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Want the Matrix?

The talks regarding Miami Heat forward Shawn Marion won’t die. Toronto, Dallas, even Charlotte, have been mentioned as possible suitors.
The one team we haven’t heard is the Warriors. Let’s see, the Warriors need a PF who fits their style of play, who rebounds and who can score inside. Marion fits (though he doesn’t have a traditional back-to-the-basket game).
Plus, Marion is a free-agent to be. So the Warriors can try him out and if they don’t like him, don’t re-sign him. Obviously, Miami would have to be interested, and there is a very real chance the Warriors don’t have what Miami wants, which is a big man.
But provided the Heat is interested in the Warriors’ roster. Who would you give up for a chance to fill that hole? Or, would you even want Marion?

Marcus Thompson

  • Sdiddy

    We have no reasonable combination that would make the salaries work.

  • OptimusPrime

    It may sound crazy, but I’d give up Monta. Give up a potential All Star for a bonafide all star. Plus we have enough guards.

  • rej

    i think he would be a good fit because he is what Al Harrington was supposed to be in nellies system. Its hard to say who we should give up for the matrix… maybe Brandon or Randolph??? I wouldnt mind if we could keep our young talent and dispatch Corey or Jamal. in my opinion, that would be stretching it too.

    the only thing we really need is a floor general. nellies style PG and i dont think we’re close to getting one through the trade deadline because that type of talent is at a premium.

    i dont know what it is but this team is 13-29 and players are quoted talking about the playoffs. whatever is in the kool-aid, i want some too! injuries, team chemistry, difference in schedule has defined this season and a trade for an undersize PF this late in the season will not turn things around.

    id rather save us fans the heartache and go with what we are dealt with. monta/jamal at the 1 & 2 Jax & AR/Brandon (depending on matchup) at the 3 & 4, then AB at the 5. then CJ, Kelenna, Mags, Morrow/Marco with Turiaf supporting the 5. (pending injuries)

    I think that gives us a decent chance not only to win but to develop some of the youth on this team without spoiling them.

  • RaiderNationGil

    OptimusPrime you are retarded to think giving up a 20+PPG scorer in Monta who isnt even in his prime for some dude thats always been option 2/3 where he’s been with his prime over.. No Monta buddy… No way..

  • Chris

    Yeah…………I agree with Optimus’ thinking.

    In that, in this league to get ahead, you gotta give something to get something.

    Here is a proposed trade:

    1. Stephen Jackson ( 50 million)
    2. Rony Turiaf (17 million)
    3. Marcus Williams

    for Shawn Marion, Udonis Haslem and Chris Quinn or Shawn Marion, Udonis Haslem and Jamal Magloire.

    The numbers make sense I think, but I;m not completely sure on Jackson’s contract numbers ( I could be wrong, don;t hold me to it!)

    We would get back a bona fide allstar and an excellent player in Marion and we would add some toughness and offensive rebounding (remember we are among the league’s “cellar dwellers” in second chance points allowed) with Haslem and a nice bonus in either Quinn (although he is a backcourt player) or Magloire.

  • ts

    Like the Maggette signing, like the Jacko extension, this is not a good idea. In fact, it’s terrible. This is the sort of quick-fix thinking that has plagued the Warriors front-office for the past 15 years.

    The W’s could learn a lot from OKC and Portland. Let your young talent learn and grow together, rather than tying up your limited $$$ to guys who are only going to take opportunities away from that young core.

    They are not nearly as prepared for the free agent class of ’10 (it’s an incredible class beyond James/Wade/Bosh) as they should be.

    The W’s are not winning a championship this year, or the year after. Lets please stop pretending they will and start doing some, umm… planning.

    Let’s also not forget that Marion was very unhappy for quite some time playing out of position in Phoenix. He also complained about not being more involved in the offense. All this, of course, with Nash as his PG. I’m guessing these contentions will only be magnified playing for a team that has been inexplicably composed of 4 shoot-first wing-men.

  • EJ

    Nope. I’d rather make a run for Amare.

  • Chris

    I love the picture Marcus…………that’s the funniest thing I’ve ever seen in my life……..and he’s got Baron’s old number………………..hilarious!!……freakin’ hilarious!!

    I don’t get a chance to say anything to you, I don’t think I ever have.

    Thank you for putting my posts up there.

    You do a good job, don’t let some of the “critics” that come on these blogs upset you.

    Thanks for organizing the Crawford Live Blog! …….That was great!

    Keep up the good work!

  • Trey

    We can get Marion cheaper during the summer. His value has gone down quite a bit. If he comes to the W’s, Nellie’s style will just inflate his value and make him too expensive to re-sign.

    But, we need to ditch some contracts now in order to have cap space to get a guy like Marion. So I’d dump Maggette, Wright, and Williams to Portland for Raef Lafrentz’s expiring contract ($12M).

    Even with Ellis this team stinks. Too many of the same player (scoring with no defense). So in the summer I’d move Ellis for Hinrich and sign Marion while his value is at its lowest.

    Lineup:
    PG: Hinrich, Watson
    SG: Crawford, Belinelli, Morrow
    SF: Jackson, Buke
    PF: Marion, Randolph
    C: Biedrins, Turiaf

    Hinrich fits better than Ellis because he’s a very good ball-handler and perimeter defender (the exact opposite of Ellis). He and Crawford didn’t fit in Chicago, but Hinrich was a rookie and Nellie’s offense is much more suited to them playing together.

    The core players would be seasoned vets who are in their prime. This team would be able to contend for the next two to three years and give Belinelli, Morrow and Randolph a better backdrop to develop. Better yet, these would be a really up-tempo team that can run, shoot, defend (except for Crawford), and rebound.

    The biggest mistake would be trading for someone who can help this year. We need to dump salaries and prep for next year.

  • http://stephenjacksonmakeslovetopressure.com jaxfor3

    Biedrins + Jackson + Azubuike for Marion works on the trade checker.

    We can draft Thabeet to make up for the lost production in Biedrins while getting rid of a big contract.

  • dubsvoiceofreason

    Contractually. And this only becomes true once CRawford is eligible to be traded. Is too package JC and MAgs together for MArio. GReat Deal for Warriors. Gets rid of MAgs contract and paves the way for MArco. Gives us the option to rent MAtrix for half a season and see if we have that mutual chemistry.

    Then again…. Why would Miami ever want JC (wade redundancy) or MAgs big contract when they have Boozer targeted in the future.

    It Won’t happen. Things simply don’t match up. And those that suggest Ellis or AB in the deal. ARe you serious?

  • Joe

    Lol, I can’t believe what some of you are willing to give up for Marion. If Marion was still THAT good do you think Miami would want to trade him? That said, realistically, like marcus said, the Warriors do not have what Miami wants so it’s really a moot point. If we could get him for Magette and some throw in players it would be a good trade, then again we would have an undersized pf in his 30′s, he is only 6′ 7″. Marion plays alot bigger then he is because of his freakish athletic abiliy which is already starting to fade…

  • Stan

    No way the Warriors should trade monta for Marion … that’s just plain stupid.

    I watch a lot of Heat basketball (almost as much as the Warriors) and there’s no way they’d even consider moving Haslem for the package you proposed Chris. Haslem is a very important part of their team. Plus he’s a better player than Turiaf because he’s a better rebounder and has a more reliable outside shot.

    The only deal the Heat would consider would be the one proposed by Jaxfor3. They’d probably jump at the chance to get a center like Biedrins and a proven clutch player like Jackson. Azukbuike would be a welcomed addition as well. Lets hope the Warriors aren’t foolish enough to make that trade though.

  • Mylie10

    Considering that he may bolt and not be resigned, I’d only do a Corey Maggette, Jackson, Crawford type of deal for him.

    If they would take Jackson and Corey for him and a numbers match it would free us up in case we don’t re-sign him.

    for the Heat it would free up Beasley to handle the PF spot. Jackson gives them some grit and help for Wade. and Corey off the bench would give them some desparate bench scoring.

    The reason it won’t happen is that they are in the 2010 sweepstakes as a desirable destination.

    I wouldn’t include either Randolph or Wright just to make it happen though.

    And the guy who through Andris in there needs to go to REHAB!

  • Eric

    Turiaf + Maggette + B-Wright for the matrix

  • blah

    He’s not the guy we need, that is why you haven’t heard anything about the Warriors going after him.

    I might also add that is why all these previous post-artist don’t have a job in the NBA.

    Marcus, again, your blog is really weak and buggs the shyt out of me. Do some home work. Tell us how much salary we’d have to match. i.e. 18 million for Marion, copy and past ESPN’s team salary by player for this year and then we can have a real discussion.

    I hate your posts, I hate myself more for responding.

    Marion should be classified as a SF.

  • A’s in 2009

    The rumor between Miami/Toronto is JON for Marion/Banks. It makes sense for Miami in that they move Banks who’s under contract for 2010, they create even more capspace. I think we should jump in on this. Send Maggette and Crawford to Toronto and Marion this way. All the salaries work. Miami isn’t affected, Toronto gets some much needed help on the wings.

    Warriors get Marion
    Raptors get Crawford, Maggette, Banks
    Heat get J O’Neal

    Monta-Belinelli-Jackson-Marion-Biedrins

    Bench: CJ-Morrow-Buike-BWright-AR-Ronny

  • Mr. B

    A Marion trade is a trade for the sake of making a trade. It does not get you what you want. We need a bruiser of a PF.

    If you need a bruiser, then go for the Boozer. Carlos Booser will be a free agent so I would wait a bit and save the cap room.

    No need to give up a Monta or our young ones.

  • Dave

    If the Warriors were not already stuck with Maggette, then maybe he could be considered because he rebounds and would adapt to Nelson’s game, but the bottom line is the Warriors don’t have anything the Heat want, unless there is a 3 way trade.

  • commish

    I agree with Mr. B. However, is our desire to get Marion to create a huge expiring contract or to try to resign him. To me that is the question. Since we’ve totally screwed our cap with Rowell’s brillance, I would start with Maggette, who is truly expendable and start there, to see if there is at least an interest in Maggs as a starting piece. Not sure there is but who knows. Again, having depth at 2 gives us some useful properties in Crawford and Marco.

    I would work from there, but only with the idea to not resign Marion next season, thus getting back some of our precious cap space. Without that in mind, why try to improve our team this year to only screw up our draft position of somewhere between 10 and 7 with Monta coming back.

  • A’s in 2009

    Get with the program. Nellie won’t play a bruiser at PF. He’ll play him at center just like Ronny.

  • montae all day

    I’d trade magette, bw and a azibuike.

    Our startig 5 would be
    Montae-cj
    jamaal- bellineli
    stephen jack -morrow
    marion- randolph
    biedrins- turiaf

  • commish

    I like that–did you check the numbers? But would you try to resign Marion or let him go?

  • gswarriors08

    A’s post #11 hit it perfectly. I would do that trade that sends Crawford and Maggette to Raptors, while Raptors sending O’Neal to Miami and W’s receiving Marion. We lose two long term contracts and receive in return an expiring contract. We don’t need to resign Marion and go after free agents like Boozer in the offseason, giving us that long awaited true power foward. Anyone else agree with this trade? I think the numbers would work.

  • gswarriors08

    I just check on ESPN’s trade machine and the maggette/crawford to toronto, O’Neal to Miami, and Marion to Warriors trade was approve. I really don’t see how this trade is bad for us. Get rid of two guards that can easily be replace and are less cheaper. Right now excluding injury I would chose Marco and Morrow over Maggette. And when Ellis does come back I rather have Ellis over Crawford. The best part about this trade is that we get rid of long term contracts and we get to start again. I still would find ways to trade Jackson too.

  • m8e

    i just dont see any reason toronto would want to take on the bad contracts of crawford and maggette. they’re trying to get rid of J Oneil’s.

    as much it would be great to get marion, there probably is no way they get him.

  • NotaNelsonfan

    #19. I like your idea. I’ll cross my fingers for that trade it makes sense. If we can save money and spend it later for a Boozer then w’s should go for it if approved. I would like to send Jax as well if we can.

  • zgreat

    I don’t know what you guys are thinking but if I’m Miami (or Toronto), I’m only going to consider taking
    Maggette’s contract if you throw in both Randolph & Marco.

  • Earl monroe

    The pattern of the game last night was really emblematic of the whole season,
    very little defense and lack of trust offensively.
    When you have a very hot Kelena Azubuke and a great shooter in Morrow and
    a clutch fourth quarter guy like Crawford, and you are up 5 points in the beginning of the fourth, you would think the ball would move around so we could find some of these players, Jackson does not trust his teammates, instead of keeping the flow going he went on his wild forays, creating bad situations, those 7 assists he gets are meaningless if he has 5 turnovers.

    If the warriors are not going to play defense and entertain us with good offense at least recognize who is hot, at least make the other teams defense move around.

    They overlooked theThunder and am sure Biedrins could have played, they where better off playing him against the thunder and winning than waiting till Friday and playing the cavs and loosing, I don’t think Nelson understands that this team is not that good and needs to win against teams like the thunder, but then again if they beat the Cavs on Friday its more national exposure for him. No doubt a better win, but considering they are are few and far between, its a shame to loose winnable games

    Marion would be a great addition, but why would he want to re sign with the warriors? so why give up any good young players? Marion like Crawford want to be on winners, so Marion comes here for half a season then leaves and we give up a potentially good young player? And unfortunately Crawford will probably leave if he can get a wink from a contender.

    Can we win 30 of 40 games left with Monta, Jackson, Maggette, Biedrings etc……
    if the answer is no, then be serious and start re building now.

  • Chris

    While it’s nice to see our young players’ talent on display in front on 19,314 last night and every night at the Oracle, even though we are riddled with injuries and haven’t really put out our full starting unit at any point in time this season, even though our young “star” is stupid and decided to make a poor decision this offseason, I STILL think we should win games like last night on our home floor.

    It is frustrating to watch,………….I’m all for being patient and developing our young talent and I like watching the young guys play and we still play an exciting brand of basketball, but Jesus Christ, we are very “unlucky” when it comes to turing into a winning team and I don’t know when it’s gonna end.

    Too bad we don’t have Russell Westbrook and Kevin Durant……….what a talented duo those 2 are………they would run circles around our guys!

  • Joe

    Hey Blah, if you hate Marcus’s posts…why do you read them? :)

  • Chris

    But it ALL comes down to defense…….defense, defense, defense, “Earl Monroe” is right.

    You think the Spurs give up game winning shots like that to Jeff Green 20 feet from the basket?

    Do you think the Orlando Magic give up shots like that (good defensive team, Van Gundy is a defensive minded coach)?

    How about the Larry Brown Pistons? Or any good defensive team would not give up the 20 foot jumper to Jeff Green or the wide open “take” to the basket by Kevin Martin.

  • Chris

    Good point Joe……….”Blah” talking shit is one thing……..but at least Marcus provides fans like us with a forum to talk about our pathetic team!

  • OptimusPrime

    Good points Earl

  • Monta for Pres

    Marion shot looks like a JV-Varsity level girl. Maybe if the Bay Area gets a WNBA (I pray to god they dont) I would let Marion on that team. WAIT TILL THE WARRIORS ARE HEALTHY:

    monta
    crawford
    jackson
    brandon wright
    biendris

    Maggette 6th man

  • Jaysohn

    Marion at this stage of his career is no longer a good fit for the Warriors not to mention he pouted his way out of Phoenix. Do you want that influence on the young guys? Nash made him an all-star and yet the guy complained about his role playing alongside Amare. We already have too many wing players because Nellie won’t give into the fact that you need bangers inside to rebound and defend. I would not get rid of Crawford yet, I would like to see him play with Monta because I don’t believe Monta is ready to be the primary play maker. Plus at 6’5 even though is is not a good defender at least it gives the Warriors size in the backcourt. Obviously Maggette is the only real trade marker that the Warriors have. With Belinelli and Morrow developing it would be nice to be able to trade Mags for a serviceable low post player or an expiring contract. Lets not get crazy, no one is going to give up starting PF which is what the team desperately needs.

  • Bernier

    I’d give up any combination of: Jackson, Maggette, Crawford, and Marcus Williams (just to sweeten it for Miami) and I’d even be willing to take back Banks and his awful deal (and awful playing – buy him out). Ideally Jack, Maggs, and Williams for Marion and Banks. Marion would be a huge boost on defense and rebounding, can shoot 3s, and most importantly his contract expires after this season. Perfect.

  • danikil49

    Way to go Earl.Jax is the first player that should be traded and then Maggette(although Cory can score almost at will). I would never trade BW. Monta or Randolph and I would only trade Kelenna, Bellinelli or Morrow unless I was got an outrageous deal. The Thundres youg players are maturing because they are playing,we don’t know what we have because most of the young guys are just beginning to get playing time. Oh by the way I hope Optimus never becomes the W’s GM and Blah should stop slummin and go uptown if he feels that way.

  • Chris

    You look around the league and the prevalent theme seems to be “Young teams improving.”

    Look at Atlanta, Portland, even Memphis, Minnesota and OKC.

    All of these teams have some great young talent and a fantastic core.

    Why can’t we be in that mix.

    Memphis: Gay, Mayo, Conley, Gasol , Warrick
    OKC: Westbrook, Green, Durant
    Minnesota: Foy, Jefferson, Love
    Portland: Roy, Aldridge, Fernandez, Oden, Outlaw
    Atlanta: Smith, Horford

    Then you look at us and I ask Warrior fans, “Which one of those combos above are our players better than?”

    Warriors: Ellis, Biedrins, Wright, Randolph, Belinelli, Morrow, Watson, Azubuike

    Those are some fantastic young players on the other teams I just mentioned, ………………let’s hope with Monta’s return and a more dedicated approach to defense and playing time for our young players, we can begin to grow as a young team rather than “struggle” as a young team.

    Because Portland, OKC, Minnesota and Memphis are growing as young teams, the Golden State Warriors are “struggling” as a young team.

  • Trey

    Someone name one guard in the history of the NBA that came into the league that was a below average ball-handler, passer, and defender and became a great player?

    After 4 years in the league, Monta is still a below average ball-handler, passer and defender. I’m not saying he’s worthless, he’s a very good role player, but he’ll never be someone you can build around. And for this team, he’s just another guy who scores 20 but gives up 25 on the other end.

    Face it, if he’s the best player on the team, we’ll always be a 30 win team.

  • Chris

    “Trey”………….you are absolutely NOT a Monta Ellis fan, I can see that.

    You are absolutely right, he has “0″ passing ability and “0″ ball handling ability, I have always questioned those about him as well. Not much of a Point Guard if you don’t have those underlying skills. And you could read my previous posts under the name “A.J.” and see that I have always said that Monta cannot handle or pass.

    The one thing he DOES do though is shoot very well from the field for a backcourt player. Remember last seaon in the second half, he led ALL guards in FGP after the All Star break. His mid range pull up is absolutely “deadly.”

    But he don’t play no defense and he can’t pass or dribble, you’re right, he’s primarily a “scorer,” because you can’t call him a “pure shooter” or a “point guard.” The description that fits him best is “scorer.”

    But he’s fast and quick and explosive in the open court as much as Tony Parker and Steve Nash but without the ball handling ability.

    He also finishes on both sides of the rim better than anyone in the league with both his right hand and left hands. Tony Parker is good at that as well.

    You take the good with the bad with him, I understand your Kirk Hinrich point primarily for tradiional “point guard” leadership and defense.

    If that’s the case, how about going after a guy like Chauncey Billups?

  • Cameron

    Can someone please remove Al Harrington from the banner at the top of this site? It’s clearly dated. Plus, it’s bad ju-ju to have a disgruntled ex-player on a team-related website.

  • goingforthemoney.com

    Marcus,
    The W’s need to stick to the plan of developing their own very young roster and forget about all this banter of trading anybody for the matrix. This team will get better the longer they play together. They just need to come up with a defensive philosophy and stick to it. Good things comes to those who wait. Legit power forwards rarely come along. Eventually they’ll land a plumb out of college and there fortunes will change.

  • Trey

    Chris, you’re right. You do have to take the good and bad with Monta. He’s a talented scorer, and that is a great skill. And he has turned into one of the best finishers. And to be fair, he’s also a very good rebounder for his size, so I guess I really should label him two-dimensional.

    He’s a good player, but he’s got way too many deficiencies to use as the centerpiece of your franchise. If he wasn’t being promoted as the future of the franchise, I wouldn’t have a too much of a problem with him. But when he’s “the man” and we’re building around him, well, I have a major problem with him.

    And Goingforthemoney, I’ve been a season ticket holder since 1994 and spent 12 years thinking “good things come to those who wait”, only to see us throw away our one franchise player this last summer. Ellis/Biedrins/Randolph/Wright really are just slightly better versions of JRich/Dunleavy/Murphy/Diogu.

    And that got us to a late lottery pick every year – the very definition of mediocrity. Blow this damn thing up, and start by dumping salary through Marion.

  • Jamarcus Russell

    How about this one?
    http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=165~497~3039~125~193~312~510~3046&teams=12~12~14~14~14~14~9~9&te=&cash=

    Miami will, without a single doubt, more than happy to go through with this trade. The Warriors should be happy too since they’re able to get rid of Maggette’s contract and take on a large expiring one in return. The only problem is whether or not the Clippers would want Maggette back. Maybe a few future draft picks from the Warriors and Miami to sweeten the deal?

  • NotaNelsonfan

    Marion is getting up there in age and his stats are dropping from 18 career pts a game down to 12 points a game. Marion also reinjured his groin again, you know how that goes.

    Don’t gettng rid of our rook or secnd year players for Marion. If anything unload Maggette and Crawford.

    I come to reality about hoping to get a guy like Boozer. Won’t work! Not with Nellie’s small ball. He’ll probably turn Boozer into a Point F. Can you really see Nellies game using a post up player, and slow down the run and gun?

    It’s really sad having Nellie as a coach for all of us including the W players. I missed the first half of the last Game against OKC, but noticed his small lineup again, granted we did not have AB. I assume that AR really did something wrong to not play the second half.

    I’m sick of Nellies philosophy of the small lineup. Can you see Phil Jackson not starting Gasol and Bynum if they were playing a team with a smaller center of PF? Some may think that our big guys don’t have the talent of other big men in the NBA, but how would we ever know that unless we went with a consistent big lineup and try it out.

  • http://stephenjacksonmakeslovetopressure.com jaxfor3

    I am going to have to agree with Trey on blowing up this organization and just starting over.

    The Warriors as a franchise is a flawed organization. At the top, we have executives not looking to put in the money and effort to create a winning brand of basketball but just enough to turn a profit.

    At this stage of his career, the coach is looking to win and win with his style of basketball. He’s not looking to develop the young guys for the future or implement a new style of play because he won’t be around to reap the benefits.

    Then we have a group of over-priced players that are selfish, unskilled, or plain lazy.

    Toss those things together and the future of the Warriros look bleak.

  • Kweezy

    I would personally love to get Marion! But not at the price of any of our youngsters. I would have to agree with NOTAFANOFNELSON in that either Maggette or Crawford would be the ones to go. I’d trade Maggette and a 2nd rounder in a heartbeat (even though he has been playing well as a 6th man, his contract is enormous).

    But I’m really interested in seeing how this Ellis and Crawford back court is going to work out. We’ve heard lots about how Jamal would be an ideal backcourt mate for Monta. And the two seem to genuinly like one another. However, I do have to admit I am pretty scared about how they are going to work on defense.

    Sure, the Warriors don’t have a legit starting caliber TRUE PG who averages 10 assists a game. But I think having 3 guys (Jackson, Ellis, Crawford) who average 5,6 maybe even 7 assists a game can be just as effective. Throw in Biedrens and Turiaf who have been passing incredibly lately, and I think you’ve got yourself a very different team from the isolation, dribble dribble shoot one we saw earlier in the season

  • the Seer

    Its always fun when the Warriors play good teams and they find out that they are lightyears from anywhere and right at the cap for the next four years..So cool to be a Warriors fan..

  • the Seer

    Like Shawn Marion wants to come here..Forget it!!
    There is zero chance that he would come play in this mess..