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	<title>Comments on: Game #10 (3-7): Cavaliers 114, Warriors 108</title>
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	<link>http://www.ibabuzz.com/warriors/2009/11/18/game-10-3-7-cavaliers-114-warriors-108/</link>
	<description>with Marcus Thompson</description>
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		<title>By: kobe24</title>
		<link>http://www.ibabuzz.com/warriors/2009/11/18/game-10-3-7-cavaliers-114-warriors-108/comment-page-1/#comment-23577</link>
		<dc:creator>kobe24</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Nov 2009 18:05:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ibabuzz.com/warriors/?p=1598#comment-23577</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Fire Nelson period. 

The guy is senile and a lush.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Fire Nelson period. </p>
<p>The guy is senile and a lush.</p>
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		<title>By: Yulupan</title>
		<link>http://www.ibabuzz.com/warriors/2009/11/18/game-10-3-7-cavaliers-114-warriors-108/comment-page-1/#comment-23572</link>
		<dc:creator>Yulupan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Nov 2009 17:13:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ibabuzz.com/warriors/?p=1598#comment-23572</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Marcus,

Your points about Randolph are undeniable.  I am trying so hard to remain a fan after 30 years and give Nellie the benefit of the doubt.  I keep telling myself that there must be something that we&#039;re not seeing that is driving Nellie not to play Randolph more.  I&#039;m now at a point where I don&#039;t really care what it is - just play him.  Because, as you point out, even with all of his flaws he&#039;s still the best PF we have - BY FAR!  In the old days, players were expected to take the treatment their coach dished out.  Those days are long gone.  Even if Randolph does have maturity issues, and can&#039;t remember all of the plays, he still needs to be on the court.  Players&#039; psyches are too fragile these days to deal with an old school coach.  I think Nellie is missing the bigger issue that, while Randolph might not be ready for prime time, he is destroying him mentally.  Randolph isn&#039;t going to wake up some morning and thank Nellie for holding him accountable and making him earn his minutes.  I think Randolph said all of the right things last summer.  He was respectful, worked hard, and improved his game.  Nellie had better reward that behavior or risk losing this monster talent for the long run.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Marcus,</p>
<p>Your points about Randolph are undeniable.  I am trying so hard to remain a fan after 30 years and give Nellie the benefit of the doubt.  I keep telling myself that there must be something that we&#8217;re not seeing that is driving Nellie not to play Randolph more.  I&#8217;m now at a point where I don&#8217;t really care what it is &#8211; just play him.  Because, as you point out, even with all of his flaws he&#8217;s still the best PF we have &#8211; BY FAR!  In the old days, players were expected to take the treatment their coach dished out.  Those days are long gone.  Even if Randolph does have maturity issues, and can&#8217;t remember all of the plays, he still needs to be on the court.  Players&#8217; psyches are too fragile these days to deal with an old school coach.  I think Nellie is missing the bigger issue that, while Randolph might not be ready for prime time, he is destroying him mentally.  Randolph isn&#8217;t going to wake up some morning and thank Nellie for holding him accountable and making him earn his minutes.  I think Randolph said all of the right things last summer.  He was respectful, worked hard, and improved his game.  Nellie had better reward that behavior or risk losing this monster talent for the long run.</p>
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		<title>By: Marcus Thompson</title>
		<link>http://www.ibabuzz.com/warriors/2009/11/18/game-10-3-7-cavaliers-114-warriors-108/comment-page-1/#comment-23570</link>
		<dc:creator>Marcus Thompson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Nov 2009 16:34:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ibabuzz.com/warriors/?p=1598#comment-23570</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Swopa,

If knowing the plays is a prerequisite for starting, how did Vlad start two games fresh off a plan from Charlotte. Do the Warriors even run plays half the time?
I am not saying he shouldn&#039;t have to get better in these areas. I am saying real development happens on the court. You don&#039;t think part of his turnover problem and scatter-brain type of play is a result of knowing he will get yanked if he messes up? Who else on the team plays under the same scrutiny?
And meanwhile, he brings athleticism, effort on defense, running the floor and rebounding. He is not going to get better sitting on the bench. And the Warriors aren&#039;t going to get better by playing journeymen instead of their young talent.
He is as close to untouchable as the Warriors have on their roster, and he can only play against Sheldon Williams??? I agree that he makes a lot of mistakes. Still, HE IS BETTER than Vlad. He is better than Corey Maggette as a PF. Even with his mistakes.
Did you see Vlad guarding KG and Randolph guarding KG? It was night and day. KG actually had to work. Do you remember last year when Randolph challenged Garnett in the Garden? You don&#039;t get better playing against other team&#039;s second and third-string players.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Swopa,</p>
<p>If knowing the plays is a prerequisite for starting, how did Vlad start two games fresh off a plan from Charlotte. Do the Warriors even run plays half the time?<br />
I am not saying he shouldn&#8217;t have to get better in these areas. I am saying real development happens on the court. You don&#8217;t think part of his turnover problem and scatter-brain type of play is a result of knowing he will get yanked if he messes up? Who else on the team plays under the same scrutiny?<br />
And meanwhile, he brings athleticism, effort on defense, running the floor and rebounding. He is not going to get better sitting on the bench. And the Warriors aren&#8217;t going to get better by playing journeymen instead of their young talent.<br />
He is as close to untouchable as the Warriors have on their roster, and he can only play against Sheldon Williams??? I agree that he makes a lot of mistakes. Still, HE IS BETTER than Vlad. He is better than Corey Maggette as a PF. Even with his mistakes.<br />
Did you see Vlad guarding KG and Randolph guarding KG? It was night and day. KG actually had to work. Do you remember last year when Randolph challenged Garnett in the Garden? You don&#8217;t get better playing against other team&#8217;s second and third-string players.</p>
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		<title>By: Swopa</title>
		<link>http://www.ibabuzz.com/warriors/2009/11/18/game-10-3-7-cavaliers-114-warriors-108/comment-page-1/#comment-23569</link>
		<dc:creator>Swopa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Nov 2009 16:25:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ibabuzz.com/warriors/?p=1598#comment-23569</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Marcus, it isn&#039;t that Randolph is &quot;so bad&quot; that he can&#039;t play PF, it&#039;s that he has a lot to learn.  There have been numerous reports this year about Randolph having trouble knowing the plays -- Monta Ellis yelled at him on the court about it during the Clippers loss, I seem to recall Jax saying something about it after Nellie tried Randolph at SF (and decided to move him back to PF), and you reported it happening during the Knicks game.

Is it too much to ask that the Golden Boy *learn the plays* before he becomes a permanent starter?  Doesn&#039;t it send a corrosive message to the team if that isn&#039;t an obstacle?  Heck, doesn&#039;t it send a corrosive message to Randolph himself?

In my experience watching the NBA, giving a rookie 35-40 minutes a game no matter how many mistakes he makes seems like the best way to ensure that those mistakes become permanent bad habits.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Marcus, it isn&#8217;t that Randolph is &#8220;so bad&#8221; that he can&#8217;t play PF, it&#8217;s that he has a lot to learn.  There have been numerous reports this year about Randolph having trouble knowing the plays &#8212; Monta Ellis yelled at him on the court about it during the Clippers loss, I seem to recall Jax saying something about it after Nellie tried Randolph at SF (and decided to move him back to PF), and you reported it happening during the Knicks game.</p>
<p>Is it too much to ask that the Golden Boy *learn the plays* before he becomes a permanent starter?  Doesn&#8217;t it send a corrosive message to the team if that isn&#8217;t an obstacle?  Heck, doesn&#8217;t it send a corrosive message to Randolph himself?</p>
<p>In my experience watching the NBA, giving a rookie 35-40 minutes a game no matter how many mistakes he makes seems like the best way to ensure that those mistakes become permanent bad habits.</p>
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		<title>By: Yulupan</title>
		<link>http://www.ibabuzz.com/warriors/2009/11/18/game-10-3-7-cavaliers-114-warriors-108/comment-page-1/#comment-23568</link>
		<dc:creator>Yulupan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Nov 2009 16:25:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ibabuzz.com/warriors/?p=1598#comment-23568</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Marcus,

Thank you for your balanced reporting - we need it now more than ever.  I&#039;m not sure I agree with your comment that Bell has to play this year to get a contract this summer.  Look at it from a different angle.  What if he guts it out and plays.  I&#039;m not sure it would be to his advantage to have surgery after the season.  That would put him in the position of asking teams to take a chance that he&#039;ll be the same player afterward.  At least if he has the surgery now he might have a chance to come back and play the last month of the season.  Wouldn&#039;t that make him more attractive and remove the question mark over his head?  Maybe you&#039;re right.  He would have all summer to recover but he&#039;s 33 and an older player headed to surgery would make a lot of teams cautious, I think.  I don&#039;t blame Raja for doing what&#039;s best for him.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Marcus,</p>
<p>Thank you for your balanced reporting &#8211; we need it now more than ever.  I&#8217;m not sure I agree with your comment that Bell has to play this year to get a contract this summer.  Look at it from a different angle.  What if he guts it out and plays.  I&#8217;m not sure it would be to his advantage to have surgery after the season.  That would put him in the position of asking teams to take a chance that he&#8217;ll be the same player afterward.  At least if he has the surgery now he might have a chance to come back and play the last month of the season.  Wouldn&#8217;t that make him more attractive and remove the question mark over his head?  Maybe you&#8217;re right.  He would have all summer to recover but he&#8217;s 33 and an older player headed to surgery would make a lot of teams cautious, I think.  I don&#8217;t blame Raja for doing what&#8217;s best for him.</p>
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		<title>By: Marcus Thompson</title>
		<link>http://www.ibabuzz.com/warriors/2009/11/18/game-10-3-7-cavaliers-114-warriors-108/comment-page-1/#comment-23564</link>
		<dc:creator>Marcus Thompson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Nov 2009 15:46:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ibabuzz.com/warriors/?p=1598#comment-23564</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Feltbot,

Noah started 31 games as a rookie (all after Ben Wallace was traded to Cleveland), 55 his second-year. By his third season, this season, he&#039;s an every day starter and major contributor. Trevor Ariza was hardly a lottery pick. He was taken No. 44 overall and had to earn a spot, earn a contract, etc. Tyrus Thomas, as a rookie, played behind P.J. Brown on a team that went to the 2nd round of the playoffs. In his second year, he saw more action, starting 27 games, as he split time with Joe Smith.
But you show me a situation in which a young player who was a lottery pick is on a non-playoff team with no established veteran in front of him at his position and riding the bench, and I will show you a coach that is getting criticized. 
What&#039;s more, the Warriors have dedicated this season to developing their young players. So Nellie stashes Randolph behind two established players who aren&#039;t going anywhere at position he won&#039;t play in the furture. And at the position Randolph actually plays, he runs with a 9th year (Vlad) and 11th year (Maggette) vet who won&#039;t be part of the Warriors future if they can help it.
And you think that makes sense?
If he is so bad that he can&#039;t play PF for a team that is admittedly going nowhere, then why not package him? Who wouldn&#039;t trade their third-string center if another team wanted him?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Feltbot,</p>
<p>Noah started 31 games as a rookie (all after Ben Wallace was traded to Cleveland), 55 his second-year. By his third season, this season, he&#8217;s an every day starter and major contributor. Trevor Ariza was hardly a lottery pick. He was taken No. 44 overall and had to earn a spot, earn a contract, etc. Tyrus Thomas, as a rookie, played behind P.J. Brown on a team that went to the 2nd round of the playoffs. In his second year, he saw more action, starting 27 games, as he split time with Joe Smith.<br />
But you show me a situation in which a young player who was a lottery pick is on a non-playoff team with no established veteran in front of him at his position and riding the bench, and I will show you a coach that is getting criticized.<br />
What&#8217;s more, the Warriors have dedicated this season to developing their young players. So Nellie stashes Randolph behind two established players who aren&#8217;t going anywhere at position he won&#8217;t play in the furture. And at the position Randolph actually plays, he runs with a 9th year (Vlad) and 11th year (Maggette) vet who won&#8217;t be part of the Warriors future if they can help it.<br />
And you think that makes sense?<br />
If he is so bad that he can&#8217;t play PF for a team that is admittedly going nowhere, then why not package him? Who wouldn&#8217;t trade their third-string center if another team wanted him?</p>
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		<title>By: feltbot</title>
		<link>http://www.ibabuzz.com/warriors/2009/11/18/game-10-3-7-cavaliers-114-warriors-108/comment-page-1/#comment-23561</link>
		<dc:creator>feltbot</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Nov 2009 05:29:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ibabuzz.com/warriors/?p=1598#comment-23561</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Players who are not stars need to understand that Nellie will only play them in spots where he feels they have positive matchups (hence moving Randolph against backup 5s).  And even then, he will only continue playing them when they play well.

This is not mind games.  It is the same process that many good players have gone through with other coaches.

Just ask Joakim Noah,Tyrus Thomas,Trevor Ariza and a host of others.

If you want to ask a question, ask why Don Nelson gets blamed for this exclusively among all the coaches of the NBA, when he has such a superlative record in developing all-star players.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Players who are not stars need to understand that Nellie will only play them in spots where he feels they have positive matchups (hence moving Randolph against backup 5s).  And even then, he will only continue playing them when they play well.</p>
<p>This is not mind games.  It is the same process that many good players have gone through with other coaches.</p>
<p>Just ask Joakim Noah,Tyrus Thomas,Trevor Ariza and a host of others.</p>
<p>If you want to ask a question, ask why Don Nelson gets blamed for this exclusively among all the coaches of the NBA, when he has such a superlative record in developing all-star players.</p>
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		<title>By: sartre</title>
		<link>http://www.ibabuzz.com/warriors/2009/11/18/game-10-3-7-cavaliers-114-warriors-108/comment-page-1/#comment-23560</link>
		<dc:creator>sartre</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Nov 2009 04:02:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ibabuzz.com/warriors/?p=1598#comment-23560</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I get Nellie not playing Randolph when the level of misfiring is hurting his team in a competitive game.  What I have never understood with Nellie is why he&#039;ll bench Randolph when that is not the case, as he sometimes does.  Even if to some extent you have different standards for young players compared to veterans (which is not unreasonable), at least be consistent in your handling of the individual player - reward good play, give them some leeway to play through the mistakes so long as they&#039;re doing well on balance and giving effort.  Not rewarding good play defeats the value of punishing poor play - the player feels helpless to influence playing time through the only thing they have control over.  This is psych 101, how hard can it be for coach to understand this?  

I don&#039;t regard Nellie as the prince of darkness like some commenters feltbot, he does some things very well, I just think that he can handle certain players in a way that unnecessarily undermines their development and morale.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I get Nellie not playing Randolph when the level of misfiring is hurting his team in a competitive game.  What I have never understood with Nellie is why he&#8217;ll bench Randolph when that is not the case, as he sometimes does.  Even if to some extent you have different standards for young players compared to veterans (which is not unreasonable), at least be consistent in your handling of the individual player &#8211; reward good play, give them some leeway to play through the mistakes so long as they&#8217;re doing well on balance and giving effort.  Not rewarding good play defeats the value of punishing poor play &#8211; the player feels helpless to influence playing time through the only thing they have control over.  This is psych 101, how hard can it be for coach to understand this?  </p>
<p>I don&#8217;t regard Nellie as the prince of darkness like some commenters feltbot, he does some things very well, I just think that he can handle certain players in a way that unnecessarily undermines their development and morale.</p>
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		<title>By: feltbot</title>
		<link>http://www.ibabuzz.com/warriors/2009/11/18/game-10-3-7-cavaliers-114-warriors-108/comment-page-1/#comment-23559</link>
		<dc:creator>feltbot</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Nov 2009 03:57:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ibabuzz.com/warriors/?p=1598#comment-23559</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Marcus, Don Nelson is holding Anthony Randolph accountable for his play, just like every other coach worth his salt in the NBA does with their young players.

The number of mistakes Randolph is making on the court right now is mind-numbing.  Starting with his silly fouls in the backcourt. How many more minutes could he actually have played with 5 fouls?

Anthony Randolph is 20 years old, with one year of college ball and one year of pros under his belt. He needs to learn how to play the game, as Jim Barnett has been emphasizing on his broadcasts.  Nelson is trying to teach him in the traditional way of all great coaches.  Why is that earning him abuse from everyone staffing newspapers in the bay area?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Marcus, Don Nelson is holding Anthony Randolph accountable for his play, just like every other coach worth his salt in the NBA does with their young players.</p>
<p>The number of mistakes Randolph is making on the court right now is mind-numbing.  Starting with his silly fouls in the backcourt. How many more minutes could he actually have played with 5 fouls?</p>
<p>Anthony Randolph is 20 years old, with one year of college ball and one year of pros under his belt. He needs to learn how to play the game, as Jim Barnett has been emphasizing on his broadcasts.  Nelson is trying to teach him in the traditional way of all great coaches.  Why is that earning him abuse from everyone staffing newspapers in the bay area?</p>
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		<title>By: Marcus Thompson</title>
		<link>http://www.ibabuzz.com/warriors/2009/11/18/game-10-3-7-cavaliers-114-warriors-108/comment-page-1/#comment-23558</link>
		<dc:creator>Marcus Thompson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Nov 2009 02:42:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ibabuzz.com/warriors/?p=1598#comment-23558</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Feltbot,

I am sure you think its better to allow Mikki Moore to get eaten up by JJ Hickson than to let Randolph learn and play through his mistakes. lol. I&#039;m sure you like playing journeymen over the alleged young core this team is supposed to be building around.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Feltbot,</p>
<p>I am sure you think its better to allow Mikki Moore to get eaten up by JJ Hickson than to let Randolph learn and play through his mistakes. lol. I&#8217;m sure you like playing journeymen over the alleged young core this team is supposed to be building around.</p>
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