Jamarcus. That accounted for most of the offensive improvement IMO.

    ———–

    LOL THAT PIECE OF SHIZ THAT HE DRAFTED!!!??? that he defended with the overhead projector?!

    “jamarcus is a greeaat playyyer”

    That he let hold out on him for a whole rookie year until Al paid the moon and stars for him?

    Unreal how dillusional you guys are.

    Al cut a player that every coach he had told him they couldnt win with him? MOst that defied him on that were fired.

    Al was awful after the last superbowl run.

    He crapped away the organization with terrible picks, terrible coaches, strangling the schemes for disaster while his 70′s teams visions were in his head, playing over and over again.

    Why would any d-corrdinator come to oakland? when some 81 year old is forcing you to play 4-3 cover 1 the whole game no matter your personnel or background?

    lnae kiffin was a prick, but al davis wouldnt let his dad monte kiffin be the d coach. ar eyou serious?! monte kiffin the best d coordinator ever?

    get outta here al davis losers.

  • RaidingTexas

    Inonewordraider Says:

    we’re 12th in pass yards, 6th in rush yards with DMAC, Moore, Ford out extended periods of time. Our O is fine

    ———————-

    Easy to pad stats in garbage time when you’re getting blown out 34-0.

  • inonewordraider

    we’re 27th in total defense

  • Chris in NY

    7-9, 8-8, 9-7 … Hue is not going anywhere. Nor should he.

    Back to reality, please.

  • inonewordraider

    Easy to pad stats in garbage time when you’re getting blown out 34-0.

    __________________
    guess you haven’t been watching the games, we’ve scored enough points to win versus the bills, broncos, and detroit

  • RaidingTexas

    Raiderinparadise Says:

    get outta here al davis losers.

    —————————–

    LOL Dude you’re not reading what I said. I only gave Al Davis credit for cutting Jamarcus, nothing else.

    You’re not very good at reading comprehension are you?

  • Just Win Baby

    You’re on dope if you think this clusterphuck is going to win out. Reality? LMAO

  • YoungAmerican

    Also name 5 defensive starters other than Patrick willis on that defense?

    —————-

    Justin Smith, Aldon Smith, Navarro Bowman, and Carlos Rogers come to mind.

    Part of it is the scheme, sure. The other part is finding players who fit the scheme – putting players in a position where they can succeed.

    Poor drafting, bad contracts to underachieving players, and a scheme that was a total mismatch with personnel (Branch is the only DB who can play zone, D-line plays with no gap discipline, allowing blockers to get to the second level when the LBs – a 3-4 ILB, a 3-4 OLB/DE, and a 4-3 SLB playing WLB, are constantly in man coverage) have been plaguing the Raiders for years now.