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The Wall/Turner Debate

Was having a pretty good discussion over on Twitter (http://twitter.com/gswscribe) about who the Warriors should draft.

The assumption, or the hypothetical situation, is that the Warriors get the No. 1 pick in the draft (which they have a good chance of doing, considering they have one of the worst records in the league). What should they do? The most popular options in the discussion were the following:

* Take the guy considered far-and-away the best player in the draft, Kentucky PG John Wall, and create room for him by trading guard Monta Ellis and/or Stephen Curry

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* Trade the pick and get a player at a position they need more, such as Ohio State swingman Evan Turner or Kentucky big man DeMarcus Cousins, and run the risk of passing on the player many expect will turn out to be one of the greats

* Draft Wall and play him with Ellis and Curry, creating an explosive-yet-tiny perimeter

For the record, if they get No. 1, I say cash in on the Wall hype and get the No. 2 plus whatever you can. Then with the No. 2, take Evan Turner.

Some think that’s crazy. How do you pass on John Wall? How do you risk walking away from the guy predicted to be the next great, great point guard? Stephen Curry is how.

From my end, the Warriors have a good young point guard. That position is set for years to come. Is John Wall an upgrade? Possibly. He is certainly physically and athletically superior. But he is that much better to justify discarding Curry? I don’t think so.

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Among other things, the Warriors need a playmaker at the small forward or shooting guard positions, especially someone with size. They need another guy who can make plays from various spots on the floor (the top, from the wing, from the post) and facilitate the offense when they have a mismatch. Stephen Jackson was that guy. Evan Turner might wind up even better than Jackson. At 6-foo-7, 205 pounds, he has all the tools. Put him at SF, you can have Curry and Ellis, or even Morrow, on either side of him. You put him at SG, you have the backcourt of the future with him and Curry. A traditional backcourt. And a cheap one for the next three years.

Of course, that means moving Monta Ellis. But imagine what you could get for Ellis (with four years, $44 million) if you tack on the No. 1 pick. Obviously, it all depends on who get No. 2. But do you think the Knicks would do a sign-and-trade with David Lee for a chance at John Wall? Would Minnesota give up Al Jefferson?

Here is my thinking: You don’t have to have the best point guard to win big. You just need a really good one. If you already have one, why grab another one? The times where teams are burned by passing up the best available player is usually when the back-up plan is a relative stiff or a project. If you get a pretty good player, passing up a great one is not so bad. People always talk about how Portland blew it because they drafted Sam Bowie over Jordan. No one talks about how Houston, who had the No. 1 pick, also passed up Michael Jordan. Because they drafted Hakeem Olajuwon.

Did Toronto blow it by not taking Dwyane Wade at No. 4 in 2003? No. They got Chris Bosh. Oklahoma City passed up Tyreke Evans just like Memphis did. But Memphis drafted Hasheem Thabeet and Oklahoma City, which already had Russell Westbrook, drafted James Harden. Did OKC make a mistake? I don’t think so.

Evan Turner is, by most analysis I’ve read and from what I think in the few games I’ve seen, is going to be pretty good. If you walk away from the draft with Curry, Turner and a third player as a result of trading Wall (and maybe Ellis), that is a respectable route to take.

Of course, if Turner turns out to be a bust and Wall a star, the Warriors would never hear the end of it. But I history would be harsher on the franchise if it gave up Curry for Wall, and Curry turns out to be a star while Wall turns out to be a bust. That is just the risk of the draft.

I am not a fan of the small backcourt. To me, it doesn’t produce championships, which is the ultimate goal. Therefore, any backcourt combination of Wall/Curry/Ellis is not ideal. It creates too many problems on defense, since neither are taller than 6-foot-4, and defense is necessary for true basketball success. Sure, they would be explosive and exciting and fun to watch. But they won’t win big. Because in the end, you have to defend Kobe, and Brandon Roy, and Manu Ginobili, and J.R. Smith, and O.J. Mayo, and Kevin Martin, and, eventually, Marcus Thornton.

I think Wall is a beast. But you don’t have him to win. Curry is turning out to be really good, and is better than Wall in a way that pays big dividends. What do you hear about just every PG who comes into the league? He needs to learn to shoot. Well, the Warriors have a PG who can shoot. I think it is way too risky to give up that guarantee you have in the bank, for – essentially – more athleticism and physical dominance at the position.

I will say this. I am certainly not opposed to drafting Wall and trading Curry and/or Ellis. If the Warriors decide to go with Ellis at shooting guard for the future, they need a solid PG next to them. I wouldn’t be mad at all if they drafted Wall and went with him and Ellis. Because of Wall’s athleticism, and size, I think those two have a better chance of excelling as a small backcourt than Curry and Ellis. I still think Wall would have to be the undisputed point guard and Ellis would be the SG.

My only concern is at the end of the day, unless you parlay Curry into something really good, you only have two positions addressed – the same two positions you already had addressed. Even if you are now better in the backcourt, you still need to address the frontcourt. If you roll with Curry as your PG, and trade down for Turner (especially if you include Ellis or even Anthony Randolph), you can potentially fill a third position for years to come – whether it’s SF or PF or C. And maybe cut money while you do it.

Of course, none of this matters unless the Warriors get the No. 1.

Marcus Thompson

  • Bill

    before the Warriors can strategize the draft they have to figure out who is coaching this team next year because only Nelson would be harebrained enough to run 3 guards out there…it’s like drafting in the NFL when teams get a big tackle….it’s not glamorous but it’s necessary….so get somebody who can get the damned rebound…then you can run or set up and you could even install a coach as stupid as Mike Brown and you’d win a few more than they do now…it’s personnel, not star power….and to the guy who says Turiaf doesn’t rebound….a big raspberry…he’s the only big man we have who defends the lane and blocks out well..I don’t count Tolliver who will be gone over the summer anyway…..

  • ThatGuyYouHear

    Wall is not by far and away the best player in the draft. He’s the 2nd best prospect on his team, behind Cousins. I have no idea why he’s listed as the top pick, as his PG skills aren’t that good. Turner’s a better pick at #1, Cousins, Monroe or Whiteside would be too.

  • Warriors 4 Life

    Wall is supposed to be the next big thing since LeBron, we can not pass up on him if given the chance. This team will not win a championship with Curry or Ellis as their best player, maybe second best, but not the franchise player. Turner and Wall are both future superstars. If we get to draft one of them, we should trade Ellis or Curry for a nice big man.

  • TownLove

    Warriors need another guard like a whole in the head. The Warriors HAVE to go Demarcus Cousins in the draft. He will provide the down low presence that theyve been craving for years. He a legit 7 footer, who is extremly light on his feet, he rebounds has plenty of post moves and can run despite his size. He is the perfect fit. Besides he adds insurance in case Biendris season isnt a fluke.

    SF is already set with Magette and Buike. Wall is a 6’4 PG that is a big time scorer. We definitely dont need that. I honestly hope they dont win the draft and have to deal with the Wall hype. #3 or #4 should be high enough to land Cousins.

  • Tonjon

    Brilliant as always MT, your exactly right. The problem is, what your saying makes too much sense. Its not the Warriors way. To be honest, Turner has just been much better than Wall, with much less talented teammates. He is a stud. I would not pick Cousins because he is a headcase and Nelson (assuming he is still here) would ruin him so quickly.

  • A’s in 2010

    Every year there is a clear cut #1 but some guy going 3-7 ends up the best of the bunch. John Wall is the #1 pick this year.

    But Evan Turner is the next Dwayne Wade, Brandon Roy, Tyreke Evans. These are guys that teams had a strong inkling would turn out to be top players but passed on anyways.

    There is value there at #1 though. You can’t ignore that. You get #1, you draft John Wall. Best case scenario is the team picking #2 would rather have Wall than Turner. That could present a chance to make a trade and clean up this roster.

  • TownLove

    I like Wall. I see a lot of Wade in him. I think he is good. Especially at crunch time. But he needs the ball in his hands to be effective.

    Imagine Curry feeding to Cousins on the pick and roll. That would be unstopable. We can finally solve the front court issue and for relatively cheap in the draft. Ay other descent offeason bigman is going to break the bank. This kid is going to be good:

    Shaq freshman year: 12.9 ppg, 12 rebs, and 3.8 blocks

    Cousins as a freshman: 16.3 ppg, 10 rebs, and 2 blocks

    If he is half as good as Shaq he would be worth the pick.

  • http://baysportsblood.wordpress.com http://baysportsblood.wordpress.com/

    That would be amazing if they could get a big out of it all while trading the number 1 pick and shedding some salary. Just when I thought I could go to sleep.

  • Dump Scooter

    Marcus,

    Passing on Wall because we already have Curry is like Blazers passing on Jordan because they already had Drexler.

    If dubs get #1 pick, they have to get John Wall, and build everything else around him.

  • sartre

    Excellent analysis Marcus. You make a convincing argument with it.

    At some future time it will be good to hear your thoughts should be get the 3rd pick and miss out on Wall and Turner. Would you go for Cousins or Johnson? Based on nbadraft.net reports Johnson (6′ 7″, 205lbs) might offer a good alternative at small forward. Two things stand out for me in addition to the nice offensive ability – defense and rebounding (the twin deficits of the dubs over the last couple of seasons).

    “He shoots 50% from the field overall, and does not need 20 plus shots to be effective … Extremely unselfish, the offense rarely becomes stagnant when the ball is in his hands, a tendency other teams have when their go-to player tries to isolate himself … An underrated passer showing excellent vision and passing skills for a 3 … He moves extremely well off the ball, and does a great job of getting himself open off back screens … Wes can run the floor and finish effectively in transition … His quickness, awareness and long wingspan come into play defensively as well, as he is a terrific off-ball and help defender … Can quickly move from the weak-side to ball-side, and uses those long arms and high leaping abilities to block an average of 2 shots per game … He’s athletic and long enough to play effective on-ball defense at the next level … His wingspan and leaping abilities also make him an excellent rebounder, and his persistent nature and good nose for the ball make him a pest on theoffensive glass …”

    From reports, Cousins is still a bit of a project.

  • Son of Ahmed

    Dump Scooter,
    I was thinking the same thing. You can’t pass up on a player with all world talent. However, it’s still too early to gauge just how good Wall will be at the next level. He’s definitely going to be a good pro. But I haven’t seen enough to be confident that we’re talking tier 1 superstar here. He’s a great freshman player, but if he is not going to be star that transcends his position, then the Warriors should protect their investment in Curry.

    It’s a really tough call. Hopefully, that’s the predicament they’ll be in this June.

  • Mountain Jim

    Re No. 7, the Blazers problem wasn’t passing up Jordan because they already had Drexler. That made sense. It was the fact that Bowie, who people forget was a really good player, ended up injured his whole career. He wasn’t a bust because he was a stiff, he was more like Walton without the couple of good years – just physically unable to play.

    I basically agree with Tim on this one. My big preference is a bigger, but talented backcourt and some front court help. If they can get that by trading a pick and Ellis, do it. It puts them in better financial shape to do other things as well, and you don’t have to live through another season with a rookie pg and undersized players getting beaten up at the wrong positions.

    Of course, the first thing I’d do before all that is get a new coach.

  • spe

    I hate this, so much to be excited about every year, and then the Warriors screw it up or dont take advantage of the possibilities. Breaks my heart!

  • dtruth

    O.k. let’s get real, Lebron, c’mon Wall is good but he’s no Lebron. I don’t even know if he is really a Derek Rose. Did you see Derek Rose get man handled by Dwight, Superman, Howard. He has about 20lbs on Wall.

    Wall will have to bulk up in order to go inside at the next level because he doesn’t have the height. He will definitely need to improve his outside shot as well as his defense.

    He is fast. He is flashy, but will that be enough. Will great highlights get his team to the playoffs. By the way, Carmello improved his game by leaps and bounds in the last two years. Iverson is a comprable player, but look at how his career went. NO rings. So think long and hard before you choose flash over all around play. It is a different ball game at the next level.

  • GSW_Hoops

    I think Garry Saint Jean should make the decision. He is the best GM ever and a great pregame host.

    I am the president of his fan club.

    Robert Rowell also really knows his basketball despite never having played even a pick up game at the gym (he has never been to a gym).

    All is good as long as Cohan and Rowell are in charge.

  • Chris Webber

    With the Warriors luck. They will draft Wall thinking the team with the second pick will want to trade, but then decide to change their minds and screw the Dubs.

  • Terry Teagle

    It doesn’t matter. Stern and the NBA hate the Warriors. The ping pong ball gods will make sure the Warriors get the 5th pick.

  • GregC

    If you get the number one pick you have trade down and pick Evan Turner. To me Curry is untouchable, dude just has too many intangibles.

    This is the perfect draft to get the NO 1 pick because there is a consensus pick at NO 1. Some GM is going to be desperate (see knicks or t-wolves) to do something Bold to get Wall. We could:

    Add a big man and get Turner:

    or Shed Maggette’s contract and get Turner.

  • http://feltbot.com/ feltbot

    “The small backcourt doesn’t win championships”
    Clyde Frazier and Earl the Pearl
    Isaiah Thomas and Joe Dumars
    Steve Nash and Nick van Exel (2003 Mavs a Nowitzki knee injury in Conference Championships from a title)

    The Spurs recent resurgence was tied to one thing: Popovich went to a Hill and Parker backcourt. Who’s bigger, Hill and Parker, or Ellis and Curry?

    The success of a small backcourt is integrally related to the frontcourt it plays with. The Warriors have been playing with NO FRONTCOURT for the entire season, so any and all attempts at analyzing the Curry/Ellis backcourt at this point are meaningless.

    Don Nelson rarely drafts from need. He would rather take the best player, and get what he needs from trade. Taking Curry and passing on the Stoudemire deal a good example of that.

    I expect the Warriors to package the pick for an impact big man. As for John Wall, he may be a fantastic individual player, in the mold of Derrick Rose or Tyreke Evans. But Stephen Curry is a fantastic team leader, in the mold of Steve Nash. It’s a no-brainer to me that you keep Curry and move Wall.

  • goingforthemoney

    People listen up. So much talk about this team. The reality is wholesale changes rarely work, and doing a makeover every year isn’t the answer. All of the potential draft options mentioned are good picks but they won’t fix the real problem. Dispite all the overall injuries there is some talent on the roster but misguided for sure. There is no logic with the Warriors brainthrust that make any sense. There is no real plan of action to win a championship say like in 4 years. All the W’s know how to do is make roster changes with no real purpose behind their moves. NO LEADERSHIP, NO PLAN, NO GUIDANCE, NO SUCCESS. JUST MORE Of THE SAME FRUSTRATION TO COME WITH PLAYERS EVENTUALLY WANTING TO LEAVE. The drafting of these young men is not what the W’s should be focusing on. True Warrior fans should pool their money to buy a few key billboard and plead to Cohen to do the right thing and sell the W’s to LARRY. Now let us pray!

  • Marcus Thompson

    Felbot,

    Van Exel and Nash DID NOT win a championship. Neither has Hill and Parker. I’ll give you the Bad Boyz and the Knicks duo, but clearly that was a different era. And for the record, you pretty much prove my point since you had to name four Hall of Famers to find a small backcourt that was successful.

    With that said, I do agree. And I said this on the air recently, if the Warriors have a chance at succeeding
    with a small backcourt, they need a beast of a frontline. If they do decide to stay small at the guard position, they need a deft low-post scorer, a huge presence in the paint on the defensive end, and a versatile SF that can shoot and be a lock-down defender and, for the Warriors system, pass and run the floor.

  • TownLove

    Johnson is very nice. He is extremly quick, athlectic and can shoot from long range. Id prefer Cousins, but you cant go wrong with any of those guys Wall, Turner, Cousins and Johnson.

    Im not too worried about the Draft that’s where Nelly shines. Say what you want about his gimmicky coaching, but the guy knows talent when he sees it.

  • believewhat

    No way, you can pass on Wall if Ws get #1 pick. Curry can move to off guard. Defense would be a problem which they can offset a bit by getting Raja Bell kind of a guy to substitute one of them if they are getting killed on the defence. Also, if we know anything about Ws FO, they would rather have two players Curry and Wall on rookie pay scale on the payroll than Curry/Wall and Monta.

  • fotd

    Absolutely agree that the W’s should go with Curry instead of Wall. Both will get the superstar calls from the refs (which, IMO, is the reason why in today’s NBA, you have to have a superstar to win it all). Curry will be NBA royalty – AND he can shoot AND he sees the floor well.

    I love the idea of seeing what we can get for Monta (or Randolph) plus exchanging picks. It even could work if we got the second pick and wanted to go with Cousins while the third place team wanted Turner… For example, if Philly were third to our second, trade Monta plus the second pick for Iguodala plus the third. They take Turner and we get Cousins. I’d love a trad sized backcourt of Curry and Iguodala.

  • Gizzm

    trade ellis, biedrins,and wright or randolph for chris bosh.

    draft turner or wall

    curry/wall or turner/magette/bosh/turiaf
    with
    marrow/wright or randolph/azu as a solid 8 man rotation

  • Dump Scooter

    To all who perceive this as Wall Vs. Curry dilemma,

    Drafting Wall does not mean getting rid of Curry.
    Nor playing them together for long term.

    They can play together for at least a year. Remember, Dubs won’t be a contender, anyway, next year. Let the kids play and evaluate the situation.

    Offensively, they’re going to be awesome. Probably one of the best back-court in the NBA once they get to know each other, and with a coach who knows how to utilize their skills (yes, Nellie!)

    Defense will be a challenge, but Wall’s athleticism will help him to be a good defender and cover most 2′s.

    That will make Ellis expandable, who should be traded for a solid big man (David Lee? Boozer? Bynum?)

    And then, after a year, we may learn that:
    * Wall is fulfilling his huge potential, and should be the point guard to build around – trade Curry.
    * Curry is the natural PG, and cannot co-exist with Wall – trade Wall
    * They both complement each other and create an amazing back court together – keep them.

    Oh, do you realize that with the 3rd-worst record, the Dub’s chances of landing the 1st pick are about 15%? Nice dreamin’, anyway :-)

  • David

    Nobody has talked about Derrick Favors – and it seems like he might be a good fit – provided Nelson is not around next year, and we legitimately give him time to develop.

    Cousins is a little slow, and will work the best in a half court scheme. Favors will work the best in an open court/athletic based team. Favors is playing on a team right now that accentuates all of his worst aspects. Cousins is playing on one that accentuates his best aspects.

  • fotd

    I don’t think Monta in a trade by himself gets us the big man we want. I think Marcus’s idea of packaging Monta with the pick works because we benefit by selling Wall’s hype up front and before it is tainted.

  • robert rowell

    it always comes down to this, every freaking season, who are we gonna take in the draft? there’s nothing else to talk about after months of suck. well, let the suck continue. it doesn’t really matter who we take in the draft until the FO learns how to build a cohesvie team and after 16 years of Cohan, wishing upon that star is sheer stupidity.

    the fact the some of you are talking about trading ellis or curry for UFA (boozer, bosh, etc) tells me that many of you know as much about basketball as cohan does. which is nothing, btw.

  • TownLove

    We are getting ready for the Warrior’s playoffs; also referred to as March Madness.

  • 808S.Pacific

    Draft Turner he is compared to Roy of the Blazers.

    Then trade Monta to Sac (Or who ever has the fourth pick) for their #1 and draft Cousins.

    I really like Monta, but in all honesty he is not a team player with the W’s.

  • Whack-A-Dub

    Lol, #2, you’re hilarious, so if we get Turner we get rid of Curry? Lol, so if the pistons already had Thomas and they draft Jordan, they get rid of Isaiah Thomas? Lol,yes Turner is the next big scorer, but that doesn’t mean in any way he can’t mesh with the super-charismatic and unselfish Curry. It just means we get rid of Monta, which, viola, we wanted to do anyway…

    And why the hell is everyone talking about us getting the #1 pick, when the nets have like 200% more of a chance than us…chances are we get lucky and go #2 or stern hates us again and we go #3.
    #3 should be cousins. Yes, he’s a project, but it’s better to have our other projects, i.e, wright and randolph, develop WITH him, rather than drafting the projected #11 pick in Wes Johnson, a guy that gets bailed out for defense with the zone and is softer, shooting version of Shawn Marion. No, Cousins can’t run, but he is pretty much a mini-version of Shaq.

    All in all you guys are way too obsessed with building this team around one player…almost like you’re afraid to lose another one…
    So please, think of it this way-if we were to build the team around two or thee players- Curry and one or two others, who would it be?

  • Whack-A-Dub

    808s pacific. EXACTLY, i was thinking the same thing.

    But why would sac want monta when they already have a 2 guard (evans)…

  • TLY

    Evan Turner had spine fractures. ???

  • deano

    Marcus: Thanks for your excellent analysis. On the Wall vs. Turner selection issue, all rookies, except James and Shaq, are suspect. So, Wall has no advatage over Turner in the suspicion department.

    As you note, there is no suspicion about Curry. He is a proven NBA point guard, and has gotten better as the season has progressed. Especially given his potential for further improvement, Curry is the safe bet as our point guard of the future.

    On the Ellis vs. Curry trade issue, it has to be Ellis who goes if we are looking (as we should) for a veteran, All-Star caliber, low-post scorer. Such a player is certainly making so much money right now that only Ellis’ $11M salary will provide the required financial parity. For examlple, Al Jefferson makes $12M.

    Yet who the Warrors draft should depend upon whom they can acquire for Ellis. If the Warriors can get a better shooting guard than center or power forward, then GSW should look to draft Cousins or Favors or some other dominant big man. On Draft Day, I hope the Warriors already have their Ellis trade deal in place.

  • “Scooter” McGavin

    Uhhhh…….Nelson “knows talent?” “TownLove”……are you kidding me?

    Nelson wouldn’t know talent if it walked up and bit him in the ass…….

    This was the same guy that was single-handedly involved in the trade that sent Mitch Richmond to Sac for the draft rights to Billy “The Next Magic Johnson” Owens…….

    Richmond went on to average 20+ppg for years running and a few All-Star berths while Owens couldn’t tell his ass from a hole in the ground……

    Nelson also was involved in the mental abuse of key past players like Tyrone Hill, later to become an All-Star with Cleveland after he left Golden State and Al Harrington, later to light the world on fire in New York for a few weeks after he left Golden State. Not to mention, isn’t Harrington the exact type of player that Nelson usually covets,…..a big that can stretch the floor?

    Nelson was single-handedly involved in the Richardson deal, the Crawford deal………and the eventual foregoing of the Pietrus and Barnes contracts…….

    Nelson don’t know shit about talent….

    Talent has come and left the Golden State Warriors…

    Players succeed only when they leave the Warriors……

    Keep Curry, trade Monta Ellis, Anthony Randolph and Andris Biedrins for a difference maker…….keep Maggette, Corey can score and fill a starting role or 6th man role if necessary, never complains, keeps himself in great shape, great example for the younger players.

    Keep B. Wright, a much more disciplined and sounder player than Anthony Randolph…keep Azubuike, a legitimate NBA scorer, …….CJ will be gone after this season as will Radmanovic.

    Not sold on Anthony Morrow………hard to put my faith in an undrafted walk-on who’s essentially a 1 dimensional player.

    Hoping and praying for rookies to rescue a doomed franchise is like dying on a cold night without a priest by your bedside to soothe and console you.

    Forget about these rookies, ……..use our marketable contracts like Biedrins and Ellis and go after a proven, NBA difference maker……..

  • TownLove

    If the Warriors get the #4 pick then they should be able to draft Cousins and keep Curry and Ellis.

    Cousins already has the low post moves that Shaq didnt develop until a few years in the NBA. The reason why Wall is able to do what he does is because Cousins is being tripled team on the low block. He will open up things for everyone. A great rebounder and a force on the low block….just what the Warriors need.

  • Whack-A-Dub

    Townlove, I agree. He’s also a very underrated passer out of the post. I don’t know why everyone thinks he’s going to be a “flop”. Looks like two years in a row we get one of the best players in the draft because everyone though he would be a “flop”.

  • deano

    Whack-a-Dub: Curry is the only Warrior around whom a team be built, because he is a developing point guard who makes his teamates better.Although Curry is the standout keeper, the current roster has other players who would thrive on a Curry-led team. Morrow, Randolph and Azubuike are the three that I would most want to keep.

  • D-Ball

    Steph Curry has not had a jump shot blocked this year and he can shoot the three, does not get injured, sees the court and passes phenomenally well. No way Wall will get those skills ever, so draft him and trade to get Cousins plus another good player is the deal. Cousins is the guy who catches my eye when Kentucky plays.

  • Whack-A-Dub

    Marcus, here’s the reason Turner will not be a flop:
    -Last year, watching UNC’s “psycho T”, I watched him, and I was like, wow, this guy is a total wimp…I didn’t like him at all, and was amazingly surprised when the media loved him and his numbers were so high. But he was injury prone. Evan Turner is not.

    The only bad thing right now is bad about Evan Turner is that I don’t know if the right atmosphere, such as Oracle, will help him succeed, and also another thing:
    -Curry is ultra-charismatic; he played for a private school and ended up upsetting multiple above average teams with a roster full of role players…but he gels well. He gels with anyone, he loves to play, he develops immediate chemistry. The most amazing thing is that when he played for Davidson, he played like everyone on the team was just as good as him.
    Here’s the situation with Turner:
    -the Buckeyes without Turner suck and he knows it. He knows why he’s the POY, and from time to time you see frustration and bad body language, though he plays his heart out and his team wins…alot(remind you of anyone?). Also notable is his 5.8apg/4.0 turnovers a game(still doesn’t remind you of anyone?)Turner is a leader, but it seems to me less like he is the kind to make his teammates better and mesh with them(like curry) and do more of dragging his team( if you haven’t figured out who I’m talking about right now, it’s Monta). No way turner is another Monta. Monta is just bad blood, I can’t believe people can’t see it. Either he goes on spurts of scoring (which have gotten longer throughout his career)and his team will rely on that spurt, or he will go though a complete drought, all while taking ill-advised shots and letting his teammates stand on the perimeter and watch. Turner is not that kind of a guy…he’s much better-he really passes well. Monta passes like the Warriors in the past two years were coached to pass in one way and one way only. Turner is an excellent and high-potenial defender. Monta doesn’t want to play defense-not like he can guard regular-sized 2′s. Turner has a very high basketball IQ and winning mentality-something only he and Curry have. Monta came right out of high school, that sums it up…Turner has a mid-range game like no other, though he has no outside shot, he shoots a very high percentage and takes good shots. Monta (I think I already covered this)takes bad shots and volume shoots when he can’t get going. Turner has NEVER done that.
    Monta was a hopeful. Turner is a franchise player. Monta played the 1 for awhile not because he is a 1, but because Baron left and Monta was undersized. Turner played the point, also because he had to, but he was also remarkably good at it.
    The point is, Turner was a hell of a player in college, and he is definitely a championship piece in the NBA.

    If you ask me, Turner and Cousins are much more solid and predictably better than Wall. I don’t think Wall will be cancer or a bad player at all, but I don’t think he will live up to #1. I think he will be good, but you need more than Wall to win(jordan being the exception).

    Turners weaknesses via scouting report:
    -3 point shot
    -low 3 point shot attempts
    -plays below the rim

    Well, about 20 years ago, this wouldn’t be a problem at all would it? It would make him potentially perfect.

  • PhilB

    Wow, what a tough call. The Warriors get so few good players that when they do get a decent one (Curry) we want to confer saint-like status on him, thus overrating him. But I’m staying on the Curry bandwagon. He’s the total package, skills and leadership ability (on and off the court). It also doesn’t hurt that the media loves him. Given the Warriors rotten history with #1 Draft picks (Joe Barry Carroll, Chris Webber, Joe Smith), I say stick with the proven talent (Curry) and get the kid some help…please!!!

  • http://YAHOO.COM Degenerate

    I got it!! Warriors FRONT OFFICE, just let us fans be the people who vote on whom to draft or trade with scenarios and options. Because you guys have messed up so much over the last 15 years!! Let us vote and choose on the product we want to see on the floor and then at least you guys can’t be accountable for once in the last 15 years!! lol =)

  • Whack-A-Dub

    One thing I just have to point out about players like Evans and Rose, and possibly Wall.
    Why is it they are considered PGs? They’re not.
    Why does Rose have Hinrich on the floor facilitating with him? Why does Evans have Udrih doing the same thing? They’re not point guards…how obvious can it be?
    Now the question whether Wall can be a true NBA PG is questionable, but I definitely think Wall will be more successful with a proven, polished facilitator next to him…he’s a PG like Rose was in college…but he’s not an NBA pg.

  • oaktownlar

    I’m in agreement with Deano and Townlove: We may already have the point guard of the decade–certainly good enough if paired with a reliable post scorer/boarder. That is a historical success in the NBA. The WORST thing that happens in that scenario is years of Stockton-to-Malone type winning. Sure, they didn’t get the ring, but they were always in contention, and Curry is already a better scorer than Stockton. The BEST that happens with Nellie-style run-and-gun small-ball is a low seed in the west and an early exit from the playoffs. That also is historical fact. Curry easily adds 5 assists (without TOs) per game by just making a competent entry pass to a decent post man. I don’t know about the draft, but the Dubs should be moving heaven and earth (Red Auerback, Jerry West, etc.) to position themselves for getting a rock solid, scoring postman. And making defenses guard the paint will also help our outside shooters!

  • Whack-A-Dub

    Especially with Cousins’ ability to pass out of the post.

  • Whack-A-Dub

    I think that now, for a couple of years, we need to do what LA did with Odom to Randolph-make him shoot 3s. Especially if we get Cousins, we need Randolph to be as focused as Odom.

  • dan

    I would not tocuh Cousins with a 20ft pole. He reminds me of Damp…his lazy, non-agrresive body…

    Draft Wall, end of discussion. You can make trades later.

  • Whack-A-Dub

    Dan, do you actually think we’re getting the 1st pick?
    Draft Turner, and possibly Cousins

  • A’s in 2010

    The Nets may have a 25% chance at #1 but that just means they have a 75% chance of dropping. The worst team got the #1 pick only TWICE since 1993. The third slot has actually been a good place to be, 3rd slot has moved up to #1 five times in that time frame, more than any other slot. Keep your fingers crossed!

  • TownLove

    I like Cousins attitude. He usually gets pissed off when he is not playing well. Never at his teammates, but usually at himself or hes messing with a crowd booing him. Atleast he cares about playing well.
    He would add some attitude to this team. Like Stephen Jackson did B4 he went crazy. What is Cousins 19? He’ll mature. IMO, the low bar for him would be Al Jefferson.

  • Bleep

    Hey MTII, what do you mean by planned foul on twitter? It certainly didn’t seem to be planned by Nelson.

    Arg. What a frustrating ending.

  • some guy

    poster 41. yup. on the TNT broadcast, you can actually hear Nellie say “CJ what are you doing?” then goes on about how they could still get the ball back with 3 seconds left in the game.

    “Obviously, it all depends on who get No. 2. But do you think the Knicks would do a sign-and-trade with David Lee for a chance at John Wall?”

    the Knicks no longer have their draft pick. Utah does (it’s unprotected).

    what the warriors really should do is see if they can’t pick up another high pick by taking back one of the horrible contracts of the bottom rung teams like Arenas’ or Brand’s or Dalembert’s or one or more of the Detroit contracts.

    the owners of teams are all losing tens of millions this year & have been forecast to lose more in the next few seasons. not having to pay a top pick’s salary along with saving on contract dollars & years would probably be very appealing. unfortunately, Cohan/Rowell would never allow that to happen to the payroll.

  • Italy 415

    LET’S JUST HOPE AND PRAY THAT THE WARRIORS CONTINUE TO LOSE AND MINN. TO WIN A COUPLE MORE GAMES.THAT WAY WE HAVE SOMETHING TO LOOK FORWARD TO THE DRAFT!!!! OH,BTW WAY WHO GIVES A SH** ABOUT NELSON’S RECORD!!!!!!!!!!!

  • Whack-A-Dub

    Dan, do you actually think we’re getting the 1st pick?
    Draft Turner, and possibly Cousins…

  • Whack-A-Dub

    Townlove. If you have bad body language about yourself, it’s called pouting. It’s not a good thing…
    but Morrow kind of has the same thing. This offseason, we need to make some big moves…really big moves.
    They announced on TNT Nellie is coming back to coach next year-hopefully Riley isn’t that stupid to let him back just because he wants to come back.

  • The wise

    If the warriors get the first pick I think they should draft Evan Turner regardless. We have Montae and curry. Curry is a baller… He can pass, shoot, and he’s only going to get better on D as time goes along. We have many trade pieces so we really don’t have to trade montae to get something good in return. We can trade Biedrins, Magette, Bell, Azuibuke, Wright, Watson,Radmanovich… Trust me we don’t necessarily have to get rid of montae. But I wouldn’t mind Having a big team adding turner to the 2, and trading montae to the pacers for granger who’s 6’9 moving him to the three and going with a starting 5 of Curry, Turner, Granger, Randolph, Biedrins. Or if we get lucky Curry, Turner, Granger, Randolph, Stoudamire.

  • The wise

    Turner averages 20-10-6 a game… C’mon son! and he fills a need. Im hopin for turner all the way.

  • Aperacer

    Turner hit a deep buzzer beater today, I’m sold we need someone who can finish a game like that!

  • Whack-A-Dub

    All I can say is that whoever goes #1 and picks John Wall out of the hype is going to regreat for YEAAAAARs to come. Wall is good, but not NBA ready. He’s going to end up like Derrick Rose or Tyreke Evans- Needing a PG to sit next to him and facilitate what he’s doing-
    While Turner, with a mid-range game that’s so advanced that even Kobe can’t shoot the % he does, will be a superstar in the league. There’s a reason he’s POY

  • Paul

    Somewhat agree Whack-A …
    Wall is NBA ready, but teams don’t ascend with ball-dominating lead guards who don’t make their teammates any better.
    He’ll put up impressive fantasy league numbers and challenge for ROY because few in the league will be able to keep him out of the lane.
    But I’d rather have a Chris Paul-Deron Williams running my team any day.
    I’ve been pining for Turner for weeks, so I consider this a no-brainer.
    The real dilemma is whom they covet if they can’t land Turner.
    Greg Monroe is the best fit for their system, but I don’t think he ever emerges as a team’s No. 1 player. Tremendously gifted, but like Garnett, not a take-charge type.
    Derrick Favors is intriguing, but he gives basically the same things Biedrins does. And the jury is out on whether he’ll develop a mid-range game, cuz all he does now is rebound and dunk.
    While DeMarcus Cousins is physically imposing, he has major maturity/work ethic issues and could easily peak as being Erick Dampier.

  • Legacy510

    Biedrins is not the answer to be the starter at the 5 position period! Turiaf is a good back up 5. I say draft Turner to play the two or three, either way he fills a need at either spot. At the two he gives us a bigger body who can guard the bigger and stronger 2 guards in the league. At the three he gives us a legitimate scoring threat.

    At that point I would package Monta for a 1st round draft pick and select Cousins.

    I like a starting team of Curry, Bell/Buike, Turner, Randolph, and Cousins. All of that of couse if we cant land Boozer or Bosh in the off season. Or a trade of Biedrins and Bell for Stoudemire.

  • Legacy510

    Bottom line is the Dubs gotta pullout all the stops this off season. Riley claimed that a player like Bosh is out of our league. Then go after Boozer hard during free agency. Get Turner and Cousins in the draft through a trade of Monta and Biedrins for a second high 1st round pick.

    Imagine a starting 5 of Curry, Turner, Randolph, Boozer, and Cousins. Watson, Bell, Morrow,Magette, Wright, and Turiaf off the bench. That sounds like a playoff contending team to me that rebounds and plays defense.

  • lobo

    as long as we have the scmucks upstairs and the ones coaching the clown act whatever the team does will be the wrong thing…..and if it turns out they get wall fatso the coach will screw with his head like he has done with everyone else on this team….i don’t know why i wasted electricity and keystrokes on this post

  • lobo

    i spelled schmucks wrong…deserving of an edit as that is the best way to describe those dopes

  • Whack-A-Dub

    Paul, yes- Turner is the only thing that isn’t fool’s gold in this draft…

    Favors will be a smaller Greg Oden that may or may not be injured…

    Wall will be another Rose/Evans that no analyst is willing to explain anything about why they can’t win or why they have to play with other point guards (Udrih and Hinrich)to facilitate…

    Monroe may be the steal of the draft…maybe trade Monta/Magette and surprise everyone by drafting him with the 6th or 7th pick. Yes, he’s talented, and he would compliment Curry very well.

    Now Cousins…his work ethic may leave his as a heavier Thabeet, so I’m not so sure…unless we had a pick that gives us Turner, then we basically have no options. We have to pick one flop or another.

    Isn’t it ironic how this year’s draft was supposed to be virtually empty because of Blake Griffin being so much better than everyone else. Yet, this class will probably be the best of the next five years.

    I say if we get multiple picks, but they are away from the area of where we can get Turner, which wuld be unlikely, I say bundle the pick, Monta and Magette, and try to go for Blake Griffin or someone that could
    be a Stockton/Malone frame for Curry. Even if we do get Turner, there is a chance that the Clippers or some team see a lot of value in Ellis and Magette, and possibly Biedrins with them as well.

    But seriously, we need Turner. Everyone else is a high-potential bust.

  • Whack-A-Dub

    Lobo, Nellie isn’t actually coming back…

    he’s leaving…right Riley?

    Where’s Larry Ellison? Was it just another Cohan decoy for us to have hope?

  • mwlx

    Lotta gamblers on this blog. Curry is a sure talent. Ellis is a sure talent. Wall has great potential, but could be a bust. No way would I tinker with our sure things to gamble on potential.

  • Paul

    My dream scenario has the W’s drafting Evan Turner, then trading Monta and a big (preferably Andris, but presumably Randolph) to Minnesota for Al Jefferson, whom the Wolves seem compelled to move because he and Kevin Love won’t work together.

  • Whack-A-Dub

    Paul, if this was youtube I would make twenty different accounts just to +1 you that many times.

    That’s exactly what we need to do, along with fire Nellie.

    Trade Monta, trade Magette, trade Biedrins. They’re all cancers. Trade them for future first round draft picks. Watch them bring down multiple teams. We get three or two lottery picks in the upcoming draft. So a solidified backcourt in Curry, Turner…i shouldn’t say solidified, that’s a championship backcourt.
    Then three lottery picks we can gamble with…whoever does bad in this tourney (preferably Greg Monroe and/or Favors) will stay, though I doubt Favors will.

    And then Harrison Barnes or Hassan Whiteside…idk

  • jsl

    Good analysis, MT. Very convincing arguments.

    And I understand why Turner; but why NOT Cousins?

  • Whack-A-Dub

    Jsl, he has a horrible work ethic. Curry has an effortless offensive game. Cousins is also effortless-as a player. He’s a no-hustle, no-work, lazy player with a high bust potential, and despite him having moves advanced for his age of 19, look at Turner at 21, who has the best all-around game I’ve seen in a long time, not to mention a mid-range game that is as advanced as Kobe’s…RIGHT NOW, if not better than he is…NOW, after 14 years in the NBA.

  • The wise

    Trade Monta, trade Magette, trade Biedrins. They’re all cancers. Trade them for future first round draft picks. Watch them bring down multiple teams. We get three or two lottery picks in the upcoming draft. So a solidified backcourt in Curry, Turner…i shouldn’t say solidified, that’s a championship backcourt.
    Then three lottery picks we can gamble with…whoever does bad in this tourney (preferably Greg Monroe and/or Favors) will stay, though I doubt Favors will.

    —————————

    Sorry but that would then make us an college team. I say trade magette and montae for granger a three with range to put alongside curry, turner, and randolph. Get what you can for beans and splash on stoudamire. But the thing with trading montae and the rest is finding teams that can soak up the salary cap.

  • Whack-A-Dub

    Sorry but that would then make us an college team. I say trade magette and montae for granger a three with range to put alongside curry, turner, and randolph. Get what you can for beans and splash on stoudamire. But the thing with trading montae and the rest is finding teams that can soak up the salary cap.

    ———————————————————

    No, it would not make us a college team. Curry and Turner are far beyond the NBA level of play. Yes, it would be hard to operate without veterans. But look at OKC. With good defense and a bunch of “college players”, they’re doing better than Brandon Roy is right now.

    And the guy that can soak up the salay cap is Jefferson, and possibly another FA…trading Monta, Magette, and Biedrins would leave us with over 30 mil of cap space, I’m pretty sure Amare would want that.

    I remember people saying not too long ago how Curry is too frail to play in the NBA, almost like he was a deformed child with a weak heart.
    Evan Turner and Stephen Curry are a hell of a backcourt nonetheless, and their basketball IQs mean a fast adjustment to the NBA.

  • earl monroe

    Wall/Turner, that sounds like a law firm

  • earl monroe

    I am thinking the Warriors trade down to get Edwin Eubilis of Siena

  • Whack-A-Dub

    Lol who the hell is Edwin Eubilis
    Oh wow, he actually exists.

  • earl monroe

    Yup, Eubilis exists, look at his numbers from last years tournament.

  • earl monroe

    You trade down a la Bill Walsh because you need more talent than one player.

  • earl monroe

    That would be Edwin Ubiles of Siena

  • Whack-A-Dub

    No, that’s okay. If we need more than one player, then we trade off someone like Monta or Biedrins for an extra pick rahter than do something Riley would do anyway

  • TownLove

    Whack-A,

    I dont understand you sayin Cousin has no work ethic when Calapari stated that he has never need a play come as far in a short period of time. Thats high praise from Calapari who has a lot of really good ‘one and done’ players.

    I wasnt impressed with Cousins in HS. But the guy has literally developed a go-to low block moves in 9 months.

    The Thabeet comparison makes no sense. Thabeet was always mostly a defensive player. Thabeet was sent to the DLeage to specifically work on his offensive nives. He never had the offense of Cousins.

    How you stop a 7’0, 270 lbs player, with offensive moves and can make freethrows. You dont.

  • Whack-A-Dub

    Townlove, the reason he doesn’t run any plays for Cousins is because Cousins is workmanlike center.
    Remember Bill Cartwright for the Bulls? He was valuable because he played off the ball.

    Cousins is shorter than Randolph but bigger, has no mid-range game, and a terrible work ethic and gets winded easily, and the thing that is alarming for someone with his size and dexterity is that he isn’t a shotblocker, in fact, he plays limited minutes because of fatigue and foul trouble.

    The point is Cousins is being seen as a high-bust player…he definitely isn’t near the level of dominance Shaq was at… Yes, he scores more, but he isn’t the wildcats’ go-to guy down the stretch or at all. If it wasn’t for Wall and Patterson playing and allowing him to work under the water, Cousins would probably stay for another 3 years or so…but Cousins lack of a fullcourt game just solidifies that he won’t be as valuable as underrated players like Monroe or Turner that this organization needs so badly.

  • The wise

    Monroe is a beast. 23-16-8 average.smh

  • The wise

    What makes that stat line even more intriguing is the fact that college quarters arn’e as long as the pros. So he’s putting up numbers like that in short time.

  • Whack-A-Dub

    The Wise, I agree. I wish we had multiple picks.
    We should draft Turner, then wait to see who the lose are in the free agency and then try a trade for Monroe or Cousins. This draft is like a gold mine. So many skilled players in one draft. I’m pretty sure Cousins or
    Solomon Alabi will be flops, yet Cousins is fired up in the tourney so far, and the main reason UK is winning.

    In fact, if this continues and Turner and the buckeye keep winning, I think it may be possible for Wall to drop to the #3 pick overall. We don’t need John Wall.
    Even if we do get the 1st pick, we should just draft Turner. There is no point in buying into the hype that wouldn’t do well without Cousins anyway.

  • The wise

    Yea if we don’t get turner, I’d like to see us take a look at wesley johnon also. He’s long can shoot and runs the floor at a nellie tempo. On the W’s we lack a true 3. Im sorry but maggette is not a 3, and he’s a ball hog. I wouldn’t be upset if montae stays but Magette and beans nearly have to go in my mind. And if we get rid of those 2 contracts it should be easy to sign amare, we’re set at pf with wright and randolph and turiaf at backup C so the whole cousins and monroe thing doesn’t seem like that big of a need. I just want a real 3 who can shoot and play team ball. And don’t forget the t wolves want to move al jefferson badly. Maggete and biendrins maybe enough to get it done.

  • jsl

    Whack and Town: I’ve not seen a ton of Cousins, but what I HAVE seen is VERY impressive. If he’s a head case, I wouldn’t want him. But he’s got so much dexterity and athleticism it’s hard to see him as a potential bust.

    But, I’ll defer to those who’ve seen him more than a coupla games.

    Now, why has Adlrich’s stock dropped? That kid looks like a demon on defense — a HUGE Warrior need. And he seems to be pretty smart, too. Could be a nice fit working with Curry.

    Any thoughts, Whack, Town or others?

  • Whack-A-Dub

    Haha, that’s hilarious. Drafting Johnson would be the worst move this organization can make, especially with a high pick. We are obviouly going to get rid of Magette.
    Lol, we need a big time presence down low, and none of our bigs fit that role at all. Calling Biedrins, Wright, and Randolph a legit frontcourt is like putting Dirk Nowitzki in a bout against Floyd Mayweather.

    There is a reason Cousins is projected 3rd overall- he is 6-11 270, and very dominant.

    There is also a reason Wes Johnson ha only been mentioned by you in this whole thread.
    He doesn’t rebound even for his insane length. He doesn’t defend well one on one. He doesn’t have a mid-range game. That sums up all our bigs and Wes Johnson.

    Seriously, not drafting Cousins or Monroe because we have too many “bigs” is like the Rocket not drafting Olajuwon because they had Ralph Sampson.

    Drafting Wes Johnson is an even stupider idea for a team that already doesn’t play any defense and has had oversized shooters over the years.

    Thank god you’re not our GM…try watching college basketball, maybe you’ll learn that Johnson is an inactive, lazy player with a horrible upside, and will probably be the oldest in the draft.

    Meanwhile Cousins is 19 and has some moves that Shaq didn’t have until he learned to utilize hi strength.
    He is a rebounding machine, but with a bad work ethic could be a flop. But he is what we need-a big man. A real big man, not the sub 200lb randolph or wright, or the soft, unwilling Biedrins.

    And Turner’ mid-range game and scoring ability is so advanced I don’t think Kobe has some of the moves he has. Not to mention his dominant rebounding ability and defensive ability.

    Monroe is a flexible, running PF that can rebound and score well. His fluidity, coachability, baketball IQ, and versatility in terms of the fact that he can shoot make him a very underrated prospect, not to mention he has a great upside at 19 years old, meaning he ha not grown into his frame yet.

    Again, draft Turner and then trade for Cousins or monroe, maybe both…then use the money to sign an FA whether it be Amar’e or Granger, whatever.

    But Turner is a must, Wall is an untouchable on draft day unless we now some team would want to buy into the hype.

    Then Cousins and Monroe should fall into our hands as teams want Ellis/Magette/Biedrins…

  • Whack-A-Dub

    Re:Jsl

    Well, Cousins is good, but for some reason, they don’t run any plays for him. It’s really odd that it’s Wall’s choice to get him the ball if he ever gets it in the post. With Cousins’ quickness, footwork, and dexterity, he should be raved about being a polished player. But he’s not. If you watch Cousins compared to Shaq in LSU, he was assertive and posseive of the game, and as a freshman at 18 years old, naturally had the sense to take over the game. Now look at Cousins. At 19, he still hasn’t found his role on the team. He knows when his teammates need him to score, but he is not nearly as much of a furbished scorer as Shaq was. In LSU, people would try everything they could to stop Shaq when he started to get rolling. And he knew it, yet he knew how to adjust. It’ just some things as a big man- intesity and dominance- that Cousins does not have. Scouts see him as sort of a childish player because they believe that even with his ability, he has not taken full advantage of what he can do.

    As for Aldrich, I asked myself the same thing: why is he becoming so invaluable? It’ because he is
    a)21 and therefore has filled most of his frame
    b)NBA bigs are expected to improve their game year y year, and he has not done that.
    c)He is best as a role player: while people are going crazy over Cousins having too much of a limited role, Aldrich is playing in his role. He’s not a go-to scorer, he’s a pick-up C, and that kind of player isn’t what you would want in the lottery, where crappy teams like Philidelphia and Detriot badly need a centerpiece to rebuild on…

    Jannero Pargo is a good example: He was a talented player that ended up a role player. Same with JJ redick.

  • The wise

    Naw I just believe we can trade for a big or sign one in free agency. And if we did go for a big I’d take monroe over cousin because he works harder, and he’s a beast.

  • Whack-A-Dub

    The Wise, thumbs up.

    But draft Turner if we get the 1st pick, everyone who saw the UK/Mississippi game knows bledsoe and patterson are the reasons UK won.

  • Jeremy

    Spot on here MTII. Turner is a much better fit for the Warriors. If the Warriors got Lee or Jefferson + Turner and Azubuike back at full strength the turnaround would be swift.

    Since usually the Warriors have the worst luck possible, they’ll probably end up at 6 in a perceived 5 player draft. If that’s the case, I’d love Ed Davis to come to Golden State.

  • deano

    After watching yesterday’s Kentucky – Miss. State game, I am even more sure that MTII is right about cashing in on the John Wall hype — if we get that lucky. The Cousins – Vanardo match-up was interesting. Cousins looked better at the end, but he played only 26 minutes compared to V’s 40.

  • Whack-A-Dub

    Deano, are you retarded? If you really matched Miss st. and UK, you would realize bledsoe, patterson, and cousins are the main reason UK wins-the role players.
    Whereas what Turner is winning with is phenomenal. It’s almost as bad as what Curry had yet Turner is killing in the big 10. Kentucky is such a vulnerable team it’s sad. If Wall did not have Cousins and Cousins did not have Wall, they would both suck.

    Turner is so underrated that it’s not even funny that MTII is talking about “cashing in” on the next raw, overhyped physically dominant player with no fundamentals and no coachability

  • mz

    Wall has not shown yet that he is the next Lebron. The dude is averaging 16.5 PPG on 45% shooting in college, EXACTLY what Steph is doing as a ROOKIE IN THE NBA. (Steph only averaged 21, 25 and 29 his three years in college, btw.) Wake up and stop drinking the John Wall koolaid. The Ws already have 2 exceptional guards in Monta and Steph, only the best statistical backcourt in the NBA, and Curry is turning heads so much that he may end up even money to be rookie of the year. You cannot teach the kind of court sense and vision he has, and if they are going to have the chance, trade down for Turner or better yet, Cousins…the Ws problem is not at the 1, 2 and 3. With Curry, Ellis, Morrow, Watson, Azuibuke and Maggette (yes Maggette should be a three and would be for any other coach than Don Nelson) the Ws are fine at the smalls. What they have is a very good # 2 center in Turiaf, a #1 center with the worst touch in the league and two underachieving, overhyped, rail thin and injury prone fours. Trade for Cousins and sign and trade for David Lee or get Al Jefferson in a sign and trade and Turner, get a decent coach, and, oh while you are at it, sell the team to Ellison, and the long national nightmare will be over.

  • slimman

    This is what Warriors fans are reduced to by March; pipe dreams of winning the draft lottery. I’d trade the whole team and the next 5 years draft picks for a new owner.

    That said, why draft a PG if you have one? If they are lucky enough to win the ping-pong then trade Wall to NJ or Min for Lopez/Jefferson and their pick, then take Turner or Cousins. If it is Turner, then look to move Monta for some beef at the 4 who can score. Next, get rid of the Magette contract, which will likely cost a good cheap player. congratulations, you have a team that can make it to but not through the first round of the playoffs, which is a start. Sadly, as long as those assclowns Cohan and Rowell are around none of this matters.

  • PJ

    Nice piece by Marcus Thompson. In contrast here is a look at some of the recent schizophrenic thinking from Kawakami on the backcourt and last years draft:

    In his most recent article he declared Stephen Curry a future all-star. Nevermind that he ripped the Warriors for drafting Curry because he “can’t play with Ellis.” And not just during the draft but quite recently. He also declared that Jru Holliday was THE player to pair with Monta Ellis. When Holliday started looking like a bust Kawakami began the, ‘injuries don’t matter – Monta Ellis is not that good’ and needs to be traded for Kirk Heinrich campaign:

    “Just last summer I proposed many alternatives for their draft pick, the main trick of it trying to find the right mix of talent with Monta Ellis, if he was the team centerpiece. It aint easy and I admit that I don’t think any of us quite got that one right, including the Great Rowell.”
    http://blogs.mercurynews.com/kawakami/2010/02/10/if-cohans-prepping-for-a-sale-is-ellison-virtually-the-warriors-shadow-owner-now/

    Monta Ellis’ peripheral stats, spelled out (B-A-D)Posted by Tim Kawakami on January 26th, 2010 at 2:08 pm | Categorized as NBA, Warriors
    “…The Warriors are going to have to split the Ellis/Curry backcourt at some point. I’d hope they realized that from the beginning, but I know they didn’t…Anyway, back to Ellis: You can argue that he’s fun to watch, but you cannot argue that he is a dominant player in any way the actually leads to the Warriors winning games this season. 1) They need to pick between Ellis and Curry because that backcourt does not work in the real world, only in Don Nelson’s imagination. 2) Ellis’ evident talents have not translated to the Warriors being any better when he’s out there, as opposed to Name Your D-Leaguer….”
    http://blogs.mercurynews.com/kawakami/2010/01/26/monta-ellis-peripheral-stats-spelled-out-b-a-d/

    Yes, the Warriors should trade Monta Ellis (but I doubt they will)
    Posted by Tim Kawakami on February 14th, 2010 at 10:28 am Categorized as NBA, Warriors
    “…The Warriors would be much better served to keep Curry and find a way to land a big guard who could move without the ball and defend top-flight perimeter scorers. They’d have a lot better mix. They’d have better chemistry. They’d highlight and emphasize their strengths, instead of jamming similar players together in the frenzied desire to sell tickets….From the day they drafted Curry, I’ve thought that Curry and Ellis were too similar physically and stylistically (both need the ball in their hands) to work well together….”
    http://blogs.mercurynews.com/kawakami/2010/02/14/yes-the-warriors-should-trade-monta-ellis-but-i-doubt-they-will/

    Where might Monta Ellis end up? Let’s scour the field: Philly, Miami, Memphis…Posted by Tim Kawakami on November 18th, 2009 at 9:54 pm | Categorized as NBA, Warriors ”
    “…1. PHILADELPHIA: Either for Samuel Dalembert straight up (UNLIKELY) or for a package including Jrue Holiday, Thaddeus Young and salary filler (or Louis Williams)….
    …2. MIAMI:The Heat could offer Quentin Richardson’s expiring $9.4M contract. …
    …3. CHICAGO: Straight up for Kirk Hinrich…”
    http://blogs.mercurynews.com/kawakami/2009/11/18/where-might-monta-ellis-end-up-let-me-take-a-few-wild-guesses-philly-miami-memphis/

    Warriors draft: The case for Jrue Holiday (final argument)
    POSTED BY TIM KAWAKAMI ON JUNE 25TH, 2009 AT 7:35 AM | CATEGORIZED AS AT-LARGE
    “* Best option: UCLA G Jrue Holiday, who is the final case.
    A team that wants to get better wants a tall PG like Holiday (6-3, with Ben Howland-coached toughness), who has a lot of room to grown, who likes to play defense, and who could lead a team in a year or two. Kind of like Russell Westbrook last year, who was the off-guard with Collison at UCLA, left school early, and zoomed to the fourth pick, taken by Oklahoma City, and is now a potential future star PG. Let me expand on the way I put it in the column:
    -Other than No. 1 pick Blake Griffin and possibly Ricky Rubio, Holiday is the player in this draft who fits best both with the Warriors’ current Nelson/Ellis power base (because Holiday can defend 2-guards Ellis can’t and can run the point alonside Ellis if Ellis will let him);”
    http://blogs.mercurynews.com/kawakami/2009/06/25/warriors-draft-the-case-for-jrue-holiday-final-argument/

  • Whack-A-Dub

    Why do we even have cohan or rowell…why is stern letting them be owners of a franchise that is the definiton of a faliure. No all-star in a decade. One playoff appearance in 16 years. it’s your f*cking team, Stern. F*cking do something about it.

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