No Whole Foods quite yet
By Matt Artz
Sunday, January 30th, 2011 at 9:58 am in Uncategorized.
Not sure if this story appeared in today’s paper, but it looks like Whole Foods couldn’t strike a deal to move into former Barnes & Noble at Fremont Boulevard and Mowry Avenue.
For those of you who can’t wait to pay $4 a pound for Cara Cara oranges, I offer you this.
Meanwhile, the Mercury News had more bad news about a company that is already in Fremont — for now.
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January 30th, 2011 at 2:30 pm
Anyone who believes that Whole Foods is interested in (1.) opening a store in Fremont (*with or without huge tax give-aways from our city council*) and (2.) locating so near a Trader Joe’s needs a big dose of reality. Fremont has a long history of failed stores and restaurants – and that history is readily available to Whole Foods and anyone else who cares to read about it. Because Whole Foods is a highly specialized business, appealing to a very narrow niche market, they do their homework quite thoroughly. A store like theirs wouldn’t last a year in Fremont and they know that.
January 30th, 2011 at 4:44 pm
I can’t understand why Whole Foods would be asked to be placed in an area where they want to put in more “affordable/elderly housing.” People on the lower economic rungs are happy to be shopping at Food Max and other economical stores, older people are pretty frugal in their buying patterns.
If they want less expensive organics, they have Trader Joe’s and the organic section of Raley’s (which, by the way has been providing a lot of higher end amenities to the area for years already.) Why push them out?
They’ve got losts of low cost apartments in the area, then they get upset when a Goodwill store locates on a prominent corner. Sad. They also moved out the second hand book store and another charity store so they could make the area upscale. Put in stores that serve the people that actually live in the area.
Another thing they do is cut back so much on decent parking in the high density areas. Look at the Sequoia and Peralta development — they keep pushing for residents to use only public transit, allow for only one parking space per unit, but they all double up, keep three cars, and they fill up all the on street parking for blocks for all the residential areas around. What a mess our planning leaves us.
Put Whole Foods somewhere in Mission where the high end lives. Centerville has an increasing ethnic mix that would probably be happy with the farmers markets and smaller ethnic groceries rather than high end extravaganzas.
January 31st, 2011 at 9:27 am
Mission has the right income level but an ethnic demographic that is not really ideal.
I don’t think Whole Foods will ever open in Fremont, or at least not anytime soon, because they have indeed done the research Randy states.
January 31st, 2011 at 10:17 am
I never understand these arguments against more upscale stores and groceries because nearly every single person I know leaves the area to shop for clothing, etc. either to Pleasanton or Palo Alto. They also leave the area regularly to travel to San Ramon or Palo Alto to shop at Whole Foods.
Everyone I talk to under the age of 70 wishes that Fremont had more upscale amenities. For whatever reason, Fremont seems hell bent on catering to the low income. I live in Fremont because I genuinely like the locale and where I happen to live (Niles). Lord knows it’s not for the shopping and restaurants.
Trader Joes is nothing like Whole Foods. The only reason I shop at TJs is because they have yummy frozen apps. And for the record, the organic milk at Whole Foods is cheaper than at TJs, Target or Safeway. So it’s not all about $4 a pound Cara Caras.
January 31st, 2011 at 10:25 am
I would love to see Whole Foods open in Fremont. I am 26 and I think this would attract more tax dollars to the city. However, I think that original Barnes & Noble site is a little too small. I do agree with some other posters that many residents wish to see more upscale amenities. Yep, I leave Fremont to go to Santana Row, Los Altos, and Palo Alto.
January 31st, 2011 at 10:29 am
Fremont is the 4th largest City in the bay Area, It is also the most boring. No downtown, no vision.
Personally I go to San Jose for resturants and shopping, sometime Palo Alto for dinning.
What is so frustrating most of us go to San Jose, Palo Alto, Mountain View, Cupertino, yet our Paper “The Argus tells us all about San Leandro, who cares about San leandro, tell me about San Jose, etc. Where in the hell is San leandro?
January 31st, 2011 at 10:44 am
Why is it that Fremont is so short sided when it comes to actually having something worthwhile in the area? How come they feel that the area of the old Barnes and Noble would actually be a good location? The parking in that complex is already horrendous and the lot itself is in such disrepair that it is like trying to manuever an obstacle course through it. Why have they not offered up the old Lucky’s on Blacow and Grimmer as a possible site? It is time for Fremont to actually get some City Planners who can get things done! This is exactly why anything worthwhile is outside of Fremont!!
January 31st, 2011 at 10:44 am
Why is this so important to people? Are there really ingredients that are unavailable elsewhere? I’m open to a Whole Foods, but talking to neighbors it’s almost as if their culinary livelihood depends on this place. Between the various grocery centers and farmers markets I don’t see reason to care so much. I’d be glad if we had it, but it’s definitely not worth a subsidy.
January 31st, 2011 at 10:48 am
Fremont is more the Costco, Wal-Mart, Target kinda place. Always has been. Of course these stores are now being supplemented with the 99¢ Store. Don’t hold your breath for upscale. The demographics don’t fit.
January 31st, 2011 at 10:49 am
I agree with comment #7, Yee. We need some better City Planners. How does one get onto the Planning Commission anyway? Is there an age minimum… (hey i have a BA in political science… haha)
January 31st, 2011 at 11:00 am
Upscale will never survive in Fremont because if it’s in Fremont, that fact alone prevents it from being perceived as upscale.
It’s been forever that the snobby people have said that they ‘have to shop elsewhere’ because that adds the prestige factor to their purchases. They may make a trip every three or four months to do their shopping in Palo Alto or San Jose, but they talk like they go every day.
Fremont should take a look at what it is — a great place to raise families — and build on that and concentrate on basic family services and supports — good schools, youth orchestras, chess clubs, swimming facilities, community band and dance and art programs, senior activities, cultural centers, libraries, gardening clubs. Work on building good people instead of marketing illusions.
January 31st, 2011 at 11:29 am
Randy is correct, Whole Foods has done their homework and Fremont is not a good fit for them. Perhaps somewhere in Newark? I’m not sure.
January 31st, 2011 at 11:58 am
Poppie – I respectfully disagree. I would like some place to purchase sustainably farmed or wild fresh (not frozen) seafood. Where might I find that in the tri-city area? Nowhere. Say I am having a party and would like a variety of cheeses and olives and fresh bread to serve that are not prepackaged. Where might I find that in the tri-city area? Again, nowhere.
I work in Palo Alto so I have the luxury of going to Whole Foods on a regular basis, however, it’s not because I want some sort of prestige factor in toting my Whole Foods bag into my house. That’s ludicrous and just the kind of attitude that will keep Fremont from ever being anything but a stuck in the 1970s bedroom community where people work and sleep.
January 31st, 2011 at 12:53 pm
@Audrey, the most efficient route to the planning commission is to raise cash for local Democrats. Vinnie Bacon can elaborate on the least efficient route.
@Jen, I think for the most part a local businesses reflect local demand. I don’t expect that many share you demand for “sustainable” products. The rest of your needs (cheeses and breads, etc) can be supplied by two thriving businesses already in the Hub.
January 31st, 2011 at 1:29 pm
Audrey, planning is done by city staff, not planning commission. Planning commission votes on projects that come before it. Planning commission can’t make whole foods come here and neither can anyone else. Whole foods has to be serious first.
Marty #8 – it’s a little scary that I sort of agree with you – I also don’t understand the great passion that Whole foods has. I would love to see that need met and would welcome Whole foods if they chose to locate here.
January 31st, 2011 at 1:35 pm
Poppie — good observations. Keeping it real!
January 31st, 2011 at 1:52 pm
I’m so sick of this argument, but I too would love to see Whole Foods in Fremont, as well as some decent upscale restaurants and shopping. I too leave the county to shop at Whole Foods and to purchase clothing because frankly, the Newark mall is pathetic unless you’re 16 years old and into faux leather.
It would be nice to see a Whole Foods, but I’d be just as happy with an Andronico’s market. I too would like to buy fresh, wild salmon.Does Safeway or Target have that? No. Do they have grass fed beef? Only occasionally. Trader Joe’s is good for many things, but their produce leaves something to be desired. And frankly, there are plenty of people who will support an upscale market here. I’m so tired of waiting for something to happen I’m thinking of moving elsewhere just so I don’t spend all my money on gas going elsewhere to do 90% of my shopping.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:04 pm
Audrey #10 – Planning Commissioners are appointed. When a position opens anyone can apply for it, but the appointment is made by the Mayor. You don’t need a background in planning. Having experience in city planning means nothing, just ask Vinnie Bacon. He applied for an open position in 2009. The Mayor opted to appoint a young woman lawyer who also studied at the Cordon Bleu in Paris. The latest appointment is Raj Salwan a local veterinarian. It’s who you know. Bottom line.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:25 pm
oh… I see. thanks for the insight, i was just curious
January 31st, 2011 at 2:35 pm
Marty,
Please enlighten me as to where I might find a cheese counter where I can buy (not cheddar and American) cheese by weight at the Hub. There must have been a deli or cheesemonger that I missed.
TJs has a reasonable selection of breads, but it’s hit and miss.
It’s not Whole Foods per se. Could be an independent store – I don’t care.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:47 pm
Jen – Raley’s and perhaps TJ’s. Panera for your fresh loafs, but I just realized Panera is not in the Hub.
BTW, isn’t there a specialty Cheese store on Mission?
You may have a preference for the Whole Food’s specific offerings, a brand perhaps. But obviously people don’t share that same demand in Fremont.
Like I said, there can’t be many ingredients that aren’t available elsewhere. Specialty items may require a little work to find. That’s why they’re special.
January 31st, 2011 at 2:51 pm
Perhaps our resident foodie can chime in. How many dishes has Andrew cooked where the ingredients needed to be sourced at Whole Foods?
How many of those ingredients had to be sourced outside of Fremont?
My point is that people feel good about shopping at Whole Foods. But when you think it through, the store may be convenient but it is practically useless.
January 31st, 2011 at 3:08 pm
Jen, check out Raley’s. They have a small fish department and do offer fresh wild seafood on occasion, and they will special order for you.
If you work in Palo Alto, and shop there, why not consider living there as well? The commute can’t be good for the planet.
January 31st, 2011 at 3:21 pm
Well that takes care of that debate. Marty and Poppie say no Whole Foods in Fremont, it’s not realistic and besides there’s nothing worth buying at Whole Foods anyhow. Move to Palo Alto all you crazy weird peoples. So Marty and Poppie, what do you want to see go in the old Barnes & Nobles space?
January 31st, 2011 at 3:33 pm
Costco has a excellent selection of cheeses.
Just remember this is Fremont remember Fremonts Slogan
“KEEP FREMONT SMALL”
January 31st, 2011 at 3:45 pm
Jen, I have not been myself, but I understand Marina Market in the new Fremont Times Square (where Navlet’s used to be) has fresh fish. As for cheeses try the Munchner Haus Deli next to the Pancake House across from the Hub on Fremont Blvd. They make great pastrami sandwiches too.
January 31st, 2011 at 3:47 pm
That’s not even close to what I said Gracie.
January 31st, 2011 at 3:57 pm
Whole foods will never work in Fremont. The average family can’t afford to shop there. This is also why the ballpark would not work in Fremont the average family here can’t take a family of four to a ballgame nor would they even like to go. Wake up NO WHOLE FOODS AND NO BALLPARK. Wow strike two Niles.
January 31st, 2011 at 4:11 pm
Fremont has a higher ave income than Menlo Park. My family can afford to attend a game here and there.
January 31st, 2011 at 4:12 pm
Marina Foods (as well as the Ranch 99s I’ve been told to hit up for fresh fish) has fish flown in from China and Thailand. I’ve been in because I’ve had this suggestion before. Definitely not good for the environment.
Have any of you even BEEN in a really nice market? You say people can’t afford to shop at Whole Foods. I can buy my groceries between there and the Newark Farmer’s Market for the same price as I can shopping at Safeway. So they can’t afford to buy local grass fed meat or whatever, but there’s a line out the door at Market Broiler and Outback where it’s over $100 for 4 people to eat for dinner. And forget about finding a parking spot at Union Landing for a movie where it’s at least $40 for two people to see a show.
It’s not a matter of money, folks, it’s a matter of awareness and preference.
January 31st, 2011 at 4:37 pm
I disagree with the argument that folks in Fremont can’t afford Whole foods or that it won’t be embraced by our community.
January 31st, 2011 at 5:19 pm
Jen, I occasionally stop in Draegers on the peninsula and Lunardi’s in the south bay. They’re great to have, as I am sure Whole Foods would be. And, I agree with your sentiments about the high produce prices at Safeway and eating and cooking good food on a budget.
But I really don’t think this is an issue of ignorance or awareness. Food isn’t categorically better at Whole Foods. You may be comfortable with their offerings. You may have extremely particular standards. But it appears that Whole Foods isn’t sure there’s enough of you in Fremont.
January 31st, 2011 at 6:32 pm
Through this whole threat is the thought that the city can just cause something to happen. The city establishes a general plan and zoning to facilitate development of all kinds. Those applicants whose plans coform to the zoning are free to invest their money in opening a store.
People will only invest if they think they will get a good return on their investment and nothing happens until they write a check.
Everyone wants to be on the corner of Fremont and Mowry although only two corners are big enough for anything worthwhile. One of those corners has a gas station which was approved probably 50+ years ago by a city council which has no surviving members today. The last hope is Barnes & Noble, but, if I were Whole Foods, I would worry about parking.
The best central location for Whole Foods is the Corner of Walnut and Fremont, the corner of the Target parking lot.
I dealt with Whole Foods many years ago and they were set to be the anchor for the next phase of the Irvington redevelopment with their store where Kragen Auto Parts is. The local reps were ready to go when the corporate types backed out of the project, essentially killing the whole redevelopment project.
It certainly is much more complicated than many of the posters are willing to accept.
January 31st, 2011 at 7:20 pm
The Tri-City Sporting Goods location would have been ideal, ample parking, large facility with multiple entrances. But, we needed more high-density housing, and yes Gus, I know what you’re going to say, it was zoned that way. Obviously not originally since there was a retail store on the damned lot; kind of like the gas station at Mowry and Fremont Blvd.
January 31st, 2011 at 9:20 pm
SaygoodnightGracie —
I think a skating rink would be great in the old Barnes and Nobles. With an Archery Range on one side. Or maybe a Children’s Gym. A cultural center; a dance studio offering classes in all kinds of ethnic dances, ballet, tap, etc. and etc. to all ages. An arts and crafts exhibition hall; a fine arts pavilion that has studios for pottery, weaving, painting, design. A children’s theatre. Practice studios for musicians. A place where people crammed into apartments can make noise and stay up late without having to deal with alcohol and cover charges.
February 1st, 2011 at 7:18 am
My prediction — the next tenant to occupy the B&N property will be a Spirit Halloween store.
February 1st, 2011 at 7:52 am
Skating Rinks, Children’s Gym’s and the like are fine, but I doubt they’ll work out without a “cover charge”, everything costs money and has to be paid for somehow.
And please, can’t someone stop the Spirit Halloween infestation? What I don’t get is the “why would you need to shop at a Whole Foods, when Muenchner Haus has such a great cheese selection” type of reaction. I like the Muncher Haus, but you can’t compare their selection to what Whole Foods has to offer. Hard for me to take that suggestion seriously. But I do get that Fremont has a structural problem, in that there is no There there, no center of gravity, nothing that would make someone say, let’s spend the day strolling downtown, window shopping, grab some lunch, and catch a movie. Or something reasonably close to that. You can’t do that here. About all one could do us drive here and there and everywhere and piece it together between Mission, Irvington, Niles, Centerville and, er, Warm Springs (?) and then go over to Union City for the movie. Why can’t Fremont support what, let’s say, Pleasanton can support on their Main Street?
February 1st, 2011 at 8:42 am
SGNG, I do agree with your comments. There is a cost involved for everything. A facility or cluster of facilities providing skate rinks, etc. would require entrance fees or higher local taxes. Fremont does suffer from the here, there, everywhere syndrome. It is a city built on the personal auto with no central business/shopping/dining/entertainment district. I guess that’s what PacCommons is supposed to provide but a personal vehicle is mandatory for getting there.
February 1st, 2011 at 9:14 am
Pleasanton was one little town that grew into a larger one. It historically had one town center, and the people there saw that it made sense to preserve and restore it so they’d have a ‘town’ feel rather than a suburb feel. It all kind of cristalized and evolved around the natural center.
Fremont was many – Niles, Warm Springs, Irvington, Centerville, Mission each a separate and much smaller unit than Pleasanton. The Hub was supposed to be the uniting shopping district for the city, but as people moved in from all over, retaining their primary connections to whereever they moved from, the city metasticized into one large undifferentiated suburb.
People sleep here and school their children here but they are mentally anchored somewhere else — where they came from, where they work, or where they want to move to next.
February 1st, 2011 at 9:40 am
Fremont Hub and PacificCommons simply do not make a town center. They are, as a practical matter, parking lots with mostly chain stores surrounding the parking lot. While they have their place and fill a need, they cannot ever fill the missing center. Neither of course can Whole Foods fill the missing center. But I think the missing center, and the missing Whole Foods are just two indicators of what Fremont has failed at becoming, a real city where people might have a chance to feel mentally anchored, and not feel such a need to move on to someplace else.
February 1st, 2011 at 9:47 am
Ouch, Poppie. I don’t think the districts make Fremont structurally unworkable. If the Hub was done right we wouldn’t be having this conversation. District segregation has nothing to do with the s-hole the Hub has evolved into, or the unwalkable retail wasteland that is Pac Commons.
Take SJ for example. There’s plenty of de facto townships – Willow Glen, Downtown, Rose Garden, Almaden, East SJ, Evergreen, etc. The difference in SJ is that for one reason or another, they were able to develop centers for entertainment/retail that people actually want to visit.
Gracie touches on the crux. Unless you’re into the eclectic, there’s no place in Fremont park and enjoy day or evening.
February 1st, 2011 at 10:26 am
Can I throw in one crazy idea? What about a nightclub/lounge? Maybe that’s just my point of view since I’m in my 20′s. I know there is Saddlerack, but that’s not really like a cool nightspot (just my opinion, some people may disagree with me). I dunno, my point of view is just that Fremont is kind of a boring city. There’s no nice movie theater, no cool shopping places (I guess Old Navy/Kohl’s are ok), and no fun places to hang out. I appreciate Pacific Commons now that it is there, but even a place like Kaenyama (which claims to be a lounge in the evening) isn’t really…
February 1st, 2011 at 10:45 am
Audrey, you have a right to complain, but unfortunately the climate in nightclubs has changed with the times. Fremont has had or does have a few night spots. The problem is the people that frequent them bring their attitude issues with them. Mojo Lounge at the Town & Country Center had so many fights it’s license was revoked. And others that post comments can probably rattle off others. Every city in the Bay Area is facing the same thing. Walnut Creek’s mayor made the news last week talking about trying to control the nightlife problems created by late night drinking and rowdy patrons. Sad, but true.
February 1st, 2011 at 11:13 am
Audry,
Night Clubs, lounges, Watering Holes are not allowed in Fremont. I believe Chief Steckler had ask the Fremomt City Council and Mayor to pass a policy/regulation on nightclubs that is so prohibitive that Club Owners have stated that in effect they have outlawed them in Fremont.
February 1st, 2011 at 11:20 am
There really isn’t a good spot for Whole Foods available in Fremont. They should look to Newark instead. Specifically, they could locate across from NewPark Mall in the abandoned Mervyn’s store. It has good freeway visibility, plenty of parking and it’s on a busy street. The only issue is that they would need to improve access to the site by adding at least one more driveway and access road.
February 1st, 2011 at 11:32 am
Sq
February 1st, 2011 at 11:42 am
Barnes & Noble is an estimated 27,000 sq ft. The new Marina Food in Warm Springs is about 30,000 sq ft. The nearest Chinese grocery stores to the plaza are that store, the Marina Food in Union City, and Lion Food in Newark (about 4-5 miles away). So that’d be another possibility. The biggest drawback to that location is the parking lot capacity.
February 1st, 2011 at 1:26 pm
There is a Ranch 99 Market in Brookvale at the corner of Paseo and Fremont Blvd.
I think that demographic is already well-served.
Sam, interesting idea about the old Mervyn’s. That center is ripe for improvement. BJ’s is a decent place. The Easy 8 Motel might be an issue though. Not the best element hanging around there… That would be a real coup for Newark.
February 1st, 2011 at 2:12 pm
History lesson. When the first General Plan for Fremont was published in 1956, it called for a strong Central Business District and the retention and strengthening of the historic commercial districts.
The CBD was planned to spread between Paseo Padre and Argonaut, between Mowry and Walnut. This area was pretty much equidistant between 17 (now 880) and the planned freeway 238, which would have followed the BART ROW through Fremont to tie to 680 about where Blacow and Osgood.
In the 70′s, CalTrans cancelled the whole 238 project because of an inability to acquire ROW through Union City. That made the 1956 CBD concept problematical. Then, in the late 70′s came Newpark and a whole series of ideas for Fremont, with none of them bearing fruit. There is far more that went on than I can stand to type into this blog, but it all consists of trying to get someone to invest in our city.
As I have said before, and will say again, this isn’t the movies and wishing will not just make it so. Every nightclub in our history has had problems, some handled by good management but most creating major problems for the police. Ideas like skating rinks, etc. are great ideas which won’t work because of the cost of the real estate required. We had a skating rink, Hayward had a skating rink, and they all went under. Things that once were here and are now gone are gone because they didn’t make money. They didn’t make money either because they had a bad business plan or because people didn’t patronize them. It is pretty simple economics. Income must exceed expenses or you go under. Wishing won’t make it so.
February 1st, 2011 at 3:27 pm
Gus – I’m not sure what the intended takeaway is from the history lesson. Is it that we tried several times in the past, but nothing ever came of it, end of story? On the other hand, if we don’t express our wishes, then surely nothing will happen. If we don’t say what we would like Fremont to be, then someday someone will be able to say, “you should have told us that’s what you wanted, why didn’t you?”
February 1st, 2011 at 4:36 pm
“…but it all consists of trying to get someone to invest in our city.”
That has been the crux of the problem. Why has it been so difficult to do that? What is it that has made investors not look at Fremont as an economic opportunity?
“Ideas like skating rinks, etc. are great ideas which won’t work because of the cost of the real estate required.”
Somehow Fremont real estate has always been too expensive for anything other than housing development. Why is that?
I agree with SGNG, wishing is important. It’s called having a vision and finding the right people to accomplish it. We haven’t had that.
February 1st, 2011 at 6:01 pm
W(ho)TF roller skates anymore?
February 1st, 2011 at 9:08 pm
Melanie Safka
February 1st, 2011 at 9:09 pm
Ellen Page and Drew Barrymore do too…
February 2nd, 2011 at 7:06 am
Dan, You should have a skating benefit called “Rollin’ for the Hills”
February 2nd, 2011 at 9:59 am
I like it.
…Hey why not a winner-take-all Roller Derby:
Frisbie and his group vs. all those against the development West of Ardenwood?
February 2nd, 2011 at 10:35 am
Dan, it’s a well known fact that hippies love Roller Derby. Frisbie would get his ass handed. I like the idea of preservationists raising money to buy the land fair and square. It’s the only solution that seems equitable to me.
February 2nd, 2011 at 12:07 pm
Gus Morrison said “We had a skating rink, Hayward had a skating rink, and they all went under.”
We still have one: http://www.sharksiceatfremont.com/
And Milpitas has a roller rink: http://www.calskatemilpitas.com/
February 2nd, 2011 at 3:06 pm
#57
Agreed on the outcome of the event – only because they’d be so outnumbered.
Regarding equitability…
I want to tear down my house and build a 7/11 on my block.
It’s my right to make the most for my property. Where do you come out on my land-rights issue Marty?
February 2nd, 2011 at 3:30 pm
Marty?
February 2nd, 2011 at 5:06 pm
@ Marty…..”it’s a well known fact that hippies love roller derby” WHAT ? where did you come up with that BS ???
February 2nd, 2011 at 5:25 pm
…you won’t hear anymore from Marty on this thread – his “lands-right” argument has been checkmated by 7/11.
February 2nd, 2011 at 6:02 pm
Dan, if your home is on a vacant lot surrounded on three sides by convenience stores, then go for it. Of course there will be a few self important nutbags who will oppose the project, but they’re easily defeated.
Checkmate.
February 2nd, 2011 at 8:27 pm
Ah!
Here lies the rub and this is why Marty/Dominic stared at his screen drooling for the length of time he did.
My house would have to be in an area “ZONED” for a convenience store.
Why?
Because of the impact on neighbors like Marty – (who you know would kick and scream and create BLOG pages.
The Patterson Ranch developer is asking Fremont to allow over 500 housing units – the lands are not currently “ZONED” for this. So the developer is asking City Hall to change zoning – just like I am for my 7/11.
How is this different?
My plans affect the neighbors – his plan affects the neighbors:
His plan adds a bunch of kids to the area and no school. In fact, $28M dollars is the difference between what is being offered to build an elementary school and what I have heard that one would cost.
The developer is offering $7M. The cost is estimated at $35M; This does not include staffing or maintenance or the remediation of liquefaction.
It does not include removal of the toxicphine levels or other poisons found under the proposed development site.
Who is going to pay for this? The State?
No…. Marty is – even though he live in Niles.
…and the school is proposed in a flood zone on lands that are subject to high shaking in an earthquake. Where are land rights here?
What about the 2 Million new car trips a day?
Ah….Those pesky neighbors and that pesky ZONING issue. Now watch Marty change the debate from “Land rights” to NIMBYism….
February 2nd, 2011 at 8:28 pm
As far as “Checkmate” -
please refer to the plans for the development plans in 2001 when the “Friends of Coyote Hills” started to fight this lunacy
…and the current plan.
Checkmate.
Game.
February 2nd, 2011 at 8:41 pm
500 housing units…2 Million new car trips a day
Come on, Dan. That’s 4000 car trips/day per house. I’m trying to be cordial here, but I don’t like being misled.
February 2nd, 2011 at 8:48 pm
…my error: I am hyped up on Slurpees:
2 Million car trips a year.
How about the rest of text: did I miss anything on the neighbors right to question a zoning change when it has THAT kind of impact?
February 2nd, 2011 at 8:54 pm
Night night all of you self-important-hippie-rollar skating-hippies….
(I am so glad he is “trying to be cordial here”)
February 2nd, 2011 at 8:54 pm
…Oh, I forgot “nutbags”
February 2nd, 2011 at 9:07 pm
Dan, I think your hypothetical is different than the Patterson development because a 7-11 built on an R1 would be far more extraordinary than filling houses into a parcel of land surrounded on three sides by homes. This is why we have people and not computers making these calls.
I do respect your fervor. But I’m sure if you polled the commentariat on whether they would prefer houses or a 7-11 to be installed next to their home, they’d pick houses (except for Mr Box, because his social life requires the attention of a 7-11 clerk).
February 2nd, 2011 at 9:12 pm
Marty Says:
February 1st, 2011 at 6:01 pm
W(ho)TF roller skates anymore?
@Marty: I roller skate along Blacow Road whenever I can. I also skate around Lake Elizabeth in Central Park. I also visit Cal Skate in Milpitas for skating on occasion. I’m 55 years old and have been skating since I was 10. I loved Roller World when it was in Fremont. Also loved Lido Skate in Newark. Miss them both terribly.
February 2nd, 2011 at 9:31 pm
B&N site be divided into smaller shops. Bunch of Indian, Chinese restaurants that open late till midnight, throw in a few milk tea shops. This is the only viable plan. Whole foods doesnt belong in fremont.
February 2nd, 2011 at 10:50 pm
Dan, good points. Dan +1 point. Marty -5 points
February 3rd, 2011 at 8:50 am
Andy,
I’m curious as to why you don’t think that that retail model is already well served enough at the El Mercado Center in UC, Pacific Commons and Warm Springs shopping centers in Fremont and several centers in Newark? Why is that the only viable option?
February 3rd, 2011 at 10:01 am
Marty,
It is always good to debate with you. The worst thing is to have a battle of wits with unarmed opponents and you are well armed.
You make this BLOG a much more interesting place to visit and, deep down, I love the jabs. It makes all our arguments stronger in the end…
I even used the word “Nutbag” this morning addressing one of my peers. Felt great.
Alright, enough sunshine…
February 3rd, 2011 at 12:27 pm
Is there a mechanism of some kind to poll the residence of Fremont to see what they would prefer to go into the B&N site.
Just out of curiousity, how does the city determine what’s missing and what it has plenty enough of to go around the block twice over?
February 3rd, 2011 at 1:15 pm
Dan, that is the most touching post I have ever read on the TCB. And it will probably be the most quoted by me when the s hits the fan.
February 3rd, 2011 at 3:51 pm
Gracie, the city zones the property for a category of use and an intensity of that use, i.e commercial retail. There are “permitted’ uses and “conditional” uses in each zoning category. An applicant, whose project is a permitted use, need do nothing more than get a business license and a building permit for any construction necessary. Those whose project requires a conditional use permit (CUP) must apply and conform to specific conditions to make his project work on the site. CUPs require either a zoning administrator’s approval or Planning Commission approval, depending on the specific project.
So, what the people would like there may be interesting, the zoning already there rules, both from a legal and a fairness position. What the zoning text defines as permitted or conditional is set by council after a public hearing.
February 3rd, 2011 at 7:22 pm
Hi Gus, thanks for the explanation. I just want to highlight one part of what you said, admittedly taken out of context, “what the people would like there may be interesting”
Just saying.
February 5th, 2011 at 9:48 am
Jen,
The shopping centers you mention are quite far from hub. Take any shopping center thats working well around these parts, you will see there is an asian element there.
February 5th, 2011 at 3:47 pm
Andy,
And that is why some of us go to San Jose or Palo Alto to find what we want. It’s a heck of a lot shorter of a drive for an Asian family who lives in central Fremont to go to the Ranch 99 on Paseo and Fremont Blvd. or into Newark or Warm Springs than it is for those of us who would like an upscale grocer to drive to San Jose, San Ramon, etc. Why does every center around have to become Asian themed? I think there enough of those.
February 5th, 2011 at 4:44 pm
“Why does every center around have to become Asian themed? ”
D-E-M-O-G-R-A-P-H-I-C-S
February 5th, 2011 at 11:00 pm
Jen, its easy for us to wish for something, but it has to make business sense. Let me ask you this. Would you put in your hard earned money into a cheese cake factory in centerville? I wouldn’t, even though I actually wish for it.
February 5th, 2011 at 11:14 pm
Similarly only viable thing that can happen in Centerville is housing. New housing that is not a low income one, will bring in people with higher standards of living, which will later on create a market for better retail, restaurants etc. But the current council seems hell-bent on getting upscale things in first. Not happening…
February 6th, 2011 at 8:18 am
Andy, I am reminded of the saying, “Which came first, the chicken or the egg?”
February 7th, 2011 at 7:59 am
Andy, the problem with attracting the high end market is that you must have something to attract them with. High income individuals have quite a few options in the Bay Area to be attracted to. I simply can’t picture a high income individual plopping down the cash for an high end house in Centerville on the hope that someday several fancy retailers and restaurants will sprout up around them. And certainly not if this high income individual knows anything about Fremont’s development history. I think Fremont needs to figure out what it really wants to be and then do it. Or maybe it already has and simply wants to be what it has already become, an average sort of place to come home to and eventually move away from.
February 7th, 2011 at 10:25 am
VOR – last time I checked, the data showed that over 50% of the residents of Fremont are NOT Asian.
February 7th, 2011 at 10:30 am
Jen: actually if you go to the city of Fremont website, here are the actual #’s (according to “Claritas Estimates 2010″):
Asian: 47%
White: 37%
Hispanic: 13%
Black/African American: 3%
February 7th, 2011 at 11:05 am
I don’t take issue with a demographic being represented. But I take issue when an entire retail project is dedicated to a specific ethnic group. It promotes segregation and a fractional community.
February 7th, 2011 at 11:33 am
Audrey,
As I said, over 50% of the residents are NOT Asian. Hispanic and African American counted as not Asian last time I checked.
Marty is correct, an entire retail project dedicated to a particular ethnicity does nothing to bring together a multi-ethnic community.
February 7th, 2011 at 11:36 am
Sorry I misread your post. But Asians are still the majority. 47% vs. 37% of whites. And I personally do not think an entire retail project dedicated to a particular ethnicity promotes segregation. I think it’s just convenient and when I shop at Marina Foods sometimes I see Caucasian people (and people of other races) there. Anyway just FYI I’m Chinese-American (my parents are immigrants but I was born here).
February 7th, 2011 at 12:01 pm
…sometimes I see Caucasian people (and people of other races) there
This is a pretty complex issue as I think it’s symbolic of a greater experience in the Asian community. But for the most part non-Asians aren’t going to touch Asian shopping centers.
February 7th, 2011 at 12:18 pm
And especially since the businesses in the Asian shopping centers are not exactly welcoming to those who are not (primarily) Chinese. They are intended as destinations for the Chinese community and it is the brave Caucasian that ventures in to order from a Chinese restaurant where 90% of the menu is in Chinese.
And that is fine – I just don’t think it’s right to have every retail center be taken over by these businesses. Yes, the Asians outnumber the white folks here in Fremont. But that should not mean that the Asian community is catered to so heavily by retailers, espeically in the newer centers that are either built or renovated.
February 7th, 2011 at 12:31 pm
I just don’t buy the idea that Asian food retailers guarantee success in Fremont. Wasn’t there an Asian themed mega-food mall project that fizzled out recently?
February 7th, 2011 at 12:58 pm
First, understand that the state and federal surveys by ethnicity put Indians and Pakis in the Asian category.
Why is it so many of the Chinese retail establishments are so inclined to put the name of their store in Chinese characters on their store fronts? I don’t see the same from other ethnic groups?
February 7th, 2011 at 1:32 pm
I don’t see anything wrong with a Chinese-owned business putting their Chinese name on their store front. They are proud of their business. And I disagree that this is not the same with other ethnic groups. I have driven by many Indian stores and seen Indian characters as well. Same with Korean stores.
February 7th, 2011 at 1:50 pm
Audrey, it certainly tells me who the owner is attempting to attract and who they are not.
February 7th, 2011 at 2:56 pm
I don’t see a problem with advertising in Chinese or targeting Chinese speaking customers. I think that’s anyone’s right, VOR. Just like a skateboard shop doesn’t care to attract retirees.
But I don’t see it helpful for a racial group to willingly segregate themselves from one of the most common human endeavors, shopping. How many opportunities do people have to interact outside their niche?
And I say this in the context of believing that an Asian has no chance of winning American Idol let alone the American presidency in my lifetime. I can’t say that about any other race, and I think part of that stems from an inherent unapproachability. Chinese shopping centers don’t do much to help. (But they are convenient for some).
February 7th, 2011 at 3:01 pm
An “inherent unapproachability”? Wow… that seems a bit… how do I say this in a tactful way… offensive and on the edge of stereotyping? Marty, you really believe that Chinese people are unapproachable?
My parents are from Taiwan, and I was born in Fremont. If I may say so myself (and obviously you would not able to discern my personality from these comments), I believe I am one of the “friendliest” people out there. I always smile, and I think I am approachable.
I wonder how this thread went from being about Whole Foods not coming to Fremont to trying to make a strange generalization about Chinese people. If someone wants to “enlighten” me please do so. Thank you.
February 7th, 2011 at 3:14 pm
You can go ahead and call it racist. That’s fine by me, in fact expected as our “conversation on race” is still in a straight jacket.
I’m just stating my perspective. I think black culture is overtly embraced in America, and Hispanic culture is probably the most influential in the entire American west. Why is it then that an ethnic group who has such a long history in America have had so little impact on the overall cultural fabric. I’m saying that in part it’s because generally, Asians are self-segregating. The Asian themed shopping centers are an example, not a consequence of stereotyping, Audrey.
February 7th, 2011 at 3:17 pm
Marty, why would I call your racist when in fact I don’t believe that? I just said you’re stereotyping. Thanks for trying to make a presumed judgment on my part. Or putting words in my mouth. You can believe what you want to believe, which is obviously what you’re doing. I just think it’s interesting that you would throw out such a statement like Chinese people are inherently unapproachable… I have never heard anyone say that. I’m glad this conversation is strictly online because I feel like you are targeting Chinese people only. Well the good news is probably that I’m still young and 26 and I still believe that Asian people can make a difference. So what if we never become President, yes probably not during your lifetime perhaps, maybe not in mine, but I think it is a bit mean to state “And I say this in the context of believing that an Asian has no chance of winning American Idol let alone the American presidency in my lifetime.”
Well anyway this is the last of my comments on this thread
February 7th, 2011 at 3:36 pm
I’m sorry for putting words in your mouth. It just seemed like you were dancing around that word in post 99 when you wrote “how do I say this in a tactful way”. I presumed the tactless way was inferring racism.
And, I’m not picking on Asians randomly. The topic had diverted to Chinese themed shopping centers. My grandparents held stubbornly to their homeland to the point of disowning members of the family for marrying outside their immediate culture. I know these things are not exclusive. Anyways, sorry. That’s all I can say.
February 7th, 2011 at 3:40 pm
To hijack this thread back a bit Here is a quote from President Obama’s speach to CEOs:
“As we work with you to make America a better place to do business, ask yourselves what you can do for America. Ask yourselves what you can do to hire American workers, to support the American economy, and to invest in this nation.”
Why couldn’t the City Govt’ ask the same questions, just substitute Fremont in the above quote. Why do we have to accept just whatever anyone wants to plant in our City?
If Whole Foods does not think they can make a go of it in Fremont, perhaps they haven’t shown enough of a commitment to Fremont. Maybe I really should stop giving them a reason not to open a location in Fremont and let them know I will stop shopping at Whole Foods until they do come to Fremont?
February 7th, 2011 at 6:16 pm
It was back at #47 that I mentioned why not a Marina Food. A comment was that Asians were already well served. My view is simply what could survive viably as a business in that location. Gus made a couple of very good points later in #49: First, who is willing to invest in our city? Second, who can make money doing so?
Even given 47% of the city is Asian, that’s still a generalization for the city as a while. I don’t know ethnic demographics by districts, but I have seen California Basic Educational Data System (CBEDS) data for high school attendance areas for the 2009-2010 school year, if that’s any indication. FUSD as a whole is 50%. The high school attendance for MSJ, Irvington and American high schools is 60%. If you include Pacific Islanders & Filipinos, it’s 66% for those three high schools and 57% for FUSD as a whole. Those three high schools pretty much surround the Fremont Plaza. What does this suggest to you in terms of potential business opportunities?
The movie “Rising Son” had a great line. Everyone might recall this was in the days where Japan was investing heavily in the US. A character in the film complained about Asians taking over the US. Mako’s character Yoshida-san replied, “if you don’t want Japanese to buy it, don’t sell it.” In other words, if someone’s chooses to sell out, don’t blame the buyer. This could apply to NUMMI (seller) vs Union Pacific (buyer), as well as the Barnes & Noble location.
All that I’ve seen written about why Whole Foods isn’t moving forward on the B&N location is that the property manager is asking for too much. I haven’t read that Whole Foods don’t want to move into Fremont. From news items a few years back, I seem to recall Whole Foods was interested but specifically in a central Fremont location. So we can’t exactly blame Whole Foods if a property manager (who isn’t based in Fremont) wants more than Whole Foods is willing to pay. The question is, what business would be willing to pay whatever that lease rate is and be sufficiently profitable to survive. To get to that answer, you have to evaluate the prospective buyers. And I find myself wondering what bar the property manager has set that drove out B&N and Whole Foods. And what kind of business will generate enough revenues to offset it and still be profitable.
What people simple think would be cool to have at the B&N location is not enough. Good businesses don’t make decisions that way. Fremont needs solid businesses, not a revolving door of failed ones.
February 7th, 2011 at 8:23 pm
Hmmm… Marty, so your grandparents were Portuguese?
February 7th, 2011 at 8:50 pm
I also would like all inclusive shopping centers.
February 7th, 2011 at 8:53 pm
Yeah Marty, where are your grandparents from? You’ve peaked my curiosity as to where people would excommunicate you if you married outside your culture?
February 7th, 2011 at 9:15 pm
I’ll leave that up to your imagination, Robert. Luckily my grandparents were long gone by the time I married. My father though had strict orders – any woman who couldn’t lay claim to my grandparent’s homeland was not good enough for their son. Many families from this region have a similar requirement.
February 8th, 2011 at 12:41 am
For all those who keep saying Fremont is not a destination city, aren’t we missing the big boat here? Why aren’t we building upon what’s already here and thriving and make Fremont the penultimate destination for Asian culture on the west coast. It’s Chinese New Year and there’s nothing happening here with a 47% Asian population! Fremont Blvd. should be decorated and we should have our own televised Chinese New Year parade going down it. Why just a downtown, why not a Chinatown, Japantown, Korea Town, Little Saigon, Manila Town, Little Delhi, Little Kabul, all conveniently located in one city for shoppers, diners and business people. We should be having more Asian themed festivals to promote Fremont. We have an annual kite festival, but do you know that the kite was invented in China 2800 years ago? Do you also know that Fremont has the largest dragon boat organization in California and Quarry Lakes would be an ideal location for an annual dragon boat race and festival? Seriously, would having a Whole Foods really make Fremont that much more interesting? Think big, we could be putting Fremont on the world map and attracting investors and visitors from Asia and around the world.
February 8th, 2011 at 7:42 am
Hi Larry, if that’s what you want then go for it. Organize, get the 47% involved and committed to your vision. At the end of the day, though, I still want my Whole Foods.
IndependentGuy – If Whole Foods really wants to move into Fremont, they sure are acting like they don’t have to bother actually doing so. I moved to Fremont in ’97, does it really take 14 years to find that retail sweet spot in a City filled with empty lots and properties? I don’t think so. I think they need a little push.
February 8th, 2011 at 8:07 am
Gracie, I personally think a Whole Foods would be cool to have. Although the impression is that it’s high end and expensive, I’ve seen market basket studies that demonstrated that its somewhat comparable to Trader Joe’s, as both have moved to private labels. What Whole Foods has is a different selection. I also think Asians would shop there, same as Trader Joe’s. You raise good questions:
- We really don’t know what transpired between Whole Foods and Sun Hill (the property manager), and if the city is doing anything proactive to mediate or facilitate the transaction.
- We don’t really know the process by which Whole Foods vets and selects its locations. It does seem to me like the Hub/Plaza and Pac Commons areas are the two highest traffic shopping venues. There may be lots of empty lots in Fremont, but not the right profile to their requirements.
February 8th, 2011 at 8:21 am
IndependentGuy, we may not know the process, but we do know the outcome. No Whole Foods. I see Whole Foods in all sorts of locations, some with good parking, some with not very good parking, larger stores and smaller stores. No matter where they are, they are busy. Part of that business is Fremont commuters (like me) going there after work. Which just goes to show that: if you build a Whole Foods somewhere, shoppers will beat a path to your door. And we Fremont commuters are very obliging, maybe that’s not a good strategy it turns out, since Whole Foods can count on our business no matter where they built. Why would they feel a strong incentive to locate to Fremont, sweet spot or no sweet spot.
February 8th, 2011 at 8:48 am
IndependentGuy –
Keep in mind what VOR mentioned in #95. The federal demographic designation of “Asian” also includes those of South Asian decent, such as Indians. So that 47% appears to mean, Asian as in Chinese or Japanese as well as those from India, Afghanistan and Pakistan.
Also, the FUSD district lines are drawn so that the kids who go to Kennedy can be from Ardenwood, which is heavily Asian. Many Irvington kids are now from the Mission area, also heavily Asian. So you can’t look at the high schools in closest proximity to central Fremont and use that as a basis for an assumption of the demographics of the immediate geographical area.
The parking excuse is ridiculous. The parking at the Palo Alto Whole Foods is abysmal. The property owners at that center are rumored to charge a ridiculous amount for rent. They have not been able to get another restaurant in the old Uno’s spot. I almost hope that the B&N spot sits vacant so that maybe those folks see that their spot isn’t as prime as they’re charging for.
February 8th, 2011 at 9:25 am
I almost hope that the B&N spot sits vacant so that maybe those folks see that their spot isn’t as prime as they’re charging for.
I think the coming Spirit Halloween store should satisfy that thought too, Jen.
BTW, have you tried the Cheese Taster in Mission yet?
February 8th, 2011 at 9:26 am
Wow! Between the whole foods and the ballpark dreamers you people can form a Mob and call yourself NILES. I’m sure Marty would love to be mayor of this Mob.
February 8th, 2011 at 9:35 am
Marty – I’ve been there before for a sandwich, but don’t recall being wow-ed by the cheese selection. Just for you, I’ll give it another shot.
February 8th, 2011 at 9:40 am
Jen, points taken. I understood the definition of “Asian”, which I’ve considered North/Eastern & Southern Asia. It’d seem odd to put those of Middle East heritage under Asians, but, given the ethnic categories is still rather simplistic, who knows — probably defined a long time ago before the influx from South Asia and the Middle East. For that matter, the cultures, languages, diets, etc., of North/Eastern vs South Asia vs Middle East are very different. In lieu of actual demographics for that area, I was using school attendance areas as a possible proxy. It’s hard to shoot in the dark.
Worble, to me this is just a mental exercise: Given the demise of B&N, what might possibly be located there. So far the ideas are an Asian grocery store, a Whole Foods store, an Asian food court, and a Spirit store. What’s your guess?
February 8th, 2011 at 10:26 am
IG – you left out Dollar Store as one of the potential replacements for the former B&N.
February 8th, 2011 at 11:51 am
Worble # 115
I love it. The Whole Foods Niles MOB
February 8th, 2011 at 12:44 pm
Cal guy I knew somebody would get it.
February 8th, 2011 at 1:03 pm
I’d get my mob on for a WFs at the Henkel site. Would Jen survive the spike in endorphin if they decided to build there?
February 8th, 2011 at 1:07 pm
I don’t think Whole Food cares if you are Asian or Martian so long as it makes a profit. I’m an Asian, but I would love to have Whole Food in Fremont. I’ve visited Whole Food in many cities around the country and also wonder why we don’t have it here.
But judging from our poor city planning results over the decades, Whole Food will be wary of our local politics, which favors developers rather than business development. Talking to several potential and current business owners, Fremont city will give you a run around and bleed you to death, thus raising the cost of doing business. Lew Wolfe personally stated that in the public that someone is making a living off the process.
Blame the current leadership and their clan for what we’ve got. Do they ever held a townhall to listen to business needs? Nope. Only close door meeting with developers.
February 8th, 2011 at 1:30 pm
Alas, Marty, I might not.
I’m still holding out hope for a high density low income housing project in that spot with an Asian themed strip mall adjacent.
February 8th, 2011 at 2:23 pm
a high density low income housing project…with an Asian themed strip mall
There goesHere comes the neighborhood!February 8th, 2011 at 2:50 pm
Larry in #109:
I’m feeling sick.
February 8th, 2011 at 3:14 pm
What happenened to the train depot lovers mob? Worble is no doubt the chairman of said group.
As far as Whole Foods,they are ok,but,,I think Andronicos would be a better store for Fremont.
http://www.andronicos.com/
February 8th, 2011 at 3:24 pm
Andronico’s had a beautiful store in downtown Danville……and closed it several years ago. Not enough business. Not sure what that says about Andronico’s or Danville. Or course Danville doesn’t have a Ranch 99 either.
February 8th, 2011 at 4:26 pm
What does the Fremont Citizens Network have against the citizen of Fremont? No Whole Foods, no ballpark and no future! Thanks to the FCN (mob) the only flavor Fremont will be serving up is going to be VANILLA! Forget about steady cash flow, jobs, tax revenue and the civic pride a ballpark would have brought. Asian strip malls and Kabob Huts are the future of Fremont. Thanks to the FCN Fremont is doomed to be what it now is.
February 8th, 2011 at 4:26 pm
Another great market, Consentino’s on Bascom in San Jose also closed after 64 years in business. They had great meats, super bakery, nice selection of wines, cheeses, etc. The supermarket business is tough and smaller stores no matter the quality of their produce, products or service is becoming a thing of the past.
February 8th, 2011 at 9:15 pm
VOR, it’s really been sad seeing so many family-owned business go out of business due to the corporate retain chains (Whole Foods, Fresh & Easy included). Even though it may cost a bit more, I still try to give family-owned businesses my business. Dale’s has been great. It’ll be interesting to see if Dale’s culture will survive under Ace Hardware management.
Danville has a Fresh & Easy, a Trader Joe’s, and the usual other grocery store types. They also have a Windmill Farm stand for produce. Draegers out by Blackhawk I believe. I guess Andronico’s couldn’t be competitive. Chains can have the edge on selection and price due to economies of scale. It then comes down to extraordinary customer service and long-time relationships.
Trader Joe’s is an interesting business. It presents itself as local, hip, earthy, but is actually a huge private corporation with 350 stores across 25 states. 70% of its sales is private label, and they religiously protect the maker of the labels. Wouldn’t be as classy if it turned out to be the same maker as a generic label at Smart & Final, huh.
February 9th, 2011 at 5:52 am
IG- Right on the money with your comment “It then comes down to extraordinary customer service and long-time relationships.” That’s why Dale Hardware has survived. The same goes for McIvor’s Hardware in Mission San Jose.
I may be mistaken, but I believe Trader Joe’s is owned by a German conglomerate.
If you’re ever in Mountain View check out The Milk Pail.
http://www.milkpail.com/
February 9th, 2011 at 6:13 am
One final comment on food markets. Lunardi’s is another grocery store that would be categorized as upscale but very good. A check of the cities they are in qualifies the upscale comment.
http://www.Lunardis.com/html/AllStores.html
February 9th, 2011 at 8:42 am
Charlie #128
Do not forget global warming, it is all FCN fault. The war in Iraq and Afganistan clearly FCN fault.
Charlie get some help with your mental problems, please!
February 9th, 2011 at 9:16 am
For what it’s worth, from the Whole Foods website:
http://wholefoodsmarket.com/content/company/real-estate/
Here are the guidelines they use to consider a location:
- 200,000 people or more in a 20-minute drive time
- 25,000-50,000 Square Feet
- Large number of college-educated residents
- Abundant parking available for our exclusive use
- Stand alone preferred, would consider complementary
- Easy access from roadways, lighted intersection
- Excellent visibility, directly off of the street
- Must be located in a high traffic area (foot and/or vehicle)
The location would seem to meet their guidelines for consideration. As of their 2010 annual report, their preferred site size is 35,000-50,000 sq ft going forward, and they expect the majority of their new stores to fall within this range. Still, do-able if a store there would confidently meet their financial objectives. In other words, a smaller store but with good margins.
Occupancy costs is a key metric. If the property lease exceeds their gross profit expectations, then end of story. They’re a Fortune 500 business so will do things by the numbers to meet financial objectives. It’s not just about selling organic healthy food to a community that wants them there. If the city isn’t willing or able to provide some offset as an incentive, then, again, end of story.
February 9th, 2011 at 10:53 am
#133…I get Calguy, you’re Norman Bates and West is”Norma” Normans mother?
Thanks to the FCN all that would have benefited us is now lost. In retrospect do you or any of the other usual suspects have any regrets for opposing the best thing that could have happened to Fremont? After the success of the Fremont Citizens Network campaign of intimidation killed the ballpark our city has forever lost years of steady cash flow. Because of the FCN opposition to reasonable development Whole Foods,Lunardi’s, Fresh & Easy, Andronico’s will never come here. I’m afraid your dissociative identity disorder is gettig worse.
February 9th, 2011 at 11:15 am
Charlie, It is hard to discuss anything with you.
You are :OBSESSIVE
excessive often to an unreasonable degree
February 9th, 2011 at 12:21 pm
I’m confused. How are the ballpark and a Whole Foods, et al type market similar? And why would FCN oppose a Whole Foods?
February 9th, 2011 at 1:57 pm
Jen….because the little green people in his attic told him that….
February 9th, 2011 at 2:27 pm
Ok. So is FCN still an active group in Fremont politics?
February 11th, 2011 at 6:34 pm
#136…Calguy & West “STOP WHINING” both of you! May I suggest some sort of badge of shame (perhaps a dunce cap) be worn by the both of you as well as the of rest of the FCN mob for condemning Fremont to eternal purgatory!
#137 Ms. Jen (are you now or have you ever been a FCN member?)…Fremont will NEVER be considered a SERIOUS PLAYER for anything upscale as long as reasonable development is run out on a rail by a mob of bullies!
#138 Did your PINK ELEPHANTS friends tell you all about the little GREEN MEN or have you deciphered the voynich manuscript?
Oakland is dead and San Jose is failing…maybe it’s not to too late to try and bring the ballpark back to Fremont.
February 11th, 2011 at 11:30 pm
Charlie…
Time for your Alka Seltzer Cough and Cold Nightime and about 11 hours sleep.
Rest and get a sence of humor…
February 12th, 2011 at 8:44 am
Charlie,
OK, no comment!
February 14th, 2011 at 11:37 am
Charlie do you really think that the FCN had anything to do with the ballpark not coming to Fremont? your sadly mistaken. The people of Fremont stoped this Dumb ass backdoor deal that W-ass-erman and his cronnies tried to sneak by the people that really care about Fremont. HA HA maybe next time they will ask for a vote and we will see what the people of Fremont want. NO TO W-ASS-ERMAN NO TO THE BALLPARK IN FREMONT!!!!